Nurseries cannot charge extra to access free hours: updated guidance

I use to work in families information service, supporting families in accessing 2 and 3 year funding.

It has always been the case that extras must be voluntary and families should not be penalised for not paying for them (but must provide the extras themselves)

In the early days child care settings risked having their funding withdrawn if they did not adhere to this but over the years it appears to have slacken off.

It’s when people suggest, and I’ve seen this so many times, that you should just take on more school aged children to bridge the gap in funding. Why on earth should I take on older children, have more work, more stress and more usage of resources all to make up for the lack of funding of the early years? Why should I expect to double the children I care for in order to earn what I should on half the children? Many childminders purely work with EYFS for various reasons yet they’re expected to start caring for older children in the hopes they can make minimum wage otherwise they’re thought of as greedy. It’s bonkers!

Exactly how many people would take a wage cut of between £60 and £180 a week. Let alone continue the same level of work and provide from their wages the food, equipment etc.

As a childminder I will be losing out by £2 per hour below my standard hourly fee once the children in my care reach the age of three.
If I am not allowed to make up that loss I will no longer be able to offer care over the age of three and there is great demand for my services currently.

But it’s an absolute faff for the staff. Every time a child needs changing they have to go and find their bag with their nappies and wipes in then put it back afterwards. Might only take an extra minute or two but multiply that by all the children, multiple times a day. It would be much easier to just have a a stash.

Our nursery have always had you send in your own nappies. They have a set of pigeon holes in the nappy changing area, each labelled with a child, and their nappies and wipes go in there so there's no back and forth to bags, and if they're running low they can easily see, and just let you know. I don't think they even offer the option to pay and have them supply the nappies.
My eldest had quite sensitive skin and really struggled with nappy rash so we tried quite a few brands of wipes, so it was good to control it rather than the nursery using something different to home.

They do have a stash for if a child runs out and the parents haven't sent in more. When the parent does then send in more, they restock the stash from what the parent sends.

I really like our nursery and they've never had any mandatory extra charges/top up fees.

It was always going to happen. And next I expect to see providers stopping accepting funding altogether, especially in areas where there are long waiting lists and a lack of childcare.

Parents need to support their providers, and pay all "optional" charges that are put forward pr you may find yourself without childcare pretty soon.

But it’s an absolute faff for the staff. Every time a child needs changing they have to go and find their bag with their nappies and wipes in then put it back afterwards. Might only take an extra minute or two but multiply that by all the children, multiple times a day. It would be much easier to just have a a stash.

A great benefit of nursery is children eating healthy meals all together. I would hate to have some sending in their own packed lunch.

The changes to funding have made nursery more expensive for those who don’t receive any funding as the only price providers can control is the non funded hours. Which is fine if you’re receiving some funded and some not, but when you’re paying for all hours yourself (no funded hours or tax free childcare) the additional costs can really mount up. And these are often people already contributing more via taxes which in part pays for a scheme they can’t access.

Feedback today is that lots of providers will no longer be offering 3 year old funding or taking children on trips and outings because they will no longer be able to afford to. So sad for these children

My child is older! So we don't get the full no of hours we're meant to - but our bill is still significantly reduced

They should give parents to option to provide own nappies and food and milk or pay for the nursery to provide them

Buggies on public transport in rush hour. It's a mystery why more working parents aren't clamouring for this practical solution to their childcare woes...

Haaaa yes! Running costs are insane utility bills, high business rates (we pay over 5k a month) staff, food (which used to be around 500 a week is now double), cleaners (4k a month) all the toys, activities, books, paper, paints, sand etc!) courses for staff (first aid etc) dbs checks, insurance, maintenance

and on and on the list goes.

I think as others have said, nurseries will become like NHS dentists. You might be entitled to it free on paper, but if you can't find someone to have you on, then you need to pay.

People who need this so they can work, would rather pay than have no childcare.

You are clearly clueless as to what the "running costs" are. No way would I be running a nursery.

Eligibility being "term after" really doesn't work for 9mos either. Especially for the summer term. (So its age on 31st March that matters, until September). So some get the funding at 9 months, some at 14 months.. and its the Summer Born children who will miss out the most. (July/August).

Its a scheme that was cobbled together quickly by an outgoing administration and the incoming one doesn't seem to know how to tidy it up.

The system is outdated. The original 15hr funded were to ensure all children had access to a preschool space and be ready for school. It was about education not childcare. Now we are focused on childcare not education but the system hasn’t changed for the need for increasing childcare spaces as more families need both parents in work. 38 weeks was based on the school term for education. For childcare parents need a system that offers all year and 11 hours stretched doesn’t significantly help costs for most families.

The amount of admin that nurseries have to complete around giving the funding is significant. It would be much easier for the government to give each family a sum of money for each child to use for childcare and then everyone could choose the provision they want and nurseries would be free to charge what they need to run a sustainable business.

I wouldn't be so sure that no one would, certainly post April when staffing costs rise some settings will close, others will cease to offer the funded hours; if your area is anything like mine people will be clamouring for any space. Also remember you can charge top ups for food and resources.

Pretty much, certainly here the demand for childcare outstrips supply, so they'd still fill spaces not offering the hours.

So when those on UC are being told to look for a job or increase their hours when the child is three they won't find space. I suspect more mums will have to stay at home.

Maybe the nursery will, as others close, just become fully private ... similar to the trend in dentists.

I think this will be lead to a lot of nurseries closing. Come April they've also got the rise in minimum wage rate, lowering of NI threshold and increase in NI.
And Rachel from accounts claims the government are promoting growth ... certainly not in this sector.

who would choose to pay full rates when the magical ‘free’ hours are on offer elsewhere.

Are they/will they be on offer elsewhere though? People may not have a choice as more childcare providers close.

Also people might choose to pay the optional expenses. At our nursery, paying for food is optional. But if you don't pay, you have to send in your own. I think everyone pays because it's easier than sending in two meals. I imagine there's a fairly hefty mark-up on the food, which is fine and still within the rules as it is an optional fee.

I’ve been a childminder for many, many years. Ive had some wonderful experiences and cherished every little one who has spent time with me. I will be closing my doors as I just can’t make this work anymore. There no point in me not offering funding, who would choose to pay full rates when the magical ‘free’ hours are on offer elsewhere. My expenses are generally a third of my earnings, once you take the expenses away I’m left with very little. I knew I would never be rich being a childminder but I should be able to pay my bills and feed my family. I shouldn’t be responsible for the shortfall on funding, I shouldn’t be making up for the shortfall from my own pocket. I shouldn’t have to pay for the care of the children I look after.

Some of the most important jobs in society seem to be paid the least, our society only seems to value money, not actual worth.

They should give parents to option to provide own nappies and food and milk or pay for the nursery to provide them