To be annoyed that vegan options have replaced vegetarian?

No, that's the exact opposite of what I am saying - and of what I have been saying throughout the thread.

Do animals following carnivorous diets tend to use human restaurants?

Thank you for that, I'm going to have a look!

Ah sorry! I thought someone had responded saying that there's actually links between red meat and dementia, after that and I thought you'd responded to that one. But anyway, might be worth remembering that the vegan 'industry' is TINY compared to those lobbying you will, for people to buy more meat.

Studies are funded by those who have the power and the money.

You'll find arguments for both sides in anything scientific and the ones with more clout are almost always the ones heeded because they're larger, more heavily funded and make more noise so to speak. This applies to everything unfortunately. It's difficult to know what's actually right.

But although not that particular article, I've read up on credentials of academics involved and a lot of original papers are fairly easily accessed which I do tend to do if I care enough about something, and I am comfortable in my belief that eating red meat especially some types of processed red meat, are unfortunately not great for brain health. That's not the reason I wouldn't personally eat it, but it plays a part.

Some restaurants refuse to 'contaminate' vegan food with dairy. There's an example of this earlier in the thread. One reason suggested is that idiot militant vegans have shamed a restaurant (I can't remember which one) by posting video footage of 'contaminated' (i.e. improved) food.

Most vegan food in the UK tastes like cardboard. So sad when there are whole vegan cuisines to draw on from across the world. Vegetarian food used to be like this (God, nut cutlets!) but has looked around the world for ways to cook vegetables and dairy without meat or fish - frequently the vegetarian option is the best choice on a menu. Not so the vegan - and don't even mention vegan cheese.

The Cornish Vegan is lovely too ☺️

There are some very special vegan restaurants where I am sure vegetarians and meat eaters would be amazed at how good vegan food can be. If anyone is ever in Nottingham try a place called No. 12. It is wonderful - no fake processed stuff just delicious food served in a wonderful way. They really make an effort.

@Sacredhandbag I'm vegan and my husband and kids are vegetarian and I agree with you. It is lazy for some places to not do both vegan and vegetarian options, especially when you think of all the different meat dishes they do. Some restaurants are lazy - the vegan options are usually burger or chilli or something else that is a normal meal I eat at home - and the dessert is usually a bloomin brownie. No imagination. On the rare occasions I eat out I like to eat something a bit special that I wouldn't usually cook at home (ha ha I don't mean a chicken/cow before someone suggests that)

I'm confused! I was talking to the poster who said a vegan diet was "A sure way to early dementia"?

I' m vegan and I have been for wonderful afternoon teas. Some fillings for the sandwiches were carrot and hummus, fake beef slices and horseradish, tofu egg and cress, vegan Philly and cucumber. Oh there are lots you could have and lots of little vegan cakes - brownies, macaroons, fairy cakes and vegan scones with jam and vegan cream. Tea obvs and vegan Prosecco. Pfft. I'm staring at my PG tips and toast now with disdain.

I do eat meat but prefer to eat vegetarian for a variety of reasons and will always order from the veggie menu when out. I have found this, too, and also find it frustrating. I love cheese and butter, I don't like vegan "cheese" and I don't like the amount of processing a lot of vegan food goes through to replicate something that it simply is not. I don't want the vegan option, thank you, and it frustrates me that that's often the only choice now.

ETA: I'm also not posturing as some super healthy, "unprocessed food is the only way" poster child. I love sweets, biscuits, and crisps. I just used to work in the food sector and hearing how vegan 'bacon', for example, was produced by a manufacturer, and the ingredients that went into it, was enough to put me off (and I know real bacon is bad, too, before anyone starts).

I think that's just a way some people phrase things isn't it?

'I like my butter'
'I like my glass of wine of an evening'
'I like my little evening walks with the dog' etc?

https://www.neurology.org/doi/10.1212/WNL.0000000000210286
I haven't checked the credentials in fairness, of that particular study or its academics however it was literally the first result that came up when I Googled.

Could you point me in the right direction? I can only find stuff saying there's no evidence of a link or even a suggestion of the opposite effect.

I don't want to eat animal products but I'm terrified of dementia.

YOUR eggs? YOUR cream? YOUR butter? Get over yourself

Oh yes of course everyone who eats any processed food now and again suffers rrom a lack of intellectual ability. Direct correlation!

I 'd argue that that comment alone is one of the most idiotic things I've ever read.

I had better call the university who gave me my post grad and tell them they've made a mistake. I'll call work and tell them I'm far too stupid to be teaching a level 5 qualification, sorry for the confusion! 🧐

Totally agree. I wasn't in the trenches of trying to be vegetarian in the 90s, including on holiday in France and Italy, only for me to be denied cheese in the 2020s.

Slightly different angle on the issue but I don't like the taste/texture of cheese or scrambled egg so one of the benefits of going vegan from being vegetarian was that I could escape all the cheesy or eggy veggie options.

Only now they've put vegan cheese or egg on a lot of them 🤦‍♀️ Nooo!

Ermmm? The vegan food I make is not ultra processed. It's all cooked from scratch. I'm not vegan by the way but like vegan food. Only some vegan food is ultra processed such as the fake meats and cheeses. It's perfectly possible to be vegan and avoid ultra processed foods.

I’m a veggie and support vegan ideology so I’m glad there’s lots of vegan options. Everywhere I’ve been have been happy to put actual cheese on instead of vegan cheese if asked (husband doesn’t like vegan cheese). I’m more annoyed about fake meat being the default, it’s processed and lazy.

YANBU. I'm not veggie but I choose vegetarian options quite a lot.