Waiting for the right guy equals no baby

We don't need to increase birth rate.

It's around 20% of people who don't end up with children rather than 30-40% and many of those will be through choice and not circumstances.

100% better to never have a child than to give a child a useless father for the sake of yourself.

But that doesn’t mean the woman can’t be an amazing mum!!!

I don't think sperm donors are the best option.
I would want my child fathered by a man that I felt physically attracted to because that at least is some indication of immune system compatibility.

Nah, you’re an incel who thinks women owe him sex.

Oh I do - graph provided for your convenience.

Birth rate doing ‘just fine’ means that even though we are having less children, it’s still not having enough of an impact to stop the rapid growth of world population. We need to have even less, not more.

Like it or not, any children born this century will struggle for resources of all kinds because there isn’t enough for everyone. So being born into a good situation is perhaps the least we can give them. Of course women will always have children in challenging circumstances, but why deliberately choose to put your child in challenging circumstances from day 1?

Families used to have 8 children and count on a few not making it, a big purpose of having children creating labour for the household as soon as they were old enough. It’s still the case in some of the world. I don’t think many of us would choose this family set-up now.

We may be having far less children in Europe but some other parts of the world are still having plenty, with many born into extreme poverty and few prospects. Having seen this, parents selling their children off for money etc… Just, no.

There’s ‘less than perfect’ and then there’s this.

Lots of women use sperm donors, you don’t have to have a man to have a baby.

I think it’s better to use a sperm donor rather than have children with a man you don’t love or don’t see a genuine future with. Adoption is also an option. I’m not saying any of these options are easy, they certainly aren’t, but it makes me really sad that women feel so pushed into a corner to settle for any old bloke because they fear their biological clock is ticking.

This is terrible alt right and patriarchal propaganda. Women are not incubators.

And we need to not reduce this debate further by linking it to cost of living and lack of child care. These are issues for the women who have children but improving them won’t result in women choosing to have more babies. The reason most women don’t have a child is because they are choosing their best life. One that doesn’t involve hitching themselves to any man and one that gives them the fulfilment they want. Birth rates don’t rise with improved standards of living and free childcare. They reduce.

This isn’t a women’s issue it is a man’s issue. They need to up their game to show women they can be a benefit to them and that will ensure their partner has a full life if she wants it. One that is not centred around his need and children’s needs.

Again women are not incubators and we are not the problem. We don’t need to make bad choices for ourselves to compensate for the failures of others.

You only need to scroll through the trending threads here to see how many children are born in to completely inappropriate circumstances. To parents where 1 or the other is a total fucking nightmare.

And so yes, in order to spare that child a life of misery and an adulthood full of expensive therapy bills, sometimes it is just better to not have the children.

This is exactly what I was going to write.

My husband isn’t Mr. Perfect, but I knew that he would make an excellent father, husband and I loved him.

I dumped my Ex as I knew he would have made a dreadful father/husband. As I knew I wanted kids I put ‘good father/husband’ on the top of my list. Any man who wasn’t ready for marriage/kids was immediately skipped.

Finding the right person to have kids with IS so important. You owe it to them

Freeze your eggs if you are under 35 is my advice. I have a good husband (and thank my lucky stars I didn't fall pregnant to any of my exes); we may or may not have the baby I had hoped for (IVF), but I know I won't be bringing a child into this world under unstable circumstances.

I thought of donor sperm when I was in my thirties (had not thought about freezing my eggs unfortunately), thinking I don't want to miss the boat. My parents advised against it, and as several PPs have indicated, a child is entitled to happy, unbroken parents and a healthy upbringing.

It's jaw dropping naivety to think that this is a good thing.

I wonder how many of us come across really nice men when we were younger but they are invisible, quiet and not necessarily the type to sweep us off our feet and we overlook them for something more exciting. When the time comes for someone steady these types aren't around anymore and there are only the deadbeats and the dangerous types. Years ago I dumped my BF of 4 years for something more exciting, my wilderness years as I call them. After a string of exciting but selfish types I had a moment of clarity when I was ill with flu in my grotty bedsit and phoned up my old BF, he was around within 2 hours with medicines and soup, that was 35 years ago.

As to thinking you can settle down and have a family with a deadbeat, I wouldn't. it's only going to lead to unhappiness. I would rather remain single than be a single mother or one with a hopeless partner As to repopulating the planet, I don't think that's a problem. Back in the 90's the UK had a population of 56M and now it's closer to 68M and predicted to be 72M in the next 10 years. This planet doesn't have a global warming problem, it has an over population problem.

I dont think the OP necessarily suggests getting a kid with a drug addict homeless abuser. But a lot of women are waiting for someone who would never happen - or might not even exist. Also, as a child of a crappy but loving dad - thanks God my mum had me. He wasn't the best dad and was a shitty husband, but I still love him and happy he is my dad. (My dad never abused anyone or done anything awful - he was a cheat and a fantasist, and did not earn much. But he did spend time with me and I have lovely memories from my childhood).

Blessed be the fruit loops for they know not what they say.

It's not "daft". Statistics about the global population show a significant and consistent increase. See the graph upthread.
Europe? Not what we're talking about because in the OP's first post she refers to the "race" being doomed. It's not.

Don't be daft. It's gone down in most developed European countries.

Is that you Matt Walsh?

The Right Wingers : Women! Stoop being picky! It's YOUR fault we have a population decline. I mean, we know it's an issue with housing and men not wanting to settle down as well, but come on, it's mainly down to you wanting your stupid independence and careers and having more choice that's the problem.

Also Right Wingers Women! Start being more choosy with who you pick as a father! You're just not picking the correct men so no wonder you get treated terribly! It's not the responsibility to pay for you and your DISGUSTING single-motherhood is that misfortune befalls you.

Women did used to be less picky, and the result was sometimes a whole life of misery and sometimes abuse at the hands of their partners.

There basically aren't enough good or suitable men to go around it seems, so instead of having children, women are choosing to be childless instead, like me.

I can see what you’re saying.

Countless women write on here that leaving their husbands and partners was (altho sometimes extremely difficult) the best decision they made and are so grateful they’re the parent that gets to watch their child/ren grow up. I doubt they’d have chosen to get rid or not have had them if they could have seen what the future had in store. What you’re saying is if a woman wants a baby she should have one while she can and take the gamble that the bloke will be a good partner and father rather than wait so long she will never be a mother. I have several friends who waited and it’s now too late for them - they have suffered with their mental health as a result.

I guess an alternative would be to cut out the middle man (and potential for future complications and nastiness) and go to a sperm bank so no father is involved.

The children don’t have to grow up in poverty. Children of single mothers usually are positive about the love and care they received despite difficult circumstances. These were women who were usually thrust into that situation through no fault of their own. If the mother actively chose to have a longed for baby and had the right finances and support, why shouldn’t she choose to go it alone?

This!

This. It is a matter of desires trumping rights, to me.
The human race will be just fine.

The planet is remarkably adept at survival.

Oh no. What a fucking shame that is.

who cares? What of the future do you think you own

there are WAY too many humans on the planet and with the exception of the giant panda (who I am suspicious is a sort of joke animal) no species, ever, has gone extinct because they stopped making babies. Even pandas haven’t managed it

I do sympathise but isn't that just life? We don't all get what we desperately want and ultimately if that depends on someone else, we're not owed it.

If you don't get your dream job it's not incumbent on the employer to give it to you. A man might desperately want a girlfriend but no woman owes that to him.