Gentle Parenting has failed, lets accept this.

Some kids respond to different things.
My grandfather used to clip me round the ear when I was purposefully rude, or if I said really awful things to my siblings (as I'm sure there were and still are many teenage girls/boys who did so).

Was he being violent no, he was signalling that my behaviour was unacceptable. Could he have done it with a look, maybe. Did the message come across, yes.

Did I then think hitting other people was ok.... No I didn't.

Was my grandfather evil and therefore require a visit from social and perhaps to have me removed from his care (I suppose that is the implication of social services, it may not be and if it isn't then my apologies) I really don't think so.

Hitting any child, let alone your own flesh and blood is SO unbelievably wrong.
I can’t believe we still consider this a reasonable punishment. Should have been illegal for a very long time. What are you teaching a child by hitting them? That hitting is acceptable? That if someone does wrong by them it’s ok for them to hit?

It’s disgusting and anyone that thinks otherwise is deluded. AND anyone that does hit their own flesh and blood should have a visit from social services

Children can be well behaved without being smacked. I think there are many reasons for why some children are out of control and not being smacked isn’t one of those reasons.

Smacking is definitely not the answer, there is a happy medium!
my own opinion is that I think society has become very insular. Once people find their tribe they are often just not very inclusive or interested in others. I feel there’s a general lack of empathy around, and I feel teaching kids to think of others outside of family is crucial.
It’s also ok to get irritated and explain why, or make mistakes and then own them and apologise. How else do kids learn to own their mistakes and apologise? I know families who don’t have a strict bedtime for example. Thats non negotiable for us. It’s quite complicated but ultimately boundaries make kids feel safer.

If you're close enough to smack a toddler, you are also close enough to move them away with a firm no. No smacking necessary.

You can also use a fire guard.

I have 5 children ages 13-3 and I have never smacked them, ever! 3 of my children are on the spectrum to varying degrees and (if I do say so myself) they are impeccably behaved. They are well mannered kids, maybe slightly entitled at times, but they respect my word as final because I don't make idle threats or false promises. I treat each child as an individual and tailor my expectations to their needs. I do lose my rag and raise my voice at times and I wish I didn't. Gentle parenting is lazy and smacking is abuse.

All those smacking their children, surely if you do it more than once then it proves hitting does not work

How many times do you need to hit your children till they learn the lesson you want them to learn

Children usually don't mind rules if they know why they are there. If you tell children they mustn't do something, it helps if they know why.

I think it best not to have too many rules. Children have to know what is important in life. For mem the most important thing was to tell the truth. So long as they told the truth, everything else was a mistake. They were only punished if they lied, and it wasn't corporal either. Would you let a giant of a man hit you? Children just think they can do that to others smaller than them. New mothers can cultivate a look. Children actually don't like to hurt their mothers, hard as that is to believe.

You only have to study their faces and know if they are telling the truth, and you can get them to believe you can read their minds when they are young. I also took an interest in whatever their passing fancy was, and bought them books on the subject. Books help children with their manners as well as right and wrong, books that they don't have to take back to the library and can stay and be read again, give inspiration.

When we went shopping, they could choose how to spend any money left over, either sweets or a book. It was always a book. Feeds their minds.

My children were far from angels. They had their moments, but they didn't last.

Why is the child near the open fire? Why is there no fire guard; why are the parents not removing the child from the hazard?

The "tap" (hitting your child; let's call it what it is) doesn't help because the fault is with the parents for letting the child near an open fire when they're too young to understand the dangers.

You can't reason with some adults either, shall we go round thumping anyone we perceive is wronging us and won't be told to stop? Yes in a fantasy world I would love to do this to the obnoxious gobshites in society but in the real world I have to conform to civilised behaviour.

OP I was that child. My mother preferred my brother (Irish catholic family where boys more favoured) and I discovered if I was nice I didn't exist so I was a little s**t instead and she did notice me but not in a good way. Fast forward 20 or so years, when I had my own children, and I found being really strict with them helped - I had to as I had 4 in 4 years. I never administered corporal punishment unless it was absolutely the last resort. My daughter was an angel compared to the boys eg one of them, never admitted to this day, set a fire in the bedroom, managed to put it out and has never been admitted to who did it. I have my suspicions but couldn't prove anything. They were grounded after I went ballistic at them and explained why it should never have happened. The matches were in a cupboard so high that I had to stand on a stool to stand on the work top to reach them. One of them was a pyromaniac I have just never found out which one.

For goodness sake. This isn't about Gentle Parenting, this is permissive, absent, detached parenting. Children raised with true gentle methods grow up learning boundaries, respect, empathy and social responsibility. You don't have to use punitive discipline to get children to behave properly, nor do you need to make them fear adults.

My opinion, if the child is old enough to have a conversation there is no longer any reason to smack them. But a tap on the hand and a firm no when little to prevent danger I can't see anything wrong with TBF the process works even if the 'smack' is hardly felt.... I believe that studies saying it causes harm are not distinguishing between what's actually happening.

Eg toddler & open fire
What would actually harm the child more mentally
a) A tap on the hand and a firm NO
b) A spanking
c) Screaming at the child every time they go near
d) Explaining why it's wrong every time
I think most would say b & c are wrong but the reason I'd choose a over d is I think it's more likely to work quickly and less abusive. My opinion very young children are not mature enough to assess things the way they would just 1/2 years later and are far more likely to remember mummy or daddy always being sad or angry purely because it will be a slower process so will effect the MH of a child.

Please learn what gentle parenting actually is.

Never ver have I considered hurting my children… I have never smacked, tapped or hit them!

I was hit by my Mum as a child often for no actual reason at all, and it is one of the many reasons why I was happy that she was not a part of my adult life!

If you teach children that violence is a way to get people to conform to your wishes, or to get what you want I think that you are creating a toxic environment.

My daughters are lovely and have good strong morals!

My DH and I achieved this through setting a good example to them of appropriate and kind behaviour, never losing our temper with them and through talking to them!

When we did punish them for poor behaviour as younger children, we set out clearly what the punishment was and stuck to the rules of the punishment.

We also made sure we praised positive behaviour and incentivised it!

People forget that rewards have a big impact on behaviour, not just punishments!

Erm, no it doesn’t change. I have an 8 year old. Never crossed my mind to smack him. Had firm boundaries since he was little, not afraid to say no. But there is no other situation where the acceptable answer to dealing with another human is to knock them about. Why on earth would it be for a child?

I really wonder what is wrong with people who think like you.

You don't need to hit children but you do need to provide clear boundaries and this includes with socializing, feeding and toileting. Gentle parenting is a joke and school staff are paying the price with under-socialized children who can't cope in social settings. It's one of the reasons schools struggle to recruit when staff are being hurt daily by children who can't cope with the word no.

Anybody who is against smacking on principle is often a terrible parent who sets no boundaries for their children, who are all awful selfish kids. Of course not everyone, but it usually works that way.

Of course you've added the "not everyone" caveat, because it gives you a get out of jail free card to peddle this bullshit and then say "oh but you're the exception" when people prove you wrong.

DD10 came to me unprompted yesterday and said "I'm sorry, I thought about disobeying what you said and putting the TV back on, but I know that would have broken your trust in me. I've come to say sorry for wanting to do it". I gave her a big hug, thanked her for her honesty and told her I was proud of her for thinking about the trust between us and making an appropriate decision, and not to be sorry for thinking or wanting to do things.

We aren't an exception; the vast majority of truly gently-parented children are able to communicate their feelings and reasoning in this way once they reach a certain age, and they think through the consequences of their actions, and make a decision on the basis of this - not "if I do this mum/dad will hit me".

But yes, that's my awful selfish kid who I've raised with no boundaries because I'm a terrible parent.

Violence is a sign of incompetence.

Gentle parenting and a lack of boundaries are not the same. It’s simply one of many parenting approaches that these parents chose to follow, and it didn’t work out for them. No one forced them to adopt it. The issue isn’t gentle parenting itself, but how they applied it.

That's what I thought too, I thought gentle parenting was about not using negative language or saying no.

Terrifying someone with violence doesn't improve their behavoiur.

Anybody who is against smacking on principle is often a terrible parent who sets no boundaries for their children, who are all awful selfish kids. Of course not everyone, but it usually works that way.

Anyone who smacks their children is often a terrible parent who allows their temper free rein and hurts and terrorises their children, who are ruled by fear and end up with serious mental health issues.

See how silly you sound? Only the issue is that the research overwhelmingly supports the outcomes as described in paragraph 2.

Also it not instant results - your building them up to be a well rounded adult. It doesn’t mean that because you once acknowledged their feeling and didn’t smack them when you normally would have done they suddenly become perfect. No you are teaching life skills and the effort you put in gradually shows up.