To not want my baby left alone with FIL

Nope - trust your gut. Furthermore it's upsetting and unsettling for you which is unacceptable.

From my safeguarding training, the majority of sexual abuse (some 80-85%) is carried out by someone known to the family (e.g. friend) or worse still a family member. This may sound dramatic but better to be safe than sorry...

As hard as it would be I would definitely cut ties. I’d tell my DH to see his weird dad alone!

I've read the whole thread and your updates and I think there's two separate issues.

The overstepping in terms of your wishes as parents and secondly, the behaviour you describe as predatory.

Your DH said he was passing him a towel. He wasn't showering with or showering the 10 year old. He was passing him a towel. The fact your DH has more insight into the events, and as a PP has said, what does the 10 year old make of it? My DD is 10 and would lock the door for her own privacy if she wanted to. The fact your nephew didn't shows that perhaps nudity (or assistance in the form of being passed a towel) would be fine and is normal within that family unit.

As to the other allegations, the sweets and the screen time, I think you need to chill. Assert your boundaries and be clear there will be no sweets and no screen time (although personally I think that's a bit over the top depending on the content) but it sounds like enthusiastic grandparent behaviour.

It sounds like you don't like the family at all and are looking for anything you can find to get the Mumsnet hoardes in agreement with you. Only you genuinely know whether your spider senses are tingling genuinely about predatory behaviour or whether this is you being unhappy.

I was abused as a child, so when I was reading your post, I was reminding myself not to project even though many of the behaviours rang alarm bells with me, and then I got to the part about showering - FUCK THAT. Do not let this man ever be alone with your child.

My son is autistic and does need a bit of help in the shower. He is 12. My in-laws have expressed that they feel uncomfortable with this, so my DS does not stay at their house overnight at the moment. Previously they had him to stay once a week. I'm desperately trying to get DS to be more independent in this area so that he can take part in school trips/sleep overs etc. it's not normal for an adult that isn't the child's parent to be comfortable showering older children.

All very annoying And weird

However, i have found that most elderly people in my family love to FEED utter SHIT to my kid

My parents. My parents in law, elderly aunts, GGrandparents

They seem to think they must buy sweets for a child when they seem them, like it's the law

Drives me mad

Your instinct alone is reason enough to prevent this, and you must as your child’s advocate. No need to justify why.

In what world is this standard grandparent behaviour??? I would have to disagree.

OP does your DH acknowledge the lack of regard and respect that FIL shows you? If he's on board with everything, then it needs to be him stepping in every time his own father crosses one of these lines. You shouldn't have to be voicing your opinions loudly if they are not just your opinions, but his as well.

I understand that your DH wants to put off dealing with it, but your FIL isn't going to sit and reflect on what you want and suddenly not do these things. You know in advance what he will do, and you know that once your son is weaned what he will do with that. You risk a big blowup and/or an awful atmosphere, neither of which are fair on you, when it's his dad who is the problem.

Is it possible that if you visit, that you don't visit when SIL is there with her kids? You are right that it will make it even more difficult with the ipad, sweets and farleys floating around.

YANBU. Your mums instincts should always be listened to and you are going about it the right way to protect your DS.

I feel sorry for the 10 year old child, isn't it the case where majority of abusers are relatives of the child?! I'm glad you're keeping an eye out for him as he may not feel comfortable in saying he doesn't want his grandfather standing there in the bathroom while he showers.

Stick to your guns... I would feel the same way as you!

If you do return in August You and DH have to agree that you quietly take steps to limit FILs behaviour. If you feel DH is not fully on board, stay home.

Up to your SIL if she's ok with the amount of sugary snacks and screen time for a 10 year old, but you'd prefer not to have this forced on your tiny DS by FIL.

If you do go. Plan ahead, Bring DS's own food to avoid the food issues, take little books or toys instead of screen time. Ensure you are both clear on the level of supervision you both are happy with eg DS sleeps in your room with you, etc... Have an exit plan just in case relatives kick off.

You and your husband need to sit down sometime and have a rational conversation about where the hard lines are, and what you individually are willing to adjust your approaches on during family visits.

Realistically, your normal approach at home won’t be totally rigidly replicated when you’re with others and there is always some adjustment. So agree together where that will be and what is a hard line for you as parents.

As an example, Your views on sugar and screen time sound like they are at one end of the range that covers most parents outlooks. You might agree together that at family get togethers you’re willing to adjust that approach. Same as a lot of parents have different standards for when their children are at parties vs at home.

eg. For us, chocolate biscuits are a grandparents house thing and we don’t have them at home. Haribo is allowed at parties but not at home. Pushing people around is never ok regardless of where you are.

Children can (and need to) learn that different rules apply sometimes in different places.

If it was me and I know its hard, Id be saying to DH “no we tackle it now and if you won’t then I will and you won’t like it” Lay dosn the lines snd consequences BEFORE your next visit!

We had a similar situation with MIL, luckily she lives abroad. DH is sometimes blind to her weird behaviour. I have been on every visit to supervise and provide a rational viewpoint, and she is never left alone with DS (though one time she basically kidnapped him when we were walking in the high street of her local town, when he was about 3). She will never have unsupervised contact. Ever. I know what she did to DH as a child. She's more than a few sandwiches short of a picnic that one.

There was a thread recently, where many posters recounted instances of abuse in their childhoods, often signalled by weird, strange, creepy behaviour by adults which wasn't called out. Children placed in vulnerable situations, and adults who should be protecting them, complicitly turning a blind eye. This man's behaviour is not just weird but it has red flags all over it. OP, someone needs to step up/step in and protect the children in your family. Your skin is crawling for a reason.

Edited to add link to the thread.
www.mumsnet.com/talk/relationships/5269293-dad-hanging-round-outside-bathroom?page=15&reply=142036034

Your response is correct and I fully agree, however don't just voice, actively put a stop to whatever it is he's wanting to do, if you don't agree with it.

Every single time.

If there's a fall out, your DH will have to step in and tell FIL to back off.

Well exactly. Maybe once a year, briefly at a push, with a backbone firmly in place to advocate for child. And no unsupervised visits. Anyone who DEMANDED my child without my presence would never be granted it. Only people I know, like & trust with my life and who may have offered but not demanded or pestered.

much easier to just not go.

I wrote a similar post a couple of years ago about my FIL being weird and crossing boundaries around my littles ones and giving me a horrible feeling in my stomach. Unsolicited opinions, weird style of play, all about him, weirdly confrontational about parenting decisions and too keen to be there all the time to ‘lend a hand’. I had lots of support on MN at the time too and just wanted to say that you are well within your rights to feel odd about him, and well within your rights to limit contact and definitely not have him do childcare. There is something so difficult when there is no smoking gun, it’s just a very present feeling of being ill at ease around this person. Trust your gut. Listen to your instincts. Even if there is nothing more sinister going on, I don’t think it’s good for small children to be around someone so unaware of other people’s autonomy and who is engaging in play that, consciously or otherwise, breaks down a child’s sense of boundaries and could leave them more vulnerable in the future. Good on you for voicing it. Keep listening to that feeling and if I were you, I would tell the other set of parents about the presence while showering. At best it’s invading that child’s privacy, at worst… something far more sinister is going on.

I'd be stepping the hell away.

My grandfather was a child abuser and all this boundary pushing with you and children in the family makes my hackles rise. It is sadly all too very familiar.

I would be communicating with the 10 year old's family.

The grandfather's behaviour is sinister, and nothing good can come from it, trust me. At the very least it's emotionally abusive, at worst physically/sexually.

Damage limitation. Maybe also check on his background - Claire's Law or similar. I bet he has form. I'd put money on it.

This! I’d never leave any of my children alone with the man described.

Not only this but I feel you need to set some firm boundaries - no offering piles of shitty sweet treats without checking with you first - and not in front of the kids as he’ll make you out to be a misery by saying no. Which is not on - how bloody dare he assume that his way is the right and only way!

Black and white thinking - has he got borderline personality disorder?

@LottieB1994 what does your dh say about all this???

You're the mum, you call the shots. End of. YADNBU. Stand your ground.

Trust your instincts OP. And a clear-cut message before your next trip.

“Hi FIL, just to let you know we are following a strict weaning process with our child so please do not offer them any food. We will provide all food for child during our stay with you. If you don’t want to agree with this we can move our visit to a later date. I don’t want any discussions about this please, we are following health professional and NHS guidance. Like-wise we will not be allowing screen time until child is over 3. So please do not offer any screens to child during our visit. Thank you”