Want my abusive violent son out!!

I grew up in local authority care. It was a group home of around 50 children aged from 4 to 16.
We had many children like the op son come in over the years. Thinking they were the boss and that they could do anything they liked.
It usually didn't take them long to realise that they couldn't without consequences.
The staff didn't need to do a thing, the older children sorted them out. With kindness where possible but would give back as good as they got if they turned violent. No one was allowed to get away with bullying
I can only ever remember a couple who could not be sorted out and they ended up being sent to a reform school.

@ExpensiveBiscuits Yes people do abandon their children. OP can do that. But it is a criminal offence. I have no idea if CPS would prosecute, but it would show up on a criminal record as child abuse if they did.

Do you not think she is suffering comeback-and violent comeback at that- at the moment.
Let them send her letters, give her court dates-at least she'll be in one piece.

@Lightuptheroom

Do you mean getting him on the school role would just be a technicality and he wouldn't actually be in school? I hope so

Because the safety of the class teacher and other pupils should absolutely not be put at risk by allowing this person into the classroom.

The greater good has to be considered and if it is for the greater good that this male is not in school, then that's what has to be done. He suffers a lack of education or the others-adults and children-suffer a loss of safety.

The greater good of 30 other people is far more important than the greater good of 1.

OP I said upthread Inform your younger childrens school about the effect on them too
They will have a safeguarding lead at school who will refer to CS also
I had a similar situation with DS1.. he was eventually removed and accommodated because of physical abuse towards DS2 and DS3.
This was 20 years ago and I realise services are more stretched now
Start the chain from your younger DCs safety upwards.
You may get some action there.

Easy for you to say whennits not your child
And you can't just abandon a child with no comeback on your self.

@MrsSkylerWhite Bad wording on my part.. I mean it's essential that he's put back on a school roll so that the departments who may be able to help don't think that he's being electively home educated. No one can drag a teenager into school, but if they're not on roll anywhere and EHE should have ceased to be recognised, then its another gap he's falling down.
I do work with oppositional youngsters every day as my job, so I have a very good understanding of just how difficult it can be. By remaining EHE, the local authority has no liability to provide education.

What does he do all day as not in school? Does he use a play station, wander the streets, have friends, pets, what?
Do you work and leave him at home? What does your elder son think is the cause and cure?
You haven't really said much about him, whether he has interests etc.

Also I'm sure you already have, but look up PDA profile of autism. If demands are what is causing the explosions I would reduce them to the absolute minimum, or really none if at all possible. You can't parent him in a normal way currently, and if trying to make "good" choices for him is causing violence it's just not worth it unless it's something absolutely essential, and then approach it very delicately, maybe over text message would sometimes be easier too

A child once came into my colleagues class with a note from his mum asking them to call social services as she could no longer cope with his behaviour (different but very bad) they picked him up at home time. I’m not saying do that, but it can be fast if there is an emergency. I think OP is the emergency here he’s hitting her and she can’t stop it /has no protection. Jmo

Is your MP any good?

In the light of damaging other children-and you of course-you cannot have a violent male living with you, especially as you suggest he is mentally ill.

I'd be inclined to just put him out-let the authorities shriek as they will. You cannot risk your life-let alone the lives of your other children.

You cannot and should not risk the lives of your other children in order to keep a home for him. What can they do if you refuse to have him in your home-they'll have to put him somewhere.

It's not ideal but if it comes down to choosing the life of your other children and yourself over providing a home for him-you really do have to choose the former.

If the police can get involved, that will be even better for the sake of any young women who might be tempted to be his girlfriend-at least they will know that he is a violent, dangerous thug.

It will be hard to wash your hands off him but I think that's what you are going to have to do,

If you've not voluntarily chosen to homeschool the local authority have got to find a way to sort alternative provision.

It's different if you have said you will homeschool as you've volunteered but if you've been forced into it you need to fight it.

Get social services involved.

Currently I would focus on trying to break the habit and resetting things. Ask him to write down or tell you a list of things you do that upset or annoy him, tell him to be completely honest, that you won't get upset or angry. Then go through it with him, look for a way to avoid each situation.
Such as needing to shower, tell him to pick 2-3 days a week where he sets an alarm on his phone and he decides when to have them.
You telling him to do school work - have a conversation about whether it actually needs doing at this age. His mental health and behaviour is so severe it may be easier waiting until he's a bit older and doing maths/English gcses via college courses. (Or realistically there's access to that in prison too if this carries on)
Food - give him a budget each week, let him plan what he wants and cook it himself with the offer to have family meals if he wants.
Not spending enough time together- ask if he will show you how to play a video game he likes and see if you can bond a bit that way.

Currently the only real priority is improving his mental health and avoiding the violence. Everything else isn't worth a battle.
And give lots of reassurance about loving him, even if you're understandably not feeling that way currently. It's likely he's aware of the damage its caused to your relationship with him, and hurting children will generally lash out whether emotionally or physically.

There is so much inaccurate information on this thread. OP you need to call social care, if it helps write everything down first, at many incidents and patterns as you can remember, anything involving injuries to you or the other children, threats, damage to property, use of weapons, etc just because MASH assessed as further intervention not required once, it doesn't mean they will again, it could also be that the GP didn't include all of the relevant detail. Tell them you are unable to keep yourself, your other children and this one, safe. Also when he is violent you do need to call the police.

@Lyn348 In fairness no outside agency can help if OPs son refuses to engage with them. She has had youth workers at her house that her son refused to talk to.
Also this behaviour clearly did not come out of nowhere. That means either something happened to trigger this. Or there were issues when he was very young that OP ignored. We really do not have the full situation here.

I am so sorry they could not help you.
I have had some involvement with MARAC in a work capacity in the past and those they work with experience a terrifying level of violence. The MARAC I was involved with had so many cases that it only supported those experiencing serious violence. It may not be the same everywhere though.
MARAC does deal with child to parent violence though.

The four criteria for a referral to Marac are:

• visible high risk
• professional judgement
• potential escalation
• repeat referral

Oh and you are absolutely, absolutely NBU to think that there should be moresupport available to you.

Sorry op and sorry mumsnet for what i am going to say.
But if my son attacked me i would attack him back.
However Id scare him to the point id scare myself.
Come at me with a slap i send 2 right back.
Because not everyone is going to take his crap no matter what age he is or how big of a man he thinks he is.
Id kick him out end of and stand my ground and id let social workers know about it.
You wouldn't take it from any other adult so dont take it from a young man even if he is your child.
Op your not at fault here and your not horrible or awful.
Some have kids and they are raised with the best but still turn in to twats.

So what's going on with him then @Whatayear2023? Children don't behave like this for no reason. When did the problems start? What triggered the school refusing? Where's his dad?

I sounds awful for you but also awful for him and he needs help whether he wants it or not.

Has the OP actually said she's got younger children? She mentioned an older one.

OP it sounds like your son has been completely failed and as a result you and your other kids are now being put in danger. You should never have been pushed into feeling you had to home school him, it's extraordinarily clear that that was never going to be successful.

He is being completely failed by anyone who would state he couldn't be autistic when they haven't even met him. Unfortunately if you don't give the 'right' information (and who is supposed to know as a parent what that information is) then they will just say that he doesn't meet criteria. I would strongly suggest he doesn't meet criteria because you/he haven't been asked the right questions.

This is a 13 year old kid that has for years needed specialist help and not one fucker is interested in doing that, not school, not the NHS, not SS, not the police. Then we wonder how we end up with kids like Axel Rudakubana. It's because no one is interested in helping and parents are just left to try to deal with children that have been going more and more off the rails for years and years.

I'm really sorry OP, your whole family have been completely and utterly failed.

I said you can't just 'put your child in care' because you can't. You can ask for them to be accommodated and work through the process of assessment and engaging with support prior to that decision being made, and it might be the outcome, but lots of people think you can just drop your child off at the office and that's it. You can't.

@Lightuptheroom

Put in an In Year Admission application and get him back in school, schools cannot 'off roll' pupils, it's illegal.

How do you suggest OP “gets him back in school”. He refuses to go. Is OP supposed to somehow physically drag him there?

If you’ve not had an oppositional child, you’ve no idea how difficult they are.

Sorry this sounds awful, does he have an outlet for his aggression? Young men should be playing sports all day to tire themselves out and give them some purpose. Can you send him off to every sports club available and say if his attendance there is good he will get pocket money.