To be annoyed at the way DH is as a father/husband

🤣👏 Love the prison part

Hopefully she made him prove it before she got pregnant. One of my friends took this approach. Told her useless DH exactly what he needed to do for at least a year before she was willing to try to conceive. None of this’ I will step up when the baby is here.’

OP, tell him what you expect him to do and what will happen if he doesn’t. Ideally the consequences will fall on him. I made it clear that clothes dropped on the floor do not find their way to the washing machine. They will be chucked into the bottom of his wardrobe. You only need to implement this for a short period to drive the message home. Start with his laundry and all his side of the family’s birthdays and Christmas.

@sushiandarollie "But DH doesn’t do gardening or DIY either! If it needs to get done, either it’s down to me or I end up asking whether DH will or it doesn’t get done…"

Please don't come back in a year or so saying you have a newborn and looking for advice on what to do about the fact your husband does nothing. He's shown you he does nothing. You can decide to have another or not in that knowledge.

I don't need to have children to know that they shouldn't be deliberately born into toxic relationships 🙄

I don't need to have children to know that they shouldn't be deliberately born into toxic relationships 🙄

I'll quote my previous post

I disagree with what you are doing morally as well, but this is beside the point

The method of creating this child aside, yes it is the shitshow of a marriage that is the problem. A child shouldn't be brought into this whether naturally conceived or adopted is irrelevant. OP doesn't want to hear that. She wants a child no matter what.

@sushiandarollie

I don't have a problem with anyone adopting a child if they have a stable home life and the means to raise the child to be healthy and happy.

I do have a problem with someone bringing a new life into the world when they know fine well the family dynamic isn't right. You want a child no matter what, you've said you're "desperate." Even though you are seething with resentment about your husband and posting about how angry he makes you and that you don't trust him to look after your children's basic needs, you still want another child in that situation.

I feel sorry for your husband. You need therapy to work out why you so badly want a child with someone who makes you so angry.

Your bar for what constitutes a good reason to have a child is also very low. It's got nothing to do with IVF. If you could conceive naturally it would still be morally wrong. Sort your life out with your husband before you have another child.

Back to your original question then OP. From what I can gather based on my own experience (married with an 11yo) and ready on MN, the majority of fathers do a fair-ish amount of parenting and housework.

Are you going to tell your DH he needs to step up, then accept what his response is regardless?

Just ignore people whose opinions are not worth discussing. The mode of conception is not an issue. It is the disaster of the marriage which is at issue.

You can have your opinion on the question asked, I want to read people’s views but I definitely don’t want to hear some up-ones-arse opinion on infertility choices from someone who hasn’t been through it and doesn’t have a say. I have a great job, live in an affluent area and can bring up a child whose DNA doesn’t match mine much better than the k-head who’s got 5 ‘biological’ kids on a council estate

Of course I have a say. I have a say on anything I like.

Your job and where you stay have no bearing on the morality of bringing a child into the world to satisfy your own desire to have another baby in your circumstances. You can shout about how much better you are than someone on a council estate, but you're not really selling yourself as an advert for the picture perfect family.

You have a child already. Maybe you should work on your relationship with your husband for that child's sake instead of being utterly determined to bring another life into this family dynamic.

Oh and do you have that opinion on adoption? They won’t be biologically related….oh to be so narrow minded

An adopted child already exists in the world and needs a family to raise them. You are creating a child from the DNA of two other people because you want to satisfy your need to have another baby. I imagine it's because you're not happy in your marriage, but that's no reason to bring a child into your misery. Therapy is a better option. Perhaps when you've worked through your issues as a couple you could look into adoption since you're keen to argue that it's so similar to donor eggs and sperm.

Totally agree

@sushiandarollie

I have misread and thought you were using a surrogate. I disagree with surrogacy on moral grounds. I disagree with what you are doing morally as well, but this is beside the point as you won't be interested in hearing about that anyway. All you want is another baby.

I have a 3 year old, as do you. You are insisting on a second child which requires donor sperm and egg and the immensely stressful process of IVF despite an unhappy marriage.

I cannot comprehend why you would want to have another child with a man you say "irritates me so much", "winds you up", and makes you "so angry", let alone needing to go to extreme measures to get said child.

I think your husband comes second to your need for another child, even to the point of having one without either of your biological make-up. That strikes me as a couple who should be in therapy, not trying to bring a new life into this mess.

Your dh is, apparently, not much good at stuff. So decide whether you can tolerate that or not. You picked him but you aren’t stuck with him. If you made a mistake then toss him overboard and go it alone.

I don't think many people will claim to have a perfect marriage but I would say our roles are shared in our household:
I work part time, DH full time.
I do the school admin and keep on track of things like that. I also do the school run every day. I do the supermarket shop, meal planning and most of the cooking. In terms of organising bills, I sort the water bill, internet, home insurance, travel insurance and my own car.
DH deals with gas/electricity and his car. He does the gardening and will do any DIY and maintenance/car related stuff.
I take the children to one club each week, he takes them to the other club they attend.
He probably does more cleaning than me because he is better at it, though I will nip round with the hoover.
Overall I would say things in the home are generally shared, so if that's what you mean by perfect then maybe we do have that.

OP I found it really hard when I went from one child to two. I was left dealing with them both alot due to my husbands job and struggled. It is a massive jump in terms of how much physical and mental load it adds. You will not want to be absorbing all that yourself so please think carefully about what conversations you are going to have with your husband prior to trying for the next baby, to ensure he will pick up more of the slack.

Go ahead snd have the second baby you want so badly. But don’t be surprised that your little family drifts apart. You are treating him as surplus to requirement rather than the love of your life. you don’t even need him for the baby production! How lonely is that for him?

I agree with this, it's so fucked up. I don't agree with surrogacy to begin with, but this situation is extra levels of nope.

I think you need therapy for your desire for a second child OP as it's completely overriding everything else, and all sensible and logical thought processes. You should be working on your marriage, not creating a baby that isn't biologically either of yours and taking it from its mother.

Me? I have a perfect marriage. I am recovering from cancer right now and my dh has tirelessly taken care of me. Also he was an excellent husband and father to our two children.

But this is besides the point. Your dh is going through something horrendous (the cancer and recovery—scans every three months is very frightening)—and you are too. The IVF is exhausting snd, to a certain extent, demeaning and demoralizing as neither if you get to have an uncomplicated and natural relationship with procreation. This is actually a really traumatic year or two or three for your little family.

Stop focusing on the small stuff. You are just distracting and sublimating the anxiety you feel about everything snd placing it on your dh eho may be dissociated and avoiding existential dread by watching football instead of pulling his weight with chores.

Go ahead snd have the second baby you want so badly. But don’t be surprised that your little family drifts apart. You are treating him as surplus to requirement rather than the love of your life. you don’t even need him for the baby production! How lonely is that for him?

Of you do love him try to remember that fact and try to find ways to reattach to him rather than resent him for not being perfect. He is just a very young man who has had two significant knocks to his self esteem—the can er snd infertility are hugely existential crises for anyone—man or woman. Try to have a little empathy.

🙋🏼‍♀️

Not perfect by any means, but we also don't have children so we're not bringing any innocent lives into the world either.