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Original poster

How Can The World Stand By While Trump Sucks Up To Putin?

330 replies

Nolieinforme · 19/02/2025 20:28

OK, so this probably isn't an AIBU, but I'm speechless that Trump is behaving like a bully and seems to be getting away with it.

He just lies. "Zelensky is a dictator" "Ukraine started the war" "Putin has done nothing wrong" etc, etc. I can hardly believe what's been said on the news today.

Why are the rest of the world letting this happen? If America want's to align themselves with Russia, then we should be returning the Chagos Islands without the huge sum of money promised, closing all the US airbases in the UK, closing the US embassy, and expelling their diplomats, etc, etc.

Trump is a madman and what is going to happen if no-one stands up to him? If this was anyone else they just wouldn't get away with it.

OP posts:
AquaPeer · 20/02/2025 18:00

whatonearthisgoingonnow · 20/02/2025 16:00

UK doesn't need to pay much more.

Japan and Australia need to pay more.

NATO countries not meeting the target need to pay a lot more - Spain and Italy for example.

If countries that are otherwise neutral can be persuaded to pay money toward peacekeeping things or aid that would help too.

Or alternatively, since Ukraine has received $90bn from the US and they want $500bn of Ukrainian minerals, they can just give Ukraine another $350bn to win and still be in profit.

Why would Australia need to pay more? They’re sat in the ocean on their own completely secure unaffected by security in Europe or Africa or any other continent- why would you expect them to pay?

Futb · 20/02/2025 18:00

Wildflowers99 · 20/02/2025 13:20

This. It’s like asking why nobody stands up to Tyson Fury in a bar - there is nobody with the strength or power to reasonably take him on and make him back down.

Trump has been elected on a promise of putting America first and not liberally spending their ‘tax dollars’ policing the world and acting as a very expensive military deterrent for others. He has (I think quite reasonably) made the point that we have been happily defunding our own military safe in the knowledge they’ll properly fund theirs and we can hide behind them.

The UK has no standing any more. We have no proper allies - the USA has ghosted us, we are no longer in the EU, and our Empire is in the dustbin of history. We are still a member of NATO, but we have little influence over the major players anymore.

Add to that that we spend more on disability benefits alone than our entire military budget, our failing economy and high unemployment, and what weight do we have to throw around?

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Same question to you…. Do you have a problem with disabled people and vulnerable people? Your post suggests you find them to be an inconvenience and they should just get on with it and stop ‘sponging’ off the state. Is that right?

Futb · 20/02/2025 17:57

Andwhoisasking · 20/02/2025 13:09

Unfortunately this post kind of nails it. We have spent years funding a society which is hugely state dependent. More sick and disabled than the any where else in the western world. We’ve ran defence spending into the ground because the hope is someone else will do it. Not enough money and too many on the sick. We’ve fucked our selves to be blunt.

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Do you have a problem with disabled people? You seem to be targeting them in your rant! Disgusting

trainermush · 20/02/2025 17:56

@SernieBanders

Yes really, I don't think the governments has done much for the young in the last 20 years. Is that controversial? I am not saying people aren't needed to fight.

young people today owe a debt to every single person who has gone before them. They might have to step up.

Doesn't the vast majority of those alive now owe that debt?

BIossomtoes · 20/02/2025 17:51

Wildflowers99 · 20/02/2025 17:45

Everyone on the Starmer thread is talking about conscription like it’s likely!

(I don’t think it is).

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It hasn’t been mentioned on that thread.

SernieBanders · 20/02/2025 17:51

BIossomtoes · 20/02/2025 17:43

How long and how many people do you think it would take to train conscripts? You’ve answered your own question, our armed forces are too small to do it.

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6-12 months in peace time.

6 weeks during a war if forced.

SernieBanders · 20/02/2025 17:49

trainermush · 20/02/2025 17:30

Husband just saying to our DS (22) to prepare for conscription, is this how our military is going to be boosted?

Can we afford to lose so many young people? I think it's a cheek to expect young people to fight after the way they have been shafted over the years.

Really?

take a look at every other country, take a look at history - people are and must be expected to fight, to put their lives on the line for the lie country and their way of life. Freedom needs defending

and you only have to look back about thirty years to know things are a damned site better now than they have been for the entirety of civilisation

young people today owe a debt to every single person who has gone before them. They might have to step up.

EasternStandard · 20/02/2025 17:48

trainermush · 20/02/2025 17:47

How many young people have Ukraine lost? How many mothers have lost their Russian conscript sons?

Too many

Agree

BoredZelda · 20/02/2025 17:48

Our current ruling party when last in power created a dossier of lies to take us into an illegal war that killed 500,000. Just a few months back that same party voted to kill 4,000 old people by removing WFP (their own figures).

The WFP figures are over 7 years old and were based on every pensioner losing the payment, with no additional support put in place.

The number of deaths in the Iraq war is also wildly inaccurate. There is absolutely no evidence that Blair deliberately lied, and the main reason he won a cross party democratic vote by a huge majority in parliament to go to war, was MPs felt we as a nation needed to stand by the US because of the special relationship we had with them.

You can disagree with the Iraq war, and the removal of WFP if you like, but it's much better to do so knowing the actual information, instead of believing tabloid tropes trotted out to bash a party you just don't like.

trainermush · 20/02/2025 17:47

How many young people have Ukraine lost? How many mothers have lost their Russian conscript sons?

Too many

SerendipityJane · 20/02/2025 17:47

Hopefully Reform will sort out this shower of shit!!

(4/5ths of) Britain won't support Putin patsies like Farage.

BIossomtoes · 20/02/2025 17:46

It’s not remotely likely.

TempestTost · 20/02/2025 17:46

Trump is a blowhard, we'll see what they come up with in the end. But chances that this war would end with some kind of negotiation were pretty much certain, and that always means that something is given up. It's not terms of surrender.

The Ukranians don't have to accept anything Trump negotiates, but the fact is that if you are depending on others for your military support, they call the shots, or they withdraw that support.

This kind of politics has never been about being nice. Countries band together into groups like NATO because they believe it is strategically advantageous. Not because of love or friendship. But we are getting on to 100 years since the political alignments of post WWII. The strategic alignments and economic alignments of the world are changing. And currently, the US is not seeing it's own interests served by providing military might for all of Europe.

Maybe that is a strategic error, but it's not a crazy idea, many Americans feel that their taxes are being spent, not to support their own infrastructure etc, but to allow Europe to freeload. And they are super pissed off about it. Trumps approach, economically and in politics, seems to be, what is good for the uS.

Europe needs to think about their own military needs.

Wildflowers99 · 20/02/2025 17:45

BIossomtoes · 20/02/2025 17:37

Scaremongering at its absolute worst.

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Everyone on the Starmer thread is talking about conscription like it’s likely!

(I don’t think it is).

trainermush · 20/02/2025 17:45

Scaremongering at its absolute worst.

Apparently a labour MP was talking about it for some of the youths. I haven't heard it myself though, makes me angry.

trainermush · 20/02/2025 17:43

@FireandRain23 😊

BIossomtoes · 20/02/2025 17:43

Nolieinforme · 20/02/2025 17:41

Where do you think all these "Boots on the ground" will come from then? Sadly our current military is too small to be able to do much at all.

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How long and how many people do you think it would take to train conscripts? You’ve answered your own question, our armed forces are too small to do it.

EasternStandard · 20/02/2025 17:41

How many young people have Ukraine lost? How many mothers have lost their Russian conscript sons?

It's all awful but still not something I want to see. Do you have the relevant age sons @FireandRain23?

Original poster
Nolieinforme · 20/02/2025 17:41

BIossomtoes · 20/02/2025 17:37

Scaremongering at its absolute worst.

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Where do you think all these "Boots on the ground" will come from then? Sadly our current military is too small to be able to do much at all.

OP posts:
FireandRain23 · 20/02/2025 17:40

trainermush · 20/02/2025 17:30

Husband just saying to our DS (22) to prepare for conscription, is this how our military is going to be boosted?

Can we afford to lose so many young people? I think it's a cheek to expect young people to fight after the way they have been shafted over the years.

How many young people have Ukraine lost? How many mothers have lost their Russian conscript sons? Make no mistake, if we tolerate this it will be Poland and Finland next.

Original poster
Nolieinforme · 20/02/2025 17:39

C152 · 20/02/2025 17:09

This sounds reasonable, but it isn't. Ukraine wouldn't need millions for military and rebuilding support if Russia hadn't invaded. And I don't just mean their full invasion in 2022, but the start of their invasion in 2014. Why isn't the narrative that RUSSIA is costing the world millions (not to mention lives lost). It is not Ukraine's fault they were invaded and they now stand (almost alone) defending the rest of Europe. Russia could end the war today and pay reparations to Ukraine. We all know they won't, but why isn't there more uproar about what RUSSIA is costing, not statements about how much is being spent on Ukraine, or what Ukraine is costing other nations. Ukraine isn't costing other nations anything. They are saving our freedom at the cost of their lives and their country.

Why does the Western World seem so certain that appeasement will work this time, given their experience last time? It's infuriating.

Trump doesn't want to broker a deal. He will do what Putin tells him to do.

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This is what I'm thinking. Russia have behaved appallingly and people seem to have short memories. I'm thinking back to 2022 and those satellite pictures of all the Russian tanks lined up on the Ukrainian boarder, and invasion being predicted. Putin denied that he was going to invade and then did exactly that. The whole world knows he is a liar and cannot be trusted...

OP posts:
FireandRain23 · 20/02/2025 17:37

trainermush · 20/02/2025 17:15

@FireandRain23 I haven't moaned about the benefits bill.

Not aimed at you at all, then - apologies.

BIossomtoes · 20/02/2025 17:37

Nolieinforme · 20/02/2025 17:21

Husband just saying to our DS (22) to prepare for conscription, is this how our military is going to be boosted?

Edited

Scaremongering at its absolute worst.

BlitheSpirits · 20/02/2025 17:36

The thing is there was only ever going to be one victor in Ukraine Vs Russia. The endgame was always going to be the same it is just a question how many more lives and billions of dollars will be squandered first.

FireandRain23 · 20/02/2025 17:32

BoredZelda · 20/02/2025 17:25

On 25th January, the New York Times reported that he still has the support and trust of Ukrainians but by a very slim majority-52% and that he is increasingly blocking out advisers who think differently to him.

Trump's approval rating is currently 46.5%, unfavourable is at 48.1%

Zelensky at 57% is doing much better with his people than Trump is.

Agree - and 52% was good enough for Brexit.

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