Gentle Parenting has failed, lets accept this.

So your solution for a child that hits, to teach them that hitting is wrong, is to… hit them back?

You don’t see the issue with that? Really?

FFS permissive parenting and gentle parenting are NOT THE SAME THING.

In fact they are polar opposites in many ways. Permissive parenting is easy because you just passively take the path of least resistance every time.

Gentle parenting is extremely proactive and includes strict enforcement of boundaries.

Unsurprisingly they produce very different results.

In my long career or working with children, I can hand on heart telling you that some of the worst behaved children are from homes where a "quick slap" is the norm. They're the children who don't learn how to manage emotions or deal with frustration constructively because they have learned that these are problems best solved by lashing out.

I’m more a gentle parent with a 5 and 8 yr old and I could never imagining hitting them. With gentle parent you don’t need to reason with them, the rules aren’t up for debate. You need to explaint them but that doesn’t given changing your mind on them.

You can't reason with them because their brains have not developed. Hitting them is not going to result in their brains suddenly developing, it will just result in them fearing being hit again. Try coming from a place of understanding. That doesn't mean poor behaviour is tolerated

Rape within a marriage was also legal, does that mean it was OK until 1991 and only people who were raped after that should be upset?

Thankfully I live somewhere where smacking is totally illegal. England will follow Scotland and Wales soon enough, then what will you do?

I don't understand how hitting kids is meant to make them learn good behaviour. I think evidence is - and my own anecdotal from being a Gen-X - is it makes you avoid punishment.

But you probably come at this differently than me anyway as I don't particularly value obedience in adults or children. So training them to 'do as I say' isn't something I am looking for. I am looking for them to consider the impact on themselves and others of their behaviour and to learn good sense, judgement and empathy.

Totally agree... my Husband and I never hit our son (7) or his 2 older late teen children. Our home is full of laughter and silliness... however there is a healthy respect and discipline there with all 3.
Because we don't tolerate bad behaviour or rudeness.

My Friends children tell their teachers to shut up and scream in their faces. Mocking them.
My friend says they are obviously trying to communicate something is wrong at school..... I say if they were mine their world would get extremely small extremely quick.

A feel a good voice and stare is all that's needed absolutely no physical aggression. She says her kids are being kids, free expression and all that i say I refuse to be around them alone where i can't openly deny them to others!

If the parents are arseholes the children usually follow suit.

unfortunately the uk society isnt invested in supporting families to get the ground work right when the kids are small. And these things then snowball.

you mr friends child has learnt how to get attention and be the boss through negative reinforcement. That’s not gentle parenting.

but hurting a child who is dependent on you because you can’t control your temper? Disgusting behaviour that will instruct them that you’re not a safe person, they’re not safe in your presence and they should imitate you with others to feel powerful.

as its said time and time again on here: you’re talking about the consequences of absent/bad parenting, not gentle parenting.

I suggest you google spanking and discipline and look at some of the results. There is something deeply problematic about physical punishment - it's always humiliating for the recipent for a start, and humiliation is always damaging.

Why stop at hitting children? If I find your behaviour unacceptable, can I give you a good slap ?

I think gentle parenting has a bad name. I don't profess to follow it , but the basic tenets seem to be respecting your child as a person and explaining this rather than draconian "because I said so". Which doesn't sound too bad to me. Your friend e.g removing electronic devices doesnt sound like gentle parenting as I understand it, as that doesn't correspond to the behaviour.

I don't believe in smacking, they are smaller and weaker than me, why should this mean I get to hit them to get my way? Should my husband be able to smack me?

And yes mine are right in your stated age range (and one the stubbornest creature alive) - I've lost my temper and shouted or left the room clenching my teeth, but hitting seems a bridge too far. Surely there's a middle ground between letting them run wild and ruling by fear

Gentle parenting doesn't even deserve to be called parenting.

You can have firm boundaries and consistent consequences and high expectations of behaviour without smacking children. Smacking should be illegal (as it is where i am) but children should be expected to behave well and treat others with respect. Smacking is not the way to achieve this.

I am shocked by some of the behaviour I see from children and how ineffective their parents are. I have even see parents apologise to their children when their children have pushed them because they were in their children's way! Children refuse to leave a party or other fun activity and the parents spend ages flapping around trying to persuade them rather than counting to 3 and then picking them up and carrying them out.

Er, plenty of people have never smacked their children.

Your 'friend' isn't a gentle parent, gentle parenting just means not using fear, shame and aggression to get children to submit. Children still need boundaries and leadership.

I follow brat buster parenting on Instagram and it sounds awful but a LOT of what she talks about is actually gentle parenting. No shouting and smacking - just strong leadership, lots of positive interactions etc. She has amazing tips if you actually want to help your friend.

I would say you clearly are because no level-headed adult would think that smacking a defenseless child is anything but abhorrent.

Smacking has absolutely nothing to do with discipline and everything to do with controlling via fear. There is a wealth of research showing that children who are smacked are actually more likely to become involved in crime and anti-social behaviours. As for citing Venerable and Thompson in relation to smacking, it was well-documented that both boys grew up in chaotic households where physical violence was the norm.

Smacking does not work, is not effective, and is a marker of shitty parenting. If you hit your spouse, you'd rightly be arrested so why would you think it acceptable to hit a child?

Forget the term gentle parenting. Parents who set no boundaries raise children that are out of control. Parents who don't want to put in the effort engaging with their child and rely on screens to do the parenting also have children that struggle with behaviour. Parents who raise children through fear by either hitting them or shouting at them when they do not meet their standards raise children who often grow upto be anxious adults and sometimes struggle with forming normal relationships.

Parenting involves setting boundaries, accepting it is normal for your child not to agree with every decision you make but making it for their benefit. It involves engaging with your child from the start. Sometimes you do lose your cool as children can be difficult and challenge you - when this happens, you apologise and reflect on how you can improve next time.

I am far from perfect, have definitely lost my cool with my children on occasion but cannot possibly imagine hitting them when this happens - and the oldest is over 8 OP.

@Zod666 how are you defining “gentle parenting”?

It sounds like you think “normal parenting” is hitting your child and “gentle parenting” is everything else. Is that your definition?

I would argue that

• “permissive parenting” is no punishments or consequences (eg toy gets broken - so what - buy another one)
• “gentle parenting” is natural consequences only (eg if a toy gets broken, the child no longer has that toy, or has to help fix it)
• “strict parenting” is rules and punishment unrelated to the transgression (eg trip to park is cancelled if toy gets broken)
• “corporal punishment” is hitting a child to discipline them (you broke the toy, I’ll cause you pain)

Well in that case they won't respond to a gentle slap either?

I'm not sure why you're so adamant that children must be hit, but it's strange.

Your friends child is receiving consequences for his bad behaviour. Probably consequences he finds more inconvenient than a gentle slap. Unless you think your friend should be severely injuring her child, I'm not sure what you think would change here.

Your friend is having a hard time with her child's behaviour. This is probably a time she could do with some kindness and support from you, rather than you advocating that she assaults her child

I would not say that gentle parenting has failed. If done correctly the child will mostly turn out ok.

The introduction of screens/social media and the loss of children being able to play outside has had far more of an impact. You learnt your social skills from hanging out. How to talk to elders, don't pick fights, sharing, how to grow and keep friendships etc Coupled with the loss of the creative/performance arts in schools which were great for learning soft skills such as team work, perseverance and resilience.

There will always be a group of children that for whatever reason do not respond to their parents/elders. This group of children are the ones that end up in prison and even then some come out worse than they went in. In reality all you can do is keep them away from other people. It's sad but you can't make someone a better person unless they want to change.

It's because most people don't do gentle parenting properly. You don't replace hitting with yelling or threats or screentime. You replace it by talking to your child about their feelings / about why things were wrong.