To ask my friend to please stop trying to have another baby

You have no business asking her this. My aunty tried and failed to keep a pregnancy over many years. She eventually went on to have 2 healthy pregnancies. Either support your friend or take a step back

You obviously can't ask her to stop or even suggest she should. But if you're such close friends, surely a gentle conversation along the lines of 'do you think you'll ever stop trying?' or 'do you think you'll know if/when you've reached the end of the road?' would be ok?

Tbh I’d let her come to her own decision either way

I would say nothing to her for now but plan to spend less time with her while you feel it’s getting too much for you to deal with. If she is in her 40s the chances of her having another child are becoming lower every year and she will know this. At some point over the next few years she will realise that she’s too old and accept that she has to give up. It’s a horrible situation for her and her husband.

Her body her choice. Would I do this, no. But again her body her choice.

I didn’t get that far having “only” had two mmc between my daughters, and taking a long time to conceive each time, but I would have always had nagging doubts if I’d “given up too soon”.

I did give myself a time limit, although I don’t know whether I’d have stuck to it! I conceived DD2 six weeks before the point where I said I would stop trying, and continued to insist that if I had another mc then I wasn’t trying again.

With both mc they got to the point that the heart beat was visible successfully, so I’ve always questioned whether it was blood incompatibility (DD1 is rhesus positive but both me and DD2 are negative). But none of the tests were ever conclusive.

I used to hallucinate seeing DD1 with a little sister, so I was very determined it was going to happen. I wouldn’t have taken it well if a friend had suggested to stop.

My best friend looked after DD1 when I was in hospital for both mmc, she was there with unending support every single time. She must have privately wondered where it was going to end, but didn’t ever say it to me (this is the friend who was the only person to ask me whether I’d really thought it through before I married ex-H!! So she’s not one to hold back).

Maybe try shifting the focus of your friendship and encourage your friend to do some fun stuff?

I had many mc and they were awful but I needed my friends to remind me that life still needs living.

My DC wasn’t negatively effected by my losses, you can’t assume that the DC are aware.

There is also a feeling of being able to tell your DC, if an only that you tried your very best to have another.

Don’t say anything. I tried for 2nd for over 6 years, it was tough to conclude it, a friend telling me stop wouldn’t have changed anything tbh.

What an awful comment. You think they’d be ignoring their child while trying and hoping for another? You’re making her sound callous and neglectful and you have absolutely no idea about that but just making awful assumptions

I see exactly where you are coming from.
The child they actually have is being sidelined for The idea of a “baby”.
Sounds like it’s been happening for years too-
At least the husband is on board, but one hopes the child they have gets love and attention rather than the focus being on having a new baby.

Oh, this is so hard. I had three miscarriages in pretty short succession before my first child, and I remember absolutely raging when people told me I should take a break from trying and allow myself to rest and heal. I was absolutely not willing to hear that and found it monstrously insensitive. With hindsight - and with two children now safely here - I can see that they were absolutely right that I was working myself into an ever more desperate place, and that their advice was good. But might I have not had DS if I had heeded it?

It's much harder, too, as you note she's over 40. Having a break probably realistically means accepting it won't happen, which might be the right thing but is probably also an impossible thing for her.

I think you shpuld think: I can't understand her mindset, why she would be so set on having a second baby. Therefore, I am unable to walk in her shoes and unqualified to give advice to her.
You can step back from the relationship eith her, that is your right. But you don't have a right to suggest either way. It is too delicate a situation. Even if she did listen to you she might then resent and blame you for influencing her.

You can't tell her what to do. You can give advice or your thoughts if she asks.

You're allowed to feel how you feel though and I'd find it very draining. Does the being pregnant/ trying to conceive/ misscarriage dominate conversations? Even if it wasn't pregnancy related (eg. Difficulties with a spouse etc) I would find it hard to be around someone who was all consuming (about themselves).

Tbh you don't sound like a friend, needed to step back or reducing your level of support I get, but to tell her what she should be doing with her life, I really think is out of order

I voted YABU.

A friend went through 12 miscarriages and then took the extremely difficult and painful decision to terminate a pregnancy that would have led to the birth of a child with extreme deformities and a short life before conceiving and giving birth to 3 healthy children all of whom are now early 20s and late teens.

So who is anyone to tell another to give up hope?

You’re not unreasonable to feel that way, but it would be unreasonable to say anything. It’s her life.

Wishing you luck x

my musings - It’s not always egg quality or age. I’ve got APS. Conceived 5 times on the first try and once on the second. 4 miscarriages. Aged 36, 37, 37, 38 (living child), 41 and 42 (living child). Eggs good. Blood bad.

People are very quick to blame egg quality. Age. Weight. Ate an oyster. Ate some sweaty cheeses. So little is known about the causes of miscarriage though.

I also asked my specialist if I should carry on trying after my last miscarriage - she said to me absolutely yes. The treatment works and that she was absolutely sure that another baby was a matter of when, not if, for me. I think I would have given up at that point if she had said she thought I should. DH and I decided that it was a one last try though, and we had made our peace with that. Glad we did try though because we were lucky one more time.

40 years ago APS hadn’t been identified. Very recently things like huge doses of vitamin b, or extra folic acid. Even in the last 3 years there have been breakthroughs - progesterone is now more likely to be prescribed to women who have had 2 miscarriages, even without testing their levels - and successful pregnancy rates for women in that group have shown an increase.

I’m not surprised OPs friend isn’t ready to give up yet.

I would struggle in your position, too. That's four years of completely centring your friend in your friendship - friendships do need to be give and take, otherwise one is essentially just feeding off the other. You're not a friend so much as an emotional support bag. I have a family member who is constantly in crisis and it's exhausting. If she wasn't a blood relative, I'd have walked away a long time ago. If your friend is normally a good friend, then I'd continue to be empathic and supportive - and I wouldn't tell her what to do about her own fertility/child situation as that's overstepping - but I'd definitely back off a little, for your own sake.

Secondary infertility is horrendous because there is so little sympathy or support
it’s a sad team to be in

I think it must be horrendous to have a child and then suffer secondary infertility with so many unanswered questions as to why. She's absolutely in the midst of all the grief that comes with it and the trauma of all the loss and dashed hopes she faced. I don't think it's anyone's choice but hers and her husbands as to when enough is enough and I think it would be very unfair to tell her to stop or even suggest it. I think if you're worried about her then tell her how to support herself, how to access good trauma informed therapy, go and do hobbies with her that she can enjoy as a temporary distraction and come at it from that angle. I think you need to set your own personal boundaries with what you can and cannot do, and I'd talk to her in a supportive way about her mental health not mentioning the rest. I think realistically this is a particularly rough period of her life, it's probably deeply isolating for her and my feeling on it would be that if she's a good friend then you stick with her in whatever capacity you have left. The really sad thing is this won't last forever as the decision will be taken from her eventually and she'll have no choice but to come to terms with it all at some point or another (though hopefully with a successful pregnancy and a sense of closure) so I think I'd be trying to remember that the rough periods are when we most need our friends and none of us know what's around the corner. So many women lose friendships due to infertility and to me it's awful that that's a loss they need to take on, as well as all the rest of the pain.

Exactly!

In four years have you been able to talk about anything other than her TTC, pregnancies and miscarriages? Has she asked and listened to you about what's going on in your life?
How would you feel if there were another 4 years of this ahead?
(A friend once ghosted me. I felt devastated until I realised it hadn't been a friendship in a long time. I was utterly exhausted after every conversation and nothing I said mattered anyway. She only needed reassurance how awful things were for her and I agree that things were difficult for her. I still think of her and hope she found happiness but I do not miss the last years of our conversations at all).