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I never thought I'd see the US aligning with Russia

388 replies

VolcanoJapan · 19/02/2025 10:27

The US appear under Trump to be aligning with Putin and Russia more and more.

What was until recently referred to as our greatest allie is moving close to Russia in many ways, carving up Ukraine for Russia, trade deals with Russia.

It's bizarre.

Aibu to think it's bizarre or was this always coming when trump was elected?

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PerkingFaintly · 01/03/2025 10:42

PerkingFaintly · 21/02/2025 17:11

Oh now that's VERY interesting.

A thing I spotted during Covid was a strange confluence of musicians of the 70s and 80s repeating standard anti-vax conspiracy lines.

I don't mean, coming up with their own personal mix of beliefs – in which you'd expect a bit of variety, and for which you'd expect to see some previous history in their very public lives.

But bam! straight into parroting to their huge fan base the identical lines Joe Public was getting from Facebook.

I know that one of the ways influence operations work (whether the product be soap powder or politics) is to heavily target someone who is an existing influencer in an unrelated area, in the justified hope they will bring their large following with them.

Covid was a gift for disruptors to run influence operations, because it offered so many different possible cracks into which to slip a knife and wiggle.

Well well well. Guess what I came across today? (From 2022.)

‘Troll factory’ spreading Russian pro-war lies online, says UK
St Petersburg outfit hijacks discussions on Twitter, TikTok, world leaders’ social accounts and media websites, as well as manipulating opinion polls
https://www.theguardian.com/world/2022/may/01/troll-factory-spreading-russian-pro-war-lies-online-says-uk
[...] Social media accounts of bands and musicians including Daft Punk, David Guetta, Tiesto and Rammstein appear to have been targeted by the disinformation operation.

ForestAtTheSea · 27/02/2025 14:51

sleepwouldbenice · 27/02/2025 01:57

Yes free speech....but I believe the White House will now control who attends press conferences and therefore likely have less attendees who pick on the Donald....

true, they are controlling who is in the press corps, too, but this is about any articles which criticize any of his decisions; the journalist do not need to be in the press corps for that.
And threatening to create a new law about the media - as in the link I provided - sounds very much like he'd prefer censure - just like his buddy Vladimir.
When North Korean and Russian politicians start to sound reasonable by contrast it's clear there is a problem.

EasternStandard · 27/02/2025 09:33

bluewanda · 27/02/2025 03:49

@EasternStandard which radio station was that please? I would like to have a listen.

@bluewanda I usually listen to BBC WS or Times Radio for analysis and it was the latter I think, on Sunday morning

Since then more talk of minerals deal with Ukraine, and the line on security which everyone is hanging on, so far doesn't give it.

bluewanda · 27/02/2025 03:49

@EasternStandard which radio station was that please? I would like to have a listen.

bluewanda · 27/02/2025 03:47

The experts on the radio show I was listening to last week (discussing this) seemed to be of the opinion that Russia can afford to keep losing men at this rate because of how vast it is.

Russia isn’t that vast though. Its population size is only just over twice that of the UK (143 million).

sleepwouldbenice · 27/02/2025 01:57

ForestAtTheSea · 26/02/2025 21:29

25% tariffs on products from the EU, because the EU was specifically created to annoy Trump (in his narc perception). That comes from the federal country USA.

https://www.theguardian.com/us-news/2025/feb/26/trump-european-union-tariffs

Soon enough the Russian Federation will invade Alaska just to shut him up.

And Trump wanting to sue the media for a story he didn't like. I guess he did not listen to his VP's preaching to Europe about free speech at the Munich Security Conference. I wonder what JD Vance makes of this.
www.theguardian.com/media/2025/feb/26/trump-wall-street-journal-tariffs

Yes free speech....but I believe the White House will now control who attends press conferences and therefore likely have less attendees who pick on the Donald....

ForestAtTheSea · 26/02/2025 21:29

25% tariffs on products from the EU, because the EU was specifically created to annoy Trump (in his narc perception). That comes from the federal country USA.

https://www.theguardian.com/us-news/2025/feb/26/trump-european-union-tariffs

Soon enough the Russian Federation will invade Alaska just to shut him up.

And Trump wanting to sue the media for a story he didn't like. I guess he did not listen to his VP's preaching to Europe about free speech at the Munich Security Conference. I wonder what JD Vance makes of this.
www.theguardian.com/media/2025/feb/26/trump-wall-street-journal-tariffs

Mielikki · 24/02/2025 08:55

TooBigForMyBoots · 24/02/2025 00:40

I agree with you in regards to increased military spending. However, that could be a much needed injection in growth. As well as security.

This is the 21st century. Threats to our security are different. We need a different approach.

Edited

Yeah, somewhat ironically military spending is one of the best “bang for buck” of any form of state spending in terms of job creation, tax revenue and export revenue.

TooBigForMyBoots · 24/02/2025 00:40

Mielikki · 23/02/2025 07:27

Massively increased military spending, which will either mean tax increases, cuts in other areas, or more borrowing. Now that the (by far) most important member of NATO cannot be relied on, the European members need to hugely step up and follow Poland’s lead in taking defence seriously.

Joining an EU customs union would go some way to softening the blow but I can’t see it happening under Starmer.

I agree with you in regards to increased military spending. However, that could be a much needed injection in growth. As well as security.

This is the 21st century. Threats to our security are different. We need a different approach.

EasternStandard · 23/02/2025 11:36

Actually might not have been that title for Ukraine spokesperson, some dc interruptions

My key take was it's difficult, interruption to how it was going isn't all bad but US is stronger than Russia economically and strategically

EasternStandard · 23/02/2025 11:23

Really good interviews on the radio this morning.

With Ukrainian former PM and ex MI6

Hard to convey the level of insight and give it justice, a few things that stood out

Putin is much weaker than US

Ukraine are happy to work on rare minerals deal but need security

US has bargaining power rn

The west didn't do well with Ukraine as it was just letting them lose slowly so disruption to that not overall bad

We need to spend loads more on defence

Strategy is interesting, I very much feel for Ukraine

Mielikki · 23/02/2025 07:27

Wildflowers99 · 22/02/2025 16:47

What do we all think the impact of these events will be on the UK over the next 5 years or so?

Massively increased military spending, which will either mean tax increases, cuts in other areas, or more borrowing. Now that the (by far) most important member of NATO cannot be relied on, the European members need to hugely step up and follow Poland’s lead in taking defence seriously.

Joining an EU customs union would go some way to softening the blow but I can’t see it happening under Starmer.

username299 · 22/02/2025 17:06

Scammersarescum · 22/02/2025 17:03

He does not intend for there to ever be free and fair elections in the USA again.

He needs to gut the military.

Apparently there were high level meetings in the military before the election as they suspected something like this.

BigDecisionWorthIt · 22/02/2025 17:04

username299 · 22/02/2025 16:41

The orange nutcase has fired his military leaders. I heard he's replacing them with Fox news presenters.

Going to be interesting to see which starred generals he picks to replace them.
One name I've seen is going against tradition and getting a general out of retirement.

That dig at Hegseth kind of falls flat though. The guy is a retired vet himself with 9 years worth of service and tours of Iraq and Afghan.

Scammersarescum · 22/02/2025 17:03

username299 · 22/02/2025 16:41

The orange nutcase has fired his military leaders. I heard he's replacing them with Fox news presenters.

He does not intend for there to ever be free and fair elections in the USA again.

He needs to gut the military.

Scammersarescum · 22/02/2025 17:02

Wildflowers99 · 22/02/2025 16:47

What do we all think the impact of these events will be on the UK over the next 5 years or so?

It's extremely worrying.

I just hope we can keep Farage from power. He's so clearly part of the same cabal.

Notaflippinclue · 22/02/2025 16:56

Well he promised to remove woke-ism from the ranks and I suppose that includes the top ranks

Wildflowers99 · 22/02/2025 16:47

What do we all think the impact of these events will be on the UK over the next 5 years or so?

username299 · 22/02/2025 16:41

The orange nutcase has fired his military leaders. I heard he's replacing them with Fox news presenters.

Mielikki · 22/02/2025 16:20

AlternativeView · 21/02/2025 18:02

@Mielikki perhaps, perhaps the truth is somewhere in the middle
Trump has a massive ago I can't imagine he wouldn't be aware of putin tactics.

Trump’s massive ego is far more likely to cloud his judgement I would have thought.

Crikeyalmighty · 21/02/2025 21:04

@PerkingFaintly yes indeed -in both cases the artist concerned has responded back personally with the 'my page , my views' - and when there's people saying 'well it's free speech' -they have responded correctly and said yes it is - and works both ways!!

AlternativeView · 21/02/2025 18:02

@Mielikki perhaps, perhaps the truth is somewhere in the middle
Trump has a massive ago I can't imagine he wouldn't be aware of putin tactics.

Mielikki · 21/02/2025 17:44

AlternativeView · 21/02/2025 14:39

Well I certainly don't thinking squaring up to putin is a good idea at all.
But I do think the comments about military strength are for putin.

Putin is a difficult enemy to gage, he's kgb.
I see Trump dancing around him, tickling his ear, joking, laughing, confusing him, seemingly siding with him against Zelensky.
I'm wondering what putin really thinks of Trump.
If I was putin I'd much rather be dealing with Biden??

The idea that Trump is “confusing” Putin is laughable. Trump is Putin’s useful idiot.

EasternStandard · 21/02/2025 17:29

Reading back the commentary on WS is closest to @BigDecisionWorthIt pp

EasternStandard · 21/02/2025 17:24

Yes, continue fighting until Russia withdraws. And provide the ongoing support Ukraine requires to achieve this aim - which, as all credible experts have spoken about, wouldn't be very much longer anyway.

Can you say where you've seen that it won't be much longer?

I mostly follow world service on commentary and haven't picked up this, the opposite pretty much, but maybe you've read something else?