Daughter’s friend acts like a twat

Sometimes kids behave like total twats. My own kid does.

OP, I can tell that like myself, boundary setting is something that might not come easily in your life.

When you struggle with these things, you can twist and manipulate yourself every which way you can to bring change. But change never ever comes because you are trying to change other people. You cannot.

You change your behaviour. Boundaries are about YOUR OWN BEHAVIOUR. This might include no playdates ever again. No playdates at your house ever ( definitely do this at least). Never leave your kid alone at their house with the kid and mum who can't see what's going on!

I don't see any good outcome here. Over time the mum might see truth. The kid might calm over time and learn how to manage meltdowns. They might not. You just can't make people see.

If you absolutely don't want to lose the friend then I'd do things only together as adults.

As an excuse,you could say that you're struggling so much with fatigue and energy that you just can't possibly do the playdates ( when she asks).

I spend a lot of time online learning how to set boundaries and then applying them. I'm surrounded by bloody bellends, sociopathic family members and more. I shit you not. It's a lesson some of us never learnt. Look after you OP.

I would not have a rude kid in my house.

OP is your daughter able to say why she likes this friend so much if she is begging to see her?

My mum likes to remind me of my appalling taste in friends as a very small child. Had one that I thought was fantastic - one playdate and my mum never let me near her again. I thought she was exciting and glamorous, reality she was a spoilt drama queen who bullied me.

From what OP has said it doesn't sound like there is a reason why she wouldn't be able to wipe her bum. I would assume that if she did need help with that OP would be aware/her mum would have said.

It could possibly be a way the little girl is trying to exert control over others. Similar to getting people to make food and not eating it. There are various reasons why she might do that - some SEN related and some not

I may have missed a post here, but why on earth would an 8-year-old need her bottom wiping for her? I got the bit about possible SEN, but even in that scenario... she wouldn't get it wiped for her at school, surely? And I haven't seen anything about physical or other disabilities that could impact this?

She does sound like a troubled child which is a shame, but OP you're doing the right thing putting your DD first.

I'd do some social stories on friendship and personal boundaries. Many women including me were taught not to say no or to suppress our own feelings, putting others ahead of ourselves ti personal detriment

I'm a believer in making home safe, so I won't make something she won't eat, but if I'm making the safe food as agreed (agreed being her pointing to them out of a range) I won't then waste that and make something else

It isn't easy 😕

I feel for the kid, but the op can't be shouldering the problems

I noticed how you've said that you do not know where the boundaries are, and also that your daughter often does things beyond the norm to appease this girl.

You are uncomfortable with this friendship so playdates need to stop. It sounds like BOTH you and DD perhaps are putting yourselves out to appease people.

Perhaps you could do some work on identify and enforcing your own boundaries, as I think that will be a great way to teach DD to do the same.

It sounds like OP and this parent are good friends so could have that conversation. My son’s friend (mentioned) only eats certain stuff so I check that we have something suitable or buy it in. That’s fine. I wouldn’t be wasting loads though.

Not necessarily - it could be that OP knows that the friend can and does wipe her own bum normally and this is oppositional behaviour. It may not be that she has physical care needs.

In that situation I would have called her mum straight away to come.

As soon as the arse wiping issue arose, I'd have told her I was calling her mum, as that was not my job to do, then I would have called her, in front of her and got her to come take the child home! Then just don't invite her again. She obviously pushed her luck all the time she was at your house, that should have been the last straw frankly!
You need to steer your daughter away from these kind of manipulative friendships for her own sake.
When I was 8, in the 70s, a (lot) older girl who lived not far away, took more than an interest in me. I can't even remember how we became friends. My mum wasn't keen, due to the age gap and the fact she was very sneaky in other ways. She would tell me to go ask my mum for things, but say it was me that wanted them. Money, sweets, food, can she stay for tea, can you bake a cake and so on. My mum knew it wasn't me asking.
She'd come and "play" and then she suddenly started insisting on "taking me to the toilet". I was absolutely horrified, as I could manage this by myself, so I used to have to lock the door to prevent her coming in. She shut the door to my bedroom one afternoon, (we lived in a bungalow and mum was in the kitchen next to my room) as she wanted to play "mummies and daddies". Thankfully, I can't actually remember how far anything got, (apart from her saying it was our secret?!) but my mum shouted and asked what was happening in there, to open the door please and then she said that this girl needed to leave, now! And she was told in no uncertain terms not to come back.
Mum questioned me when she'd left, but as I didn't know what had happened, she had to leave it. But I was told that she was no longer welcome at our house. I accepted that!
I know it's hard to imagine children being so manipulative, but there are examples out there and your children need to be protected from them at all costs.

Your daughter sounds like a very sweet and compassionate little girl, OP. I’m glad you recognise that this other girl is trampling on boundaries that your daughter has a right to maintain, even if her friend (and/or the friend’s mother) is having a difficult time. It doesn’t fall to either you or your daughter to manage the other girl’s needs. Like others have said, I think encouraging her in other friendships is the way to go. That way she’ll have more examples of what healthy friendships look like and will become better equipped to say no when the less healthy ones arise.

Your daughter is obviously a sweet, kind child to have wiped her friends bottom. And you can take a lot of credit for her being that way. But I think you should double down on the rules children are taught about private parts of the body. I’m not suggesting there was anything more untoward about the child asking your daughter to wipe her other than laziness (although that is definitely not something she should feel obliged to do). But this blurs the rules and might make your daughter more vulnerable in a less innocent situation.

Personally I would stop entertaining this friendship and encourage my child to develop other friendships. If they are friends at school then so be it but I wouldn’t have them at my home.

i wouldn’t have a child in my house that demands and has no manners.

She wouldn’t get a second play date in my house.

It's hard with sen parenting because there's a lot of judgement within the community

One boundary i have is, I will make dd's safe foods but she has to eat what ive made.

I'm not making a bunch of different dinners because she won't eat them, if that makes sense. I've gotten flack for that, could explain the struggles with the child described by the op.

Okay fine fair enough, you're right about getting into trouble

With dd's asd, I'm very much not wanting the kid to feel bad but at 8, (as long as the child doesn't have a disability) fair enough, not the best idea to wipe them

Fair enough 😭 I can accept that

That's fair, I think as my dd is my only one, and she has autism, I'm overjoyed she's now using the toilet and I'm fine with wiping her

I can accept that at 8, that's not the norm in most households 😬 though

Yes, so did I. You can’t change someone else’s behaviour, OP, whether parent or child. All you can change is your own.

Your child is a) 5 and b) your own child. That is very, very different from wiping the bum of someone else’s 8-year-old (who as she has no diagnosed SEN will absolutely not be getting her arse wiped by anyone at school and can therefore do it elsewhere too).

This us an easy fix OP. The girl never comes to your home again, nor your DD to hers.

An eight-year-old had a tantrum and made your daughter wipe her arse?! I’d say that’s the perfect excuse never to have this child set foot in your home again, and I would also be explaining that very clearly to her parents. Totally unacceptable behaviour.

Stop having her over. Just say you can't be doing with the misbehaving and maybe when she's a bit older.