To claim overtime as my new boss now wants me to "make up" some lost time.

We always had a give and take arrangement - it usually worked out in the companies favor - as indeed it would have done in OPs case 46 hrs vs 45 mins

Yes not all jobs can be like that but it isn't a race to the bottom

Teaching is a very bad example because if you actually look at the hours worked over a year it often gives a very different picture to the hours worked in a week in term time - worked it out with one teacher who was working all hours and really stressed and giving me a lot of earache - over the year however she worked less hours than me because of the longer holidays

I don't think I am missing the point. I completely understand that OP was happily working extra hours and not expecting to be paid overtime because they liked the flexibility of TOIL. That all sounds great to me and a fab way of working. I completely agree that this benefits both employer and employees, and is usual in many places of employment.

What I'm questioning is the system for overtime. Is it regular practise that an employee can request payment for overtime when it hasn't been agreed in advance? My DP works in a regular PAYE role and he occasionally has to work evenings/weekends. When this happens, it's agreed that project X needs to be sorted ASAP so Y hours of overtime are agreed. DP works the extra hours and then claims for them. What he can't do is just decide he'll do some extra hours one month, and send in the bill afterwards.

I've asked the OP to clarify, but I don't think they understand what I'm asking.

Why would you stop working overtime that you were doing anyhow when he has confirmed he will pay you more!!

You're missing the point a little. She never expected to be paid overtime, just the flexibility of not having to "pay back" appointments because she's already worked extra before to get the job done.

TOIL is common, i've used it everywhere i've worked

Good on you @OP!

A bit confused at people commenting "that wouldn't work at my job" okay? It's not your job is it, it worked for OP under previous management.

Well done op, not many people stand up to their managers. Love a bit of malicious compliance.

We have to get our overtime approved in advance and give a specific reason.

If we take time out for an appointment, we have to make the time up. (Not on flexi time)

Yes, I understand the doing extra hours from time to time because there's maybe a backlog and it just needs to be done. I do this all the time as a teacher, although in my case I very rarely get the time back quid pro quo. I also understand that this can be beneficial to the employee in terms of promotions and bonuses etc. What I don't understand is how an employee can choose to work extra hours without agreeing beforehand with management that they will get paid overtime for it. In your example of working weekends on a project, surely it's agreed beforehand that they'll get the time off in lieu? How does budgeting work if an employee just says "By the way, I worked 20 extra hours last month and here's the bill".

This is why my son in law is now a bus driver and no longer a theatre nurse.

That wouldn't work in my organisation, as a PP has said, you can't just decide to work part of your lunch break or stay a bit later in order to claim overtime. It has to be agreed in advance and it needs to be for a valid reason.

Forgive me, I still don't quite understand. I'm a teacher so have always worked extra hours here and there as needed, with no opportunity to claim for overtime. The majority of teachers do this by choice and/or necessity.

Are you saying that in business, you can just choose to work longer hours, without agreeing it beforehand, and then hit your manager with the bill? So if someone's a bit short on money one month, they can just unilaterally decide to work more hours an get paid for it?

Maybe I'm not making myself clear. I absolutely understand that people often "stay a bit later, start lunch late etc." because work needs to be done, but if they want to be paid for it, I would have thought that they would need to agree with management beforehand. E.g., "There's a real backlog of work atm and I can do a few extra hours next week on this, is it ok to claim this as overtime?". How on earth does management budget otherwise?

I love a good bit of malicious compliance! Well done OP

Good for you!!

Was this new policy communicated to staff beforehand or did he decide to tell you after you informed him of your dentist app? Has he created this policy or has it come from above. I find so many employers now seem to show a general distrust for staff

It sounds like prior to the new manager's arrival the OP was doing what a lot of us do, which is work slightly longer than our agreed hours most weeks. This is really normal in a salaried professional job, and the understanding is that there's a Quid Pro Quo, if the employees need to work shorter days on occassion because of medical appointments or similar. No one where I work gets "overtime", but people who work a lot of extra hours tend to get more done and thus get promotions or bigger bonuses. If staff regularly work weekends for a project roll-out they submit extra days to have off in lieu later.
Her manager has completely shot himself in the foot by being petty. For the sake of 45 minutes, once in a blue moon, he's now paying through the nose for several hours a week that he was previously getting for free.

I love nothing more than a show don’t tell to managers who are inflexible 😂

We had this. Previously running late wasn’t an issue as there would be some days when people could leave earlier so it all came out in the wash. Theatre manager decided that if a list finished early staff would either have to use overtime or stay doing busy work until end of shift. TOIL was hard to schedule due to rota issues. Practically overnight it became incredibly difficult to continue as no one would stay late. So ridiculous.

good for you for standing up to him

How did he not know that you've been working an extra 5-6 hours per week? Doesn't overtime have to be agreed before it is worked, so it can be budgeted for?

This is where flexitime works well.
I used to do an extra five minutes here and there without really noticing as it added up, and by the end of the week naffed off home early, or could do an appointment with it.

Yikes.

He sounds like a bellend. Sounds like he pulled the 1 jan policy out of his arse.

So frustrating but probably worth cooling things now as this sounds like it could get pretty combative and he could make your life difficult. PP suggestions re a conversation on expectations are wise.

I mean - I think you are not unreasonable as that's the policy.

But presumably this manager has already put your back up, which is why you reacted like that instead of saying - I've done 20 or more hours over every month this year, so I already have made it up. Which would have been less provocative!

Your new boss is an idiot. Well done standing up for yourself