To think the young are less interested in sex, relationships and children

How young are we talking?

I think the reality is modern dating is a shit show but I still think most people want a partner.

But to your point on romantic relationships being a central source of joy - it really depends on your experience.

I found dating and relationships to be my main source of misery.

Once I exited the world of romantic relationships I discovered a sense of peace I had not had in decades.

Oldest (16) definitely interested in relationships, indeed is in one, but says at the moment they don't think they'll want kids and I'm not going to bet that will change.

DS (13) and still more like a kid than a teen is a bit young for all this, but I suspect is the likelier of my two to want to be a parent. Whether he'll get the chance, I don't know. I do feel it's going to be tough out there for his generation - the fact is women are becoming more aware that traditional relationship dynamics offer a good deal for men and a crappy deal for them, so I guess I want to prepare him to offer a better one.

Of my niece and nephew (21 and 19 respectively), I think niece is interested in relationships and imagine kids, nephew much less so, although he is also autistic - not that that rules out an interest in relationship or kids, of course.

@Dappy777 Yes and it's still in them despite the world changing around them, most of my parents generation of couples are still all together but have had unhappy marriages. Even though it's acceptable to leave now, they can't do it. They seem to feel this shame (about divorcing) and loyalty to their husbands no matter how unhappy they are. Definitely putting everyone elses needs and wants above their own.
I'm so glad women can get out of relationships and marriages much easier now. Life is short, no way should we be unhappy. No way should we put up with grumpy men, sex pest men, critical men.

I can understand why young people don't want to have children considering the world we live in, cost of living, housing crisis etc...but if raising children is made so shit and difficult that it puts people off having them totally, is not really a free choice is it? It's a sensible choice considering all factors but it's not a particularly positive choice. We're still mammals at the end of the day with an urge to procreate...

And it wouldn’t be good for the resulting kids either.

I know very well that I’d have absolutely hated being a parent, so my having kids ‘for the greater good’ would have been an utterly terrible idea.

But it’s not their responsibility. You shouldn’t be pushed into something you don’t want because of government inability to budget.

I have 3 young adults. 20, 18 and 16. Non of them have had a partner so far. Not even a hand holding playground type thing. I do worry it will get harder as they get older

In the past, having children was needed by communities as the elderly needed to be supported. Now, in richer countries, people rely on the state to fill that role. In fact the state does this by importing people to shore up its tax base to support its elderly, and I suspect a good many of the same people complain about this.

It's stating the obvious but a therapist is going to see a disproportionate amount of people in unhappy relationships because of the nature of her work. Same on here. People talk about problems, not successes.

I think my maternal grandparents' marriage would not have survived these days. My paternal grandparents' marriage might have. My parents were very happily married for over 50 years until my father died.

I'm twenty years in. Lots on here would have told me to go, if they'd known what was going on some years back. I decided to stay, and that has worked out.

@brassandswitch

We need relationships and partners to reproduce

This is true, but I think the younger ones are realising they don’t need to reproduce. Previous generations were almost expected to have children, and I’m glad the younger generation are being taught there is far more to life.

Yes I think it is changing, but I don't think it's a good thing. We need relationships and partners to reproduce. That's what we are here for, if it continues, the population will decline hugely, not that that's a bad thing. I also think a lot of people nowadays aren't pressured like they used to be to get married and have children and aren't getting the urge till much older. I'm 28, been with my DP 6 years and perfectly happy, I want to get married and have children but I'm not pressured to do it, so will do it in my own time. Majority of our friends are still living at home and are not married, as they simply can't afford it. It's also due to the cost of living

I fully understand consent but it’s the ability to retract consent at a later date that complicates things.
DS has admitted that he felt very uncomfortable at some of the parties he attended in his mid teens, where he witnessed boys taking advantage of girls who were passed out with drink and/or drugs. He extricated himself from the group, the popular, cool kids at school, because he just lost all respect for them. He is now very protective over female friends and has the confidence to step in if they look as though they are no longer able to make a conscious decision. He was spiked a couple of years ago and ended up in A&E due to an injury he sustained while out of it. He has always said that it could have ended so differently and would hate to be the one that failed to prevent a tragedy.

His group of friends look after each other. Frequently acting as a taxi if someone finds themselves alone and stranded. He would never forgive himself if he could have prevented an event and has stayed with a friend if they are so drunk that they are at risk. He’s brought a few home, knows the risks and will ask for help. I have no problem looking after them. I would have a problem if he had left them on their own.

Depends why I supposed.

If it's greater freedom and more money to do thing like travel ( though my Dad and Uncle in 60s with some mates travelled round Europe in a back of a van) then good.

If it's because they can't move out of parents house - so dating hard - or same in multiple occupy housing or feel they have to focus on educational and career development to afford to do any adult things like have own place or marry or have kids - clearly not good - same with long work hours and or commutes so less time to do socialisation.

On Trigonometry saw a demographer - her research base was USA where cohabiting couples mostly split unlike in Europe and UK - say an unspoken influence on low birth rate was divorce and parental separation or blended families and the affected on those now adult kids - I image unhappy marriages would have similar effects. Saw South Korean young people giving the usually many reasons but also saying they didn't want to be as stressed as their parents and felt so traumatised by their pressured schooling they didn't want to put any kids though that.

Plus place to meet people - have they been on the decline pubs/clubs closing- and have social factors about approaching people when out or in workplaces changed?

MN does tend to be very much everyone married is unhappy as are all mothers - always the refined he'll leave you'll end up lone parent - there a strain of that idea in wider media - and so many men do bug out on parenthood leaving women doing bulk of childrearing and baring the cost so risks are high for women.

Also infantilization of young people in society - things like marriage and parenthood being seen as desirable at older and older ages on top of financial pressures. We met at 18-20 married 26-28 and first child 28-30 - for our parents all married and with kids by early 20s we were too young - it was too soon.

Yes same, but 90% of those relationships are shit, full of resentment and unhappiness, because they've stayed together because they thought they had to. I'm so glad it's different now.

I think they've looked at all the relationships of people the generation above them and realised how easy it is to fall into the wrong relationship, which can bring more problems than joy to your life.

Took me till my 50's to realise that so if people are discovering that younger, good for them!

The generation above me still by and large had longer lasting relationships.

I live in the same area and don't have a huge family but those I do have I'm close to. I have friends but I find vast majority of my friends and acquaintances are all consumed with family events.

I'm suspicious that it might be connected to the separate issue of fertility declining - yes, through delayed parenthood but also linked to endocrine disrupting chemicals.

Honestly, I think those who rely very heavily on family for human contact to a large extent are those who still live in their hometowns, and/or who haven’t expanded their lives far beyond that.

Yes. If @Comedycook & everyone she knows have stayed in the same area it would make sense.

I see my father & sister every 2-3 months, my brother & his family once or twice a year & the same for cousins - the ones I’m in touch with. I see much more of friends & neighbours. If we all lived in the same area maybe it would be different.

@User32459 I go out to different bars and it depends how drunk they are and what culture they are.

Yes, but presumably you’re friends with this group because of your similarly gloomy mindset? I mean, Sophocles said ‘Not to be born is best’ and Francis Bacon was the one who coined the phrase ‘hostages to fortune’ in the 1600s. It’s not a new thing, yet people still have children.

I was born in the 80s and, yes, it was very cruel of my parents!

The 90s was a time of hope though. Ever since 9/11 the world has spiraled out of control.

Honestly, I think those who rely very heavily on family for human contact to a large extent are those who still live in their hometowns, and/or who haven’t expanded their lives far beyond that. Which is fine, obviously, but it’s not my world, or that of many people I know. I’m very fond of my family, but I don’t rank blood relationships above the ones I chose. There will be far more unrelated people at my funeral.

DS (an only child with no cousins on my side as all siblings are childfree, and much younger than his cousins on DH’s side, as DH is the baby and his nephews and nieces are having their own children now while DS is only 12) sees us modelling strong longterm friendships along with family contact, and will see you don’t need a blood tie for longtime mutually-supportive relationships.

So many different views and experiences here!! Just goes to show it’s hard to make generalisations or really know what is behind the trends. One thing said up thread is that the concepts around raising children have changed, which I think is true. So, many couples seem to think they shouldn’t have them unless they can provide constant attention, expensive activities and multiple holidays a year. Plus paying for education etc. When really a lot of children probably fared better in the old free-range style with one cheap seaside trip a year, and making their own way after school.