Aibu to want men to walk in front

I’ve had that I was somewhere in the pitch black navigating with phone torch ( rubbish by the way so now carry a decent torch and this bloke was following me. I stepped aside fumbling for my keys as you do. He must of known he’d startled me and said so sorry I’m not scary and vanished off into the darkness

I’ve certainly had a couple of men be very aggressive when I’ve crossed the road to avoid them, or stood to let them go past me. Obviously that’s a tiny minority.

Where have I done that? I'm absolutely not shaming women into ignoring their survival instincts. I'm just saying that not all men are going to be aware that this is taking place in their minds, and its not their fault.

Awww, bless 🙄

Many men are blindly unaware that most women in this situation (low light, isolated area) will be in a state of hyper-vigilance. They move through the world very differently to us, and it will never have occurred to them not to walk somewhere, or park somewhere, or take late night transport, because it would never have occurred to them that any of those things could be dangerous.

They’re not taught to have that automatic risk calculator ticking away sub-consciously from a young age - they’re not reflexively on high alert when someone is walking just behind them, so they’re oblivious to the effect on women when they do it.

DS (raised in a feminist household to be aware of issues that affect women) had a Damascene moment as a late teen when one of his female friends told him none of the girls would come to a particular pub because it would have meant taking a late train home and they would feel unsafe. He was astonished, and you could see his sudden realisation that he and his male friends lived in a parallel universe, where they could move around freely and unthinkingly because pretty much no place or situation held any fear for them - why would it?

With men in woods, I tend to just stand to one side, fiddle with dog lead, laces or whatever, and let them get well clear of me. If a bloke was being misguidedly polite, I’d insist and say I’d prefer for them to go ahead. It’s shit all round for everyone, really, isn’t it? But unfortunately the world we live in 🤷‍♀️

How many men, do we think, have any idea that women worry about this? All the time?

I am the mother of a 25 and 15 yo and have had this discussion more than once with both of them.
They both understand why women (especially lone ones) may feel nervous and know how to behave accordingly. That said, we've only talked about it in urban settings, not out in the woods or across the fields. I'm not sure what the answer is there. If they are going about their business, enjoying the peace and solitude then what should they do?

Not all women worry about this all the time though. I go out alone a great deal, and am not at all worried about being attacked by a man. It is rare where I live, I'm more likely to go over on my ankle and end up in a ditch, or get dive bombed by the local buzzard, or get jumped on by a dog (now that DOES annoy me, but that's a whole other thread).

For what it's worth, amidst all the man-hating stereotyping that will no doubt arise on this thread, my DF is afraid to walk near women due to his own fear of being accused or thought of being intimidating.

This & the threat of actual harm is what puts me off walking in quiet places alone.

I'm not saying you should avoid it.

Men should have a curfew!!

I go for walks all the time and I have found that most men will take the initiative and either walk ahead or say hello or something as reassurance as they are aware that women can be nervous in these circs..
But your reaction is quite normal and I would definitely do or say whatever you need to in order to feel ok.

It’s perfectly fair. Please don’t try to shame women into ignoring their survival instincts.

I can't stand this either. My dad is in his late 70s and if he's out walking he will make a point of crossing the road if he's behind a lone female. He's good that way.

I understand, I sometimes feel similarly in secluded places.

Some men are aware of it and act accordingly, and some men aren't.

That's not their fault, it's just that people are different, hear and understand different things, and you can't put your expectations onto strangers. It won't be on some men's radar at all and that doesn't mean they are bad people, it just means it hasn't come to their attention.

What is in your control is to simply try to raise awareness by talking about the topic with the men in your life.

My mother told me from an early age to stop and let a man past so that will inform my thinking of course. Generally it never bothers me as I live in a very very low crime rate area and probably am not in situations where I’m alone in the dark. However if I am and I feel safer letting a bloke past then I will do if only to not have that awful jolt of adrenaline you sometimes get.

It sounds like they're not the only one with a confrontational mindset

Of course not @saraclara

It was a point about me, not the bloke behind me.

but I wouldn’t expect many men to preempt that walking in a busy built up area at 8:45 in the morning could also be threatening

Indeed, @ComtesseDeSpair. But my point was that this kind of heightened perception seems to be hard-wired into us. I have never (touch wood!) been attacked by a man, day or night, yet I still have this instinct. And I think it is an instinct for women.

I hate this
Men exist in the world
Sometimes they will be behind you, they can't always just walk past. And if they suddenly sped up to walk past you then they'd get accused of trying to scare you by walking too close/making you think they were charging you etc.

It's not a fear all women have. It's not hard wired into us.

If anything I'd rather he was behind where I could hear him tha in front where he could duck into a doorway or something and then grab me...

"I'm not a predator, so why are you treating me as such" - Do people actually say this to you, or is it just what you think they're thinking.

If anyone is behind me I always step over to the side and let them pass as I don't like anyone walking behind me, man or woman.

I took my car into the garage this morning, and walked home at around 8.45 am (so light, people around walking past, 2 schools to walk past, and near two busy roads). But I still had to cross over as there was a bloke walking behind me, very close and it just made me feel so uncomfortable.

No man should have to be second guessing whether they should be walking behind a woman in broad daylight with loads of other people around. That's an entirely unreasonable expectation.

I think most men know to be cautious about walking too close to women after dark, but I wouldn’t expect many men to preempt that walking in a busy built up area at 8:45 in the morning could also be threatening. In the same way that when I’m out running in the park I’m not actively thinking about whether every person I come up behind might be blind or deaf or disabled or a PTSD sufferer and whether they’re feeling panicked or likely to be surprised or startled or thrown off balance by me thundering up behind them on the path like the four horsemen of the apocalypse - though it has happened.

I do when it's possible, but out walking in the countryside on paths it's not an option

There's no way of completely removing the perception of threat and discomfort/fear that women feel when out walking. All blokes can do is try to minimise it.

I think some men are aware - I've had a few nen pass me, sometimes saying, "It's OK, love. I'm not following you". It's not said nastily, far from it. I think if you hear footsteps and turn to see who it is, they will also try to pass you so you're not worried.

Quite a few that I know are very aware. My husband who must look not dodgy was once asked by a woman to walk with her as she had a man walking behind her who she felt uncomfortable about.

it’s why I’m always curious when men want to „be“ women. What you want to have a constant low level fear that you are going to be assaulted. And I know it’s more complex than that of course.

Unless they are being an obstruction or actually barging into people, nobody needs to consider "what their physical being might be doing to impact on others", when they go for a walk.

It's all imaginary anyway. Going in front or behind offers no protection from a real attacker, but getting paranoid every time you come across one of 50% of the population just going about their own business will impact your mental health.