State school 6th forms oversubscribed

It would make the school look a lot better if you did

This must be a very localised issue. The proportion of kids in private education in Year 11 across the country is tiny and not all of them will move to state provision for 6th form.

Your example sounds like a one off anomaly though.
My DC's school has a similar process for signing up for A Level, but they also make a point of telling their own students that they should sign up for sixth form as soon as they have received their GCSE results and that otherwise they can't guarantee choice of courses. Consequently most existing students are signed up before external ones have a chance and those that aren't are aware they run the risk of missing out on preferred courses.

In the example you give, I assume the school will give similar advice this year, and existing students (who satisfy entry criteria) who want places will get them.
Frankly, schools want their sixth form places filled asap after results day, they don't still want to be left with too many empty spaces come September. And students shouldn't be dithering on results day and leaving sixth form plans for days/weeks anyway, unless their results are hugely out of line wih expectations - they should know what they want to sign up for, and what Plan B (slightly missed grades) might look like.

This sort of happened locally.

Local state school is very highly regarded with small catchment at Yr7. Tends to have a small intake for Yr12 from private schools, thought to be primarily pupils who didn't get high enough grades to stay at private 6th Form. There are local grammars so a planned/conscious move would steer towards them if that makes sense.

The usual procedure at the state 6th Form is that they open sign-ups after lunch on GCSE results day and this continues until Seotember term starts. Last September, they closed the door to anyone 'new' at 2.30pm 9n results day as they had an unusually high number of private school pupils transferring. Never happened like this before.

An unexpected consequence was that existing pupils whilst having a space could not necessarily do the courses they wanted as there were only so many places per course and they were allocated in order or GCSE grade. This year they had more people transferring from private schools who had very good grades so they took the places.

I have one friend who is very sniffy about private schools, and was delighted by VAT, has seen her own daughter having to change school and do a 2.5hr round trip as she could not do the courses she wanted. We know of quite a few more pupils who stayed but aren't doing their first choice subjects.

Exactly we were told our year 11s a boom year but it’s tails off after that. So if it’s ok for the next two years the situation will only improve from then on.

There are also exciting new colleges doing courses - several friends kids have gone off to do media / niche courses which lead straight to the jobs they want. The strangle hold of graduates on the good jobs is waning. It’s all about apprenticeships now. Things are different to when we were at that stage.

This sort of happened locally.

Local state school is very highly regarded with small catchment at Yr7. Tends to have a small intake for Yr12 from private schools, thought to be primarily pupils who didn't get high enough grades to stay at private 6th Form. There are local grammars so a planned/conscious move would steer towards them if that makes sense.

The usual procedure at the state 6th Form is that they open sign-ups after lunch on GCSE results day and this continues until Seotember term starts. Last September, they closed the door to anyone 'new' at 2.30pm 9n results day as they had an unusually high number of private school pupils transferring. Never happened like this before.

An unexpected consequence was that existing pupils whilst having a space could not necessarily do the courses they wanted as there were only so many places per course and they were allocated in order or GCSE grade. This year they had more people transferring from private schools who had very good grades so they took the places.

I have one friend who is very sniffy about private schools, and was delighted by VAT, has seen her own daughter having to change school and do a 2.5hr round trip as she could not do the courses she wanted. We know of quite a few more pupils who stayed but aren't doing their first choice subjects.

There surely are not schools that contract at 6th form to the extent of only offering 1/4 of the places in y11? The grammars often expand at 6th form taking in more students. We have high staying on numbers though. As 18% of 6th formers are privately educated it’s clear most have gone from state to private. Not the other way round. This % might reduce now.

The idea most students quit private schools in y11 is unfounded. Why would anyone quit Wycombe Abbey or Harrow? Hardly anyone would. A small school with no 6th form is another matter but the best schools hang on to their dc.

They can’t change their entry requirements with that short notice.
Every year we have more students with exceptional grades from outside apply than we have room for. We can’t simply get rid of internal students with lower grades.

Not an expert in admissions criteria, but I'm fairly sure that state schools aren't allowed to select based on the students with the best GCSE results.

What they can do, is set minimum entry criteria to continue onto Post 16 courses. But that has been the case since ... well always.

If a current Year 11 student gets the required grades for Level 3 study, they will be able to go onto into sixth form. A private school student getting better grades won't influence that.

Sixth form open days are often packed. Private school students often move (or at least consider) moving to state at sixth form.

Most parents don't pay for independent schools all the way through. The majority start at 11 yrs old and therefore several extra £1000 (ie 8K extra) can (and is) a tipping point. We certainly can't afford it for 6th form

I've had my Y11 days.

Open Evenings full of kids who want a look around but won't ever go there.

Most kids in the UK don't go private.
Of those who do, most will stay in the Indy sector, VAT or otherwise.

Most state schools give places to existing students providing that they meet the grades no matter who else applies.

It is very unlikely that whether your child gets into the sixth form will be affected by mythical hordes of VAT refugees.

Every day someone posts another variant of panic about school places.

It's dull. And I shall say so.

I've had my Y11 days.

Open Evenings full of kids who want a look around but won't ever go there.

Most kids in the UK don't go private.
Of those who do, most will stay in the Indy sector, VAT or otherwise.

Most state schools give places to existing students providing that they meet the grades no matter who else applies.

It is very unlikely that whether your child gets into the sixth form will be affected by mythical hordes of VAT refugees.

Every day someone posts another variant of panic about school places.

It's dull. And I shall say so.

AIBU to be concerned about the impact the new VAT on private schools will have on state school 6th forms?

Our local 6th form open days have been jam packed with so many year 11s moving from private schools.

Issues I see:

1. kids who have been at the local state secondary school since year 7 have been told their space in the 6th form is not guaranteed and if they don’t get as high GCSE results as other potential pupils they will not have a spot. The nearest private schools have amazing GCSE results so very likely to displace existing students to other state school options a far distance from their homes.
2. infrastructure - the local school is already heaving so accommodating a huge influx is not possible, buildings are already crumbling and it will take a long time before investment actually happens to improve the facilities.
3. false economy- currently kids in private schools don’t cost the government to be educated. Government’s plans are that money raised from VAT will pay for additional teachers (but I don’t see that happening immediately). If lots of private schools kids move to the state system not only will government not collect that VAT, but they will all be liable for educating pupils who previously were in the private sector. I believe the current cost from central government to educate in 6th form is £5k with additional payments for more academic subjects (eg further maths A level pupils will equal an additional £900 per pupil per year in the state schools). Apologies if these sums aren’t correct.

https://inews.co.uk/inews-lifestyle/private-school-parents-vat-state-sixth-forms-3473062?srsltid=AfmBOopXOi5842QMq-qO1NqHGR9g9-4BOi6Gc0v_dlhBbFBTMmU5Prsi

There surely are not schools that contract at 6th form to the extent of only offering 1/4 of the places in y11? The grammars often expand at 6th form taking in more students. We have high staying on numbers though. As 18% of 6th formers are privately educated it’s clear most have gone from state to private. Not the other way round. This % might reduce now.

The idea most students quit private schools in y11 is unfounded. Why would anyone quit Wycombe Abbey or Harrow? Hardly anyone would. A small school with no 6th form is another matter but the best schools hang on to their dc.