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AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

To find what DC said really sad?

266 replies

Haemagoblin · 28/01/2025 21:37

I was parking the car with my DD8 in the back, and making a bit of a hash of it. I laughed to DD "God I hope Daddy's not looking out the window, he'll be laughing at me!"

She replied "he wouldn't laugh - he doesn't even smile very much".

I find this so so sad. I mean she's not wrong, he's a bit of a gloomy person; but he does try to be a good dad, playfights with them and teases them and makes jokes,so I guess I didn't realise how much his naturally quite negative vibe was actually being picked up on by the children.

Should I talk to him about it? We are not in a very good place so I worry he'll see it as me getting at him - but if my kid had said something like that about me I'd want to know!

OP posts:
Yalta · 31/01/2025 08:35

I can only go by the single parents I know and they are the happiest women I know.

I really don’t think you know what it would be like to live in a household where you can be happy and free with no one dictating your mood or putting a downer on everyday

How many times when he starts moaning Gabe you put up your hand and said “Not listening. If you see something you don’t like then go fix it otherwise keep quiet unless you have something positive to say”

Have you counted the times you adjust your speech patterns or not saying something so you don’t set him off

Do you understand that your children have learned to do the same thing

CraftyYankee · 31/01/2025 08:23

This is our dynamic exactly.

It has helped me to accept what is possible and what is not. For a long time I thought he could give me emotional support and chose not to. Now that I understand it's just not something he's capable of it has removed the resentment.

That doesn't mean it's not sad and lonely but I'm not beating my head against a brick wall.

When I need emotional support I go to my friends. As you say he's brilliant with practical support.

It's about compromises stemming from that initial choice of partner. And underneath it all there is love there.

AmaryllisNightAndDay · 31/01/2025 08:19

Well, on the surface you can see the attraction, in fact you've described it well, because you each have some complementary abilities it "should" work. And you're each attracted to the person who can do the things you find difficult and fill the gap.

The problem is that it doesn't always make for a successful relationship in the long run. Because of couple dynamics, couples can end up polarising each other more. So that you might get more ADHD-ish because you're expecting him to do all the organisation side of life, while he might get more ASC-ish because you're doing all his emotional work for the kids. Neither of you have to push yourselves in those aspects because the other is picking up the slack. (Well that's an oversimplification but you see what I mean).

And the other risk is that in your different ways one of you really might not be able to meet the other one's needs. So that while you might be able to meet his needs for connection, and he meets your needs for someone to organise you, you have needs - really important needs for your own wellbeing - which he is never going to be able to meet.

Sorry I don't have answers. Just musing.

Haemagoblin · 31/01/2025 06:40

Haemagoblin · 31/01/2025 06:22

Oh he's 100% on the spectrum. I know it. He's not diagnosed and never will be but it's all there. As was His father I believe. His sister (who never launched and still lives at home with their mother in her late 30s) has recently been diagnosed.

I'm afraid I am not as nice a person as you in that knowing that has not made it easier for me - in fact it's made it harder as I've slowly come to accept that he will never "love" me in the sense that I mean love, it's just not in his emotional repertoire. He will never be curious about me, or be wondering how I'm feeling like I do about him all the time, it's just not there. It's meant the quest has stopped (if I just find the right way to communicate with him, if I just, if I just) and I'm left with the reality that this is what it is and the question is how well can I and my children live within that, if at all. It's incredibly sad actually.

Incidentally I suspect I am also undiagnosed ADHD (although that could also be PTSD or just general hyper emotional haplessness or just I'm getting caught up in the mania of the day for middle aged women, so I'm not confident to explore diagnosis - but I do use some of the tools from online articles and things anyway, as if it helps it doesn't really matter why).

Strangely this is a pairing I've seen a lot - 'ADHD' woman (hyper emotional, quick thinking, hyper verbal, disorganised) with 'autistic' man (low emotional affect, low communication, high control, sensory issues). I mean I suppose this is in part because the "typical" traits of ADHD and the "typical" traits for high-functioning autism map quite well onto the stereotypes of female and male behaviour quite well. But we also do seem to seek each other out! Which is strange because it's a bloody difficult combination.

OP posts:
Jinglejanglenamechanged25 · 31/01/2025 06:31

I was thinking there was an ASD (him) ADHD (you) sounding dynamic, a very common set up.

Yazzi · 31/01/2025 06:28

Haemagoblin · 31/01/2025 06:18

To be fair I don't find these statements antithetical. Both things are about prioritising the children over your own relationships. I just think (as a child whose parents did split) people overstate the virtues of separating in terms of the children's wellbeing. It is no guarantee of their lives being better, just different. And brings a lot of inherent negatives of its own. It can be the best, or the only safe choice. But not necessarily.

I didn't think it bears bearing in mind that if there are two grown adults who can't manage to compromise with each other in order to resolve their differences for their children, at least one of them probably has quite serious problems. Certainly the case with the two of us (both I think). That doesn't go away when you stop being together.

I agree to an extent- but what I mean is people are so quick to rush in and present divorce as THE solution (divorce= everything better) even though they also believe (as do I) that romantic choices on the other side of divorce are significantly more complicated and difficult, and perhaps a post divorce life won't be so straightforward after all.

I understand that there's a backlash to the long long looooong western tradition of staying in miserable marriages as a woman, which was only upended in around the 1980s and 1990s, and I think people don't want to be seen to say to women "just put up with it". But I also think in presenting divorce as a straightforward solution to a messy life, people undersell how complicated and imperfect (for many, not all) any outcome will be.

Haemagoblin · 31/01/2025 06:22

Givemethereins · 31/01/2025 01:53

OK I know that diagnosing over the Internet is not always helpful. But I really relate to your marriage and im also staying for the benefit of children and our family connection while kids are young.
My husband is an undiagnosed autistic man and from certain things you've described I would look at neurodivergence as a possibility.
Unexperessive facial responses, not being.able to.tell whether he is enjoying himself. Moody, always needing to find control in his life (better job.etc) to be happy.
Just in terms of my relationship, understanding my partner was autistic has changed much of my own resentment and allowed me to help our communication more and realise that things I.found.upsetting are not something he has much control over.
It's not a fix but understanding someone's needs is so helpful when.navigating a family together.

Oh he's 100% on the spectrum. I know it. He's not diagnosed and never will be but it's all there. As was His father I believe. His sister (who never launched and still lives at home with their mother in her late 30s) has recently been diagnosed.

I'm afraid I am not as nice a person as you in that knowing that has not made it easier for me - in fact it's made it harder as I've slowly come to accept that he will never "love" me in the sense that I mean love, it's just not in his emotional repertoire. He will never be curious about me, or be wondering how I'm feeling like I do about him all the time, it's just not there. It's meant the quest has stopped (if I just find the right way to communicate with him, if I just, if I just) and I'm left with the reality that this is what it is and the question is how well can I and my children live within that, if at all. It's incredibly sad actually.

OP posts:
Haemagoblin · 31/01/2025 06:18

Yazzi · 31/01/2025 00:11

It's also interesting that Mumsnet seems to run these two parallel conversations at all time:

  1. If you're not 100% happy in your marriage you should leave you're doing a disservice to your children by staying.

  2. If you're a single parent you shouldn't re-partner and especially not blend families while your children live at home, it's selfish, you're doing a disservice to your children by moving on.

To be fair I don't find these statements antithetical. Both things are about prioritising the children over your own relationships. I just think (as a child whose parents did split) people overstate the virtues of separating in terms of the children's wellbeing. It is no guarantee of their lives being better, just different. And brings a lot of inherent negatives of its own. It can be the best, or the only safe choice. But not necessarily.

I didn't think it bears bearing in mind that if there are two grown adults who can't manage to compromise with each other in order to resolve their differences for their children, at least one of them probably has quite serious problems. Certainly the case with the two of us (both I think). That doesn't go away when you stop being together.

OP posts:
DiduAye · 31/01/2025 02:23

Life is too short up be living such a miserable life and making your kids suffer it too !

Givemethereins · 31/01/2025 01:53

OK I know that diagnosing over the Internet is not always helpful. But I really relate to your marriage and im also staying for the benefit of children and our family connection while kids are young.
My husband is an undiagnosed autistic man and from certain things you've described I would look at neurodivergence as a possibility.
Unexperessive facial responses, not being.able to.tell whether he is enjoying himself. Moody, always needing to find control in his life (better job.etc) to be happy.
Just in terms of my relationship, understanding my partner was autistic has changed much of my own resentment and allowed me to help our communication more and realise that things I.found.upsetting are not something he has much control over.
It's not a fix but understanding someone's needs is so helpful when.navigating a family together.

Yazzi · 31/01/2025 00:11

It's also interesting that Mumsnet seems to run these two parallel conversations at all time:

  1. If you're not 100% happy in your marriage you should leave you're doing a disservice to your children by staying.

  2. If you're a single parent you shouldn't re-partner and especially not blend families while your children live at home, it's selfish, you're doing a disservice to your children by moving on.

OhcantthInkofaname · 30/01/2025 22:50

I heard the saying "better being from a broken home than in one".

Miffsmum · 30/01/2025 22:21

It’s hard to say. My mum always worked shifts so was always tired or in bed. My dad was a “proper Yorkshireman” so in the pub when he wasn’t at work or home for his dinner so we didn’t really see either of them very much.

Haemagoblin · 30/01/2025 22:17

Miffsmum · 30/01/2025 22:15

No not really.

Do you think the way they treated you has more to do with the difficulties you have suffered than how they treated each other? If they had been radiantly in love with each other but still stand offish with you, do you think that would have been better or worse?

OP posts:
Miffsmum · 30/01/2025 22:15

Haemagoblin · 30/01/2025 21:45

Did they show affection to you (verbally,emotionally, physically)?

No not really.

Haemagoblin · 30/01/2025 21:45

Miffsmum · 30/01/2025 21:23

I grew up in a household like this and I would say that staying together just for the children is not doing them a favour. My parents never touched or showed affection to each other so I never learned to so relationships have always been very difficult.

Did they show affection to you (verbally,emotionally, physically)?

OP posts:
Miffsmum · 30/01/2025 21:23

I grew up in a household like this and I would say that staying together just for the children is not doing them a favour. My parents never touched or showed affection to each other so I never learned to so relationships have always been very difficult.

Haemagoblin · 30/01/2025 20:59

Also people put a lot of weight into this "set them an example" thing, as if how I live my life is the only message they will take on as to what they're worth. As a child whose mother walked away, I can tell you that quite apart from any example that may have set, the feelings of worthlessness, of unimportance, that has left me with in no small part carried me to this place. Although I am aware I am giving them a far from stellar example of how a woman should conduct herself in a relationship, I don't think me just choosing to please myself without considering the situation that would leave them in, as well as making that decision knowing full well it would mean I would miss 50% of their childhood, would not give them a message that they were loved, valued, and the most important thing in my life. Which they are.

OP posts:
Haemagoblin · 30/01/2025 20:55

Dogsbreath7 · 30/01/2025 20:47

Sorry OP I disagree with your decision making.

you have two lovely daughters, one of whom is old enough and astute enough to notice how grumpy your OH is.

the best example you can show your DC is to demonstrate that a woman’s/wifes/mothers life is worth something and everyone has the right to happiness. Empower their lives by giving them a choice (be with father or mother). They will get to an age very soon when that IS their choice.

you are using your own history as an exscuse not to split. You are also using his refusal as an exscuse. You do have agency here (more than your poor DC).

Use it. You come across as a pitiful 1950’s housewife and making lots of exscuse sir projecting a reality which isn’t there and unlikely to be aka a horrible step mum when it’s highly unlikely anyone would want marry him.

you are making out you are a martyr for your kids when in reality your kids are being ‘sacrificed for your weakness’. Sorry to tell you straight.

I grew up in SFH. High proportion now also. The world won’t end but at least 3 of you would be out of this miserable existence.

I can't give them a choice though. The choice would be made for them by the family court until they are of an age their opinions will be taken into account (around 11 from precedent). That's 7 years away for my youngest. That's not very soon. That's almost twice as long as she has been alive.

I know it must seem very simple from the outside, and I have no objection whatsoever to you telling me straight what your opinion is. That after all is what MN is for. But really, it isn't that simple.

What is an SFH?

OP posts:
Dogsbreath7 · 30/01/2025 20:47

Sorry OP I disagree with your decision making.

you have two lovely daughters, one of whom is old enough and astute enough to notice how grumpy your OH is.

the best example you can show your DC is to demonstrate that a woman’s/wifes/mothers life is worth something and everyone has the right to happiness. Empower their lives by giving them a choice (be with father or mother). They will get to an age very soon when that IS their choice.

you are using your own history as an exscuse not to split. You are also using his refusal as an exscuse. You do have agency here (more than your poor DC).

Use it. You come across as a pitiful 1950’s housewife and making lots of exscuse sir projecting a reality which isn’t there and unlikely to be aka a horrible step mum when it’s highly unlikely anyone would want marry him.

you are making out you are a martyr for your kids when in reality your kids are being ‘sacrificed for your weakness’. Sorry to tell you straight.

I grew up in SFH. High proportion now also. The world won’t end but at least 3 of you would be out of this miserable existence.

Dogsbreath7 · 30/01/2025 20:21

MadmansLibrary · 28/01/2025 21:52

Why the fuck is it OP's responsibility to jolly him along?

This fifty times over!!!!

Greyish2025 · 30/01/2025 18:32

Haemagoblin · 28/01/2025 21:37

I was parking the car with my DD8 in the back, and making a bit of a hash of it. I laughed to DD "God I hope Daddy's not looking out the window, he'll be laughing at me!"

She replied "he wouldn't laugh - he doesn't even smile very much".

I find this so so sad. I mean she's not wrong, he's a bit of a gloomy person; but he does try to be a good dad, playfights with them and teases them and makes jokes,so I guess I didn't realise how much his naturally quite negative vibe was actually being picked up on by the children.

Should I talk to him about it? We are not in a very good place so I worry he'll see it as me getting at him - but if my kid had said something like that about me I'd want to know!

I would pick my moment and gently say it to him, it may be making your DC unhappy to see their dad looking unhappy

NavyBee · 30/01/2025 18:27

I don’t think you are doing the right thing for your children or for yourself or for your husband by staying together. Where to start? Children do pick up what is happening even if they don’t understand it. Living in an unhappy household isn’t great for them. By staying together when you are not well suited you are denying both yourself and your husband the chance of a better life. You are also role modelling setting your own needs and wants aside for the sake of keeping a marriage together but it isn’t a healthy way to live long term or a good relationship model for your children. Splitting up will of course be hard and will probably be quite distressing for the children and yet in the longer term you will be a better parent by looking after yourself. My parents weren’t good for each other and I’ve often thought they would both have been happier if they had split up.

Haemagoblin · 30/01/2025 15:38

K4fkaesque · 30/01/2025 15:29

Did you actually read the bit where the OP's parents did split up? It's not necessarily a panacea.

It's easy to shout advice and insults from the cheap seats. Not so easy to deal with complicated real life situations where sometimes there is no ideal path.

Well, glad I missed that whatever it was!

OP posts: