Please or to access all these features

AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

To be really glad I don't live in America right now

806 replies

AnonymousBleep · 31/01/2025 09:57

I really feel for ordinary Americans. It's bad enough on this side of the Channel, hearing daily about Trump's latest petty, spiteful, idiotic bullshit - that rant against the Bishop who asked him to have mercy on immigrants, the ridiculous and insulting attempt to blame 'diversity' for the plane crash - but living under it must be so much worse. And heaven help you if you're LGBT or a woman. Or an immigrant. Or not white. Or poor. Or anyone else Trump and his freakshow of a government despises. I moan about the UK all the time, like everyone else who lives here, because god knows it's far from perfect, but at least we don't have a government in charge who is trying to strip huge swathes of the population of their rights and citizenship.

OP posts:
Thread gallery
22
AnonymousBleep · 05/02/2025 11:08

SernieBanders · 05/02/2025 11:05

what a lot of assumptions you are making.

what a lack of solutions you are proposing

what a lot of pretending the status quo is ok - you are doing.

I'm not a politician and can't solve the Israel/Palestine problem but the USA ethnically cleansing Gaza is - CLEARLY - not the solution. I am not responding to you any further.

OP posts:
Monka · 05/02/2025 11:07

Ablondiebutagoody · 31/01/2025 10:03

I'm sure that they appreciate your pity.

The ordinary Americans voted, he seems to be doing what he promised. Whether you agree or not with the policies, a politician quickly doing what they said they will do is a breath of fresh air. I wish that our politicians were more like that.

So funny! Yes he promised cheaper groceries but guess what with the tax cuts that Trump has given to the billionaires he has a deficit so that means tariffs, which will mean things will cost more for the average American. Elon’s wealth has increased to 154 billion under Trump. Meta, google and other corporations are benefiting from the huge tax cuts that ordinary Americans will have to fund. I hope that though keeps them warm at night when they can’t pay their bills.

SernieBanders · 05/02/2025 11:05

AnonymousBleep · 05/02/2025 11:02

I hate the term 'zionist' or 'anti-zionist' but I doubt that's true as you wouldn't be suggesting this 'solution'.

If you can't see how it would make it worse, I can't help you. I assume you're an American who's never visited the middle east.

what a lot of assumptions you are making.

what a lack of solutions you are proposing

what a lot of pretending the status quo is ok - you are doing.

AnonymousBleep · 05/02/2025 11:02

SernieBanders · 05/02/2025 11:00

how on earth could it be worse?!?! also the amount of aid money that goes to Gaza right now is huge - how about instead of spending it there, for it to be blown up a week later, it was used to pay to set up a viable Palestinian homeland, somewhere where they wo;t get blown up?

Why is that mad?

Israel is not going anywhere! never! And as I said, I am definitely ant zionist, but they are there. never leaving.

Principles are sometimes less important than stopping being blown up

I hate the term 'zionist' or 'anti-zionist' but I doubt that's true as you wouldn't be suggesting this 'solution'.

If you can't see how it would make it worse, I can't help you. I assume you're an American who's never visited the middle east.

OP posts:
SernieBanders · 05/02/2025 11:00

AnonymousBleep · 05/02/2025 10:57

You don't have a solution. Kicking 2 million people out of their home with nowhere to go and no money is not a solution. It won't miraculously create peace, it will make things much, much worse.

how on earth could it be worse?!?! also the amount of aid money that goes to Gaza right now is huge - how about instead of spending it there, for it to be blown up a week later, it was used to pay to set up a viable Palestinian homeland, somewhere where they wo;t get blown up?

Why is that mad?

Israel is not going anywhere! never! And as I said, I am definitely ant zionist, but they are there. never leaving.

Principles are sometimes less important than stopping being blown up

squidgie · 05/02/2025 10:58

I'm kind of waking up to the chilling realisation just how much most people hate and distrust foreigners and immigrants and how much a lot of men hate women and want to see them suffer and to have women's rights and lives under their control. The Trumps, Farages and Musks of this world are just making it possible for people to vocalise these feelings.

AnonymousBleep · 05/02/2025 10:57

SernieBanders · 05/02/2025 10:53

At least I have a proposed solution. You don't.

Don't suggest one that will never happen

You don't have a solution. Kicking 2 million people out of their home with nowhere to go and no money is not a solution. It won't miraculously create peace, it will make things much, much worse.

OP posts:
SernieBanders · 05/02/2025 10:53

AnonymousBleep · 05/02/2025 10:36

Your insistence that 2 million Palestinians can just move to a different country (so long as it's not America) is absolute bullshit.

Edited

At least I have a proposed solution. You don't.

Don't suggest one that will never happen

StandFirm · 05/02/2025 10:52

RingoJuice · 05/02/2025 10:44

Ten million Germans were ethnically cleansed from Eastern Europe after WW2. These were communities that had existed in those areas for hundreds of years.

I know that history very well and it was 2 million not ten, over one million of which mostly resettled in neighbouring Bavaria (the rest in today's Poland and elsewhere in the former Soviet Union). It is a different context though and two wrongs don't make a right.

SernieBanders · 05/02/2025 10:51

Humdingerydoo · 05/02/2025 10:47

They don't all hate each other. The leaders hate each other. Among the general population, the hatred isn't always directed at each other. So there is hope, they just need better leaders, leaders who want peace. Unfortunately I don't think the Palestinians have ever had leaders who want peace as well as the existence of a Jewish state alongside their own, and the Israelis haven't had it for a couple of decades. So it's not looking great at the moment. I still maintain there is hope though!

Ethnically cleansing Gaza will not help. They did it already with the Jewish population there and it's not been a great outcome.

Change the leaders and change in the ME will follow. Just like the US electing Trump has made immediate changes to the safety of everyone, everywhere. Just in a really, really negative way.

I mean I wish you were right but I'm certain you're wrong. It's been a gaping wound in the Middle East since 1948, there has never been peace, there never will be. It's about time people accepted it and had radical solutions. people keep dying. its awful.

Humdingerydoo · 05/02/2025 10:47

SernieBanders · 05/02/2025 10:35

I really don;t know. But I do know there will never be peace in the Middle East with the status quo. They all hate each other. they can;t live together, and Israel is never going anywhere. So accept it, move, have a better life where you re not being shot every day

They don't all hate each other. The leaders hate each other. Among the general population, the hatred isn't always directed at each other. So there is hope, they just need better leaders, leaders who want peace. Unfortunately I don't think the Palestinians have ever had leaders who want peace as well as the existence of a Jewish state alongside their own, and the Israelis haven't had it for a couple of decades. So it's not looking great at the moment. I still maintain there is hope though!

Ethnically cleansing Gaza will not help. They did it already with the Jewish population there and it's not been a great outcome.

Change the leaders and change in the ME will follow. Just like the US electing Trump has made immediate changes to the safety of everyone, everywhere. Just in a really, really negative way.

RingoJuice · 05/02/2025 10:44

StandFirm · 05/02/2025 10:41

Let me see... Coventry got blown up, didn't it? Dresden in Germany got obliterated. Germans should have moved away from there forever?

Ten million Germans were ethnically cleansed from Eastern Europe after WW2. These were communities that had existed in those areas for hundreds of years.

AnonymousBleep · 05/02/2025 10:44

StandFirm · 05/02/2025 10:41

Let me see... Coventry got blown up, didn't it? Dresden in Germany got obliterated. Germans should have moved away from there forever?

Gaza is a prime piece of real estate though, StandFirm. Jared Kushner said as much. It'll make a lovely second home destination for Trump's rich mates. He can build a nice golf course with views out over the Gulf, while the 2 million people who used to live there get to starve live in refugee camps in the desert somewhere. Or on the moon. Maybe his BFF and deputy POTUS Elon Musk can take them there to resettle on one of his spaceships?

OP posts:
StandFirm · 05/02/2025 10:41

SernieBanders · 05/02/2025 10:32

they are in a refugee camp now, it's a shit heap, it got blown up.

Let me see... Coventry got blown up, didn't it? Dresden in Germany got obliterated. Germans should have moved away from there forever?

AnonymousBleep · 05/02/2025 10:37

RingoJuice · 05/02/2025 10:36

The difficulty is that they cannot peacefully coexist. Do you suggest we do nothing while Israel kills Gazans as an act of revenge?

No. We shouldn't do nothing. But what we also shouldn't do is ethnically cleanse Gaza.

OP posts:
squidgie · 05/02/2025 10:37

AnonymousBleep · 05/02/2025 09:32

Anyway, back to Trump. The man is now planning to ethnically cleanse Palestine and resettle it as 'the Riviera of the Middle East.' Literally can't believe what I am reading today.

Cheers America for dumping this utter psycho/sociopath on the rest of the world. He has no issue with creating a huge illegal immigration problem - and trying to force Egypt and Jordan to take in millions of immigrants - but won't do it himself, obvs. What a massive prick.

Edited

I know, I've started to quite seriously worry, also for what might be coming down the track here in a few years. It's like there has been some sort of mass psychosis for some years now, people being seduced by these 'charismatic' autocrats who can bend the rules however they like, change them on a whim, threaten basic human rights, say almost anything, no matter how crazy, xenophobic, misogynistic etc, and people applaud and cheer, intoxicated by these old style rah rah bully boys like Johnson and Farage who under all that 'man of the people' shtick are toxic through and through and only out for themselves (and their rich mates).

The increasingly hostile anti-immigrant rhetoric is honestly beginning to scare me a bit, not only for myself as an European immigrant here but for what are really beginning to sound like 1930s style attitudes around the world.

I'm writing a story about it which is helping to process these feelings a bit.

AnonymousBleep · 05/02/2025 10:36

SernieBanders · 05/02/2025 10:36

the status quo is not viable is a bullshit answer?

Your insistence that 2 million Palestinians can just move to a different country (so long as it's not America) is absolute bullshit.

OP posts:
RingoJuice · 05/02/2025 10:36

AnonymousBleep · 05/02/2025 10:24

BTW the idea that 2 million refugees would have a better quality of life in a refugee camp somewhere in the Egyptian desert is a fucking joke.

The difficulty is that they cannot peacefully coexist. Do you suggest we do nothing while Israel kills Gazans as an act of revenge?

SernieBanders · 05/02/2025 10:36

AnonymousBleep · 05/02/2025 10:35

Bullshit answer.

the status quo is not viable is a bullshit answer?

SernieBanders · 05/02/2025 10:35

Humdingerydoo · 05/02/2025 10:32

Surely they should be given the option to move, rather than be forced out?!

I really don;t know. But I do know there will never be peace in the Middle East with the status quo. They all hate each other. they can;t live together, and Israel is never going anywhere. So accept it, move, have a better life where you re not being shot every day

AnonymousBleep · 05/02/2025 10:35

SernieBanders · 05/02/2025 10:34

there's plenty of land in the world. Again, I don;t think it's right. I think it's the least bad option.

The status quo is not viable for anyone

Bullshit answer.

OP posts:
AnonymousBleep · 05/02/2025 10:34

SernieBanders · 05/02/2025 10:32

they are in a refugee camp now, it's a shit heap, it got blown up.

It's not a refugee camp and it's still their land. Their home land. You're expecting them just to resettle in another country, no problem? Do me a favour. Are you American?

OP posts:
SernieBanders · 05/02/2025 10:34

AnonymousBleep · 05/02/2025 10:33

It isn't. I'll ask you again - where do you think these 2 million people will go?

there's plenty of land in the world. Again, I don;t think it's right. I think it's the least bad option.

The status quo is not viable for anyone

AnonymousBleep · 05/02/2025 10:33

SernieBanders · 05/02/2025 10:29

I'm not saying it's right, I'm just saying it's the least bad option for everyone?

It isn't. I'll ask you again - where do you think these 2 million people will go?

OP posts:
Humdingerydoo · 05/02/2025 10:32

SernieBanders · 05/02/2025 10:14

I don't want them being blown up every 18 months. I assume you don't either.

Given - that Israel is not ever, ever going anywhere, the best choice all round for everyone, would be to cut the losses, which have been huge, and just move.

Surely they should be given the option to move, rather than be forced out?!