Time to call out shit parenting!

You’re right it isn’t in the curriculum to teach children how to brush their teeth, however, it is in the EYFS (birth - reception) to promote good oral hygiene. There have been schemes for years in early years for educators to brush the children’s teeth or encourage them to brush their own.

It is definitely poor parenting (I would say it’s also neglect) for a parent to not be brushing their child’s teeth and letting their teeth rot.

As a nursery teacher, I 100% don’t mind the added extra of brushing children’s teeth because it benefits the child and it’s not their fault they have a lazy parent. I was neglected as a child myself and now not only struggle with tooth ache and having lots of decay but also just the routine of remembering to brush my teeth is hard some days due to it just not being part of my day growing up. If I can contribute to a child not growing up with poor dental heath like myself, I am all for it!

but in a country where the most common cause for a child 5 to 9 to need a hospital stay is tooth decay , the most common reason for that is poor dietary choices .

@Lollygaggle informative post, agree with this.

Tooth decay is the number one reason for a young child to need a hospital visit , it outnumbers everything else.

Couple this with 98% of dental treatment is avoidable. https://www.who.int/news-room/fact-sheets/detail/oral-health

The problem is the child who has teeth out at a young age tends to be the child who goes on to have more and more treatment and becomes the child who has teeth out at 8, 12 and becomes the phobic adult. Early tooth decay is the most reliable predictor of poor oral health in adult life https://www.nature.com/articles/sj.bdj.2013.533

Although tooth brushing does appear to help a bit , studies in Scotland and Wales where there is supervised brushing appears to show this https://www.nature.com/articles/s41407-020-0285-1

However since lockdown snacking has increased amongst adults and children, the average child in the U.K. eats 8 times a day and both adults and children grossly exceed the recommended daily sugar intake. https://www.news-medical.net/news/20220502/British-childrens-sugar-intake-exceeds-current-public-health-recommendations.aspx

These sugar choices are not limited to those in deprived groups , the vast majority of children and adults in the U.K. eat too much sugar. I have taken teeth out on both children from deprived families and those from the muesli belt who have fruit juice, honey , agave syrup and home made flapjacks .

Toothbrushing helps , early dental intervention helps , but for the vast majority of children (and adults) their diet and the way they eat needs to drastically change .

Unfortunately the statistics and experience shows that most people are unable to make these changes and , instead, accept that dental interventions are a normal way of life because they and their parents had “weak teeth” or decay is “genetic” . There are some rare syndromes and uncommon reasons for “weak teeth” , there are problems like reflux or SEN , but in a country where the most common cause for a child 5 to 9 to need a hospital stay is tooth decay , the most common reason for that is poor dietary choices .

Tooth decay is not something a dentist or government can control. It is controlled in the hundreds of choices adults make everyday at home . We need not only tooth brushing programmes , we need better information and programmes on healthy eating not only for teeth , but for 2/3 rds of U.K. adults who are overweight or obese. https://researchbriefings.files.parliament.uk/documents/SN03336/SN03336.pdf

Desensitisation, visuals, great specialist teachers who do tooth brushing modules at school, specialist dentists, parents given advice about when and how to restrain.

The other poster saying it was 'part of the problem' is being really unfair. I'm not sure people are aware how much you can hurt your children if you restrain incorrectly.

I know SEN is a tiny part of the tooth brushing issue but I hope the 'no excuses' brigade have a think about what some parents are required to do and that it really isn't a one size fits all solution.

It's really not part of the problem. In cases of significant disability there's a proper balancing act of best interests that needs professional support. Until you're in that situation yourself, you just don't know what it's like.

I can never fathom parents who say "they won't drink water". They do if they are thirsty but they won't if you start offering squash and juice from a very early age because they aren't drinking gallons of water. Mine happily drink water as teens and I didn't fuss if they hadn't finished their water as babies like some Mum's did because they also get water from food and milk. The only time I ever worried was after d&v bugs but they understood that when they were ill they might get a nicer drink and then when better back to water.

Also the teeth brushing is surely just a habit you build from the very start. I can remember my dd being very resistant and I had to assist with teeth cleaning for years, in fact I still check now as she seems to hate it. ....she does it though.

This thread (and some others) is actually making me really glad the new changes are coming in next month and I'll be out of this bizarre and angry loop of apparently perfect parents refusing to listen to experiences of others and preferring to stamp on them to "win". I've thought for a while it was bots responding but either way it's not worth head space on a forum that is meant to be a supportive environment for women and parents. I've just posted about Reddit being a quagmire for hyper-aggression and here we are...

This attitude is part of the problem. If you make excuses every time a challenge comes up there will never be a solution.

That does sound incredibly difficult, and yes, in those circumstances, especially as the child becomes older and stronger, forcing tooth-brushing would be potentially dangerous. In that situation, all parents can do is eliminate sugar from their child's diet entirely to reduce the risk of tooth decay.

I'm glad you have a good specialist dentist- I hope other parents in the same position are signposted towards this service.

We have severely disabled kids and we do hold their arms but I know other children in our community where it wouldn't be safe or physically possible for the mum to restrain them like that, so what I'm trying to say it's not just the severity of SEN, it's the individual.

Those children are non verbal and highly volatile. I guess it could maybe be done with several adults doing a full floor restraint and clamping the head and prising the jaw open, but there's always the chance that the distress could make them bite their tongue badly etc (common). Also floor restraints like that are extremely traumatic and I imagine not recommended for tooth brushing.

Our specialist dentist is very good and helped us build up tolerance (I.e. suggested brushing for just a few seconds once a day at first then building it up with visual symbols) and we have just got lucky with our children's teeth. The dentist also flourides the teeth and does multiple procedures under general anaesthetic apparently.

Yes, my sister (and I, when I babysat) did used to have to prise my niece's jaws open. It was horrible, but tooth decay would have been a lot worse for her.

What do you do then if they clamp their mouth shut, run away and flail around dangerously hitting themselves and others?

Do you prise their jaws open? Because that's quite different to holding their arms...

This is crazy!! Surely that constitutes as neglect!?

It’s completely ridiculous.

In an already jam-packed curriculum, when exactly am I going to find time to brush 30 children’s teeth?!? We do already teach about the importance of a healthy lifestyle, oral health and exercise in our RHE lessons. I agree it’s definitely important to teach children these messages which they may not receive at home, but to actually take over the parents role and brush their child’s teeth for them?! Bonkers.

I actually despair at the state of education right now. I can’t help but wonder what it’s going to be like 10/20/30 years from now. I think I need a new career🤣

I'm A 70s kid and we used to have people (not sure who) coming in to primary school to talk to us about teeth cleaning.

One time we were even given a toothbrush and a tube of toothpaste to take home. So exciting!

There were also lots of posters in health centres etc promoting tooth brushing.

So to an extent I agree that lazy parents should get off arses , but also think that educaction in schools is not just the 3Rs and should include some health education too.

We also had a school dentist in the 70s. Hated the school dentist but it did make sure that all the kids got seen before things got out of hand.

Try literally finding an NHS dentist.

Well fair enough, my dad would not of given a fuck if I tried saying I didn't like water as a kid no way he would of wasted money on fruit shoots. He'd probably say to that you give them the option to not like water how can you not like something tasteless.

*Disclaimer this is what he would say not me
**Another disclaimer exceptions for special needs kids because people always bring that up whenever someone says stuff like this

Erm tried finding one lately?

We used to have a school dentist

Many have their books full and don't take on new patients though

Erm...they literally do with the NHS

There must be hereditary reasons that some people have weaker teeth too.

There are. My mum had all her teeth removed when she was 21. My brother didn’t have a single filling at that age. Fortunately both of us inherited the good teeth gene from my dad.

In an ideal world children would have free dental appointments where these issues would be picked up on and dealt with

Lots of people dont like water. I hate water. My kids are too old for fruit shoots but drink capri suns, coke, fanta etc. But they brush their teeth and the dentist is happy, so thats all that matters

I don’t believe it’s quite as simple as perfect parents raise children with perfect teeth though.

^
Well....no???