To tell friend not to drive 4 yr old without car seat?

You really think that the bare minimum standards set by the government many, many years ago based on very scant understanding of safety are sufficient to keep your child safe?

You know it's legal to give a child alcohol from the age of 5?
Or that you can homeschool your child without telling anyone about it, and the local authority may or may not ever check up on their education?
Or that there is no legal restrictions on when you can leave your child home alone?
Or cot bumpers?
Or handing your child over to a random babysitter you found on facebook?

If you think because it's legal, it must be safe, then I would strongly recommend you brush up on your parenting knowledge before spending any time looking after young children.

Why can't they all fit in the car? Put 1 child in the front seat, 2 in the back with the other adult

Like cigarettes?

Oh calm down! If it was so unsafe it wouldn’t be legal!

Car seats protect their pelvis in the event of a sudden stop too as kids bones are as strong as adults hence them needing the seat for a lot longer. My nearly 4 year old is still rearward facing due to the internal decapitation aspect so no way she’s be forward facing without a seat if I can help it.

The rule of age or height really should be age related or height whichever is the latter in my opinion, it’s currently whichever comes sooner but a really tall 8 year old still doesn’t have the bone density of a very short 12 year old.

I get they are doing you a favour but I also think it puts your child at risk and I wouldn’t be happy to say ‘that’s fine’ personally. At the very least I’d look for a slimline booster seat. Also it’s not the comfortable thing but we’ve had my husband squeeze in the back between two car seats then the third seat can go in the front.

No way, I wouldn't let my 4yo go anywhere unless in a safe, rear-facing seat. We've had 2 emergencies when she had to travel without a seat in a taxi, but never if it could be prevented. I wouldn't ask them to take a separate car, I'd just say that you're not comfortable with her not in a seat and find alternative childcare.

It's definitely not unreasonable to say you feel uncomfortable, I'd be uncomfortable with a 4 yr old without a booster at least. However, i think it's also unreasonable to ask them to take 2 cars because they're doing you a favour as it is. I'd suggest talking to them, saying you're uncomfortable without a car seat and discussing some options (only 1 adult goes with them and then child can go in the front, a slim booster to go in the middle etc etc) and if none of that works then it's their choice to wither take 2 cars or not go.... It's definitely OK to say it's not safe, I've only just started doing middle seat no booster and I've got a 7 yr old and a 9 yr old.

The risk of submarining with a properly fitted booster is low. There are other very good reasons to prefer high back booster or other kinds of restraint for a 4yo, but submarining isn't one of them.

That's madness! The seatbelt wouldn't be in the right place on their body.

I wouldn't do it. The danger of your 4yo "submarining" under the belt - even a booster - is potentially lethal. "Oh but lots of things are dangerous" - sure, but I don't let my kid run across the road without looking cos they'll probably not get hit. One unsafe driver is all it takes for your kid to end up in A&E or worse.

It's an exception for when you can't fit three car seats across the back of your car. The oldest child is allowed to travel in the middle seat without a booster as long as they are over 3.

I'm really confused why you think it's legal to travel in a domestic car without a car seat? I just looked it up and can't see where it says that? Especially at 4 they need a car seat to be safe.

As a parent. Don't allow them free access to an unmonitored high building or lack of car seat. But also don't expect a family to adapt to their needs while doing them a favour. Find an alternative

It might be legal, but it’s far from best practice. I didn’t take my 4yo in taxis without a car seat either. again, just because it’s legal doesn’t mean you should do it.

dd was still in a 5 point harness seat at that age and not remotely ready to transition to a booster seat.

That isn't true.

I'd suggest trying it before the day so you don't get caught out last minute if it doesn't fit.

I would absolutely not be comfortable with this. When I’ve been your friend, we have taken two cars (what’s £2 extra in fuel vs a child’s life?) or I would put my own child in the middle and make sure the children I was looking after were seated securely.

I was going to suggest a Trunki Boostapak but I see you have already ordered the Bubblegum booster which does the same thing.

I don't think I would be hugely comfortable putting my 4yo in a backless booster for anything other than a short journey at low speeds (certainly not on A/M roads at 70mph). She is rear-facing in our car and we use a high back booster if getting lifts etc.

However, the backless booster is very handy, we use it all the time for our older child and his friends when lift/car sharing.

If she thinks it's perfectly safe, she'll be happy putting her own child in the middle instead. She won't though
I've had DC4 in a taxi before on a short journey with no car seat but never in the middle, we were always told growing up not to sit in the middle if we could help it as it's so dangerous.
She could alternatively put one of the seats in the front with the airbag off and her DH sits in that middle seat. We had to do a car seat in the front once with a van when moving house.

If it's a 3-point seat belt then just maybe, if it's a lap belt absolutely not, no way. I know someone who was in a serious car accident age 12, wearing a lap belt. He was practically cut in two, all the way back to his vertebrae. They had to put his bowel, everything back together, and he spent a year in hospital in a back brace.

I agree with PP that an adult should squeeze between the car seats in the back and the 4-year-old goes on a booster in front.

Absolute hard no from me. I would never, never let a four year old travel in a car without a proper high backed booster at the very least. I also wouldn't be asking them to take two cars, I would just find different childcare arrangements and be super nice to them but explain that you're not comfortable even though it's technically legal xx

You are absolutely not being unreasonable! There is no way I would let my children travel without a car seat.
I would tell them you are not happy with the seatbelt suggestion and if they aren’t happy to use two cars or for an adult to sit in the middle seat while your DC seat goes kn the front, then I would ask if they could do an activity which is a walking distance away.
I never understand when people say it’s a one off or a short distance. Accidents can happen anywhere.
Just because it is legal, doesn’t mean it is safe. The UK is way behind on car seat safety.

I live in a big city with no car, I take ubers regularly with my 6 & 4 year olds without carseats. Have been doing since my youngest was 2. You sit them down and tell them to lift their arms up, and the seat belt sits under their arms. If they aren’t going on a motorway I would be fine for them to be without carseats.

No this isn't true. The standards are ridiculously low