To think that wolf whistling wasn't such a bad thing?

You were attracted to “builders bum”
I remember that as a synonym for being uncouth. It wasn’t desirable and girls didn’t shout “show us your crack” at builders!

I like Joanna Lumley but on this I think she’s a fuck wit and as a model in the 60s it probably wasn’t too bad for her.

No. It’s what it represents - men’s ‘right’ to judge a girl or woman and make unsolicited comments or approaches.
I got my first ‘wolf whistle’ and cat calling at 12 from grown men and it was confusing and humiliating- I still remember the feeling of powerlessness.

I like being whistled at but I wear crop tops and dresses and spend alot of time at the gym/money on my appearance. I think it's uncalled for if a woman is dressed normally or jogging though

WTF. So if a woman is dressed sexily then she's asking for it?!

No.

and frankly a lot of it was aimed when girls are underaged.

there is no scenario when a strange man touching you up is fun. Not sure why we have to let strange men feel us up to learn resilience.

I don't think that, for a grown woman, this ought to be something massively upsetting or met with such hatred as some seem to feel

I don't think anyone had says they were massively upset have they? They've said they felt threatened, intimidated and objectified.

I'm in my 40's now but I remember starting my first job after university. On my first day I was given tour of the site which had multiple buildings and there was a new building being built. As we walked past the building site some of the builders whistled at me.
I was really embarrassed and didn't say or do anything. I'd worked in bars for years so was used to being cat called (and often sexually harassed) and could usually handle myself well, but this was the first day of my graduate career and I was mortified at being objectified like that.

The male colleague giving me a tour complained on my behalf and I received an apology from the building company. This was over 20 years ago now.

The horror of being 15 and having to walk past a building site next to my house. Comments, calls and actual propositions. Ghastly.
I would walk miles to avoid them.

And a lot of girls made similar comments regarding 'builders' cracks' if my very old memory serves me well!

As an older woman I would know how to handle it and have the confidence to deal with it. As a girl, I didn't. I hated and feared it, because I knew it wasn't a compliment but an imposition. As a young professional woman I used to have to walk past a building site on my way to work and would dread this. I remember when that site put up a sign saying they were part of the Westminster Considerate Builders scheme, and the change in behaviour that followed. The realisation that whistling and calling weren't inevitable was both a surprise and relief.

Joanna should maybe stop playing up to the fantasy of the liberated beauty who properly appreciates male gallantry.

I always felt uncomfortable with it and in my experience wolf-whistling was done to get a reaction (either a laugh from others) or to see me squirm, and groping just wrong and seeing how far he could push it. If you talk back, you would get an ‘ooh, feisty’ type reaction. I used to work in a very male dominated environment. A lot of the men who did it were married with kids, I do not think they were trying to ask me out.

I am against wolf whistling/ calling.
If a man wants to compliment a lady, then let him do it. And I do not think we should get upset about that, but know how to handle ourselves and take the compliment. Not in the dark, around a lonely corner when some random unknown man makes primitive sounds! Wolf calling does not make is feel safe and sound.

Regarding the hand on leg. The slapping sounds good, but in these days that is assault. You can only remove their hand, meke clear is unwelcomed. And if it happens at work or similar, well then you need to report it, because you do not want the rejection to affect your work life, but HR will not believe it if you say afterwards.
I think she is 100% wrong, for this day and age.

Probably not. I'd probably have found that more threatening, due to the proximity.

But at 13-18 ish, I wasn't thinking too much about risk. I wasn't analyzing a cat call. I'd dressed up and walked to the bus stop, and people had whistled at me. It was coherent with my inner self who was absolutely sure she was hot. I was hot, men said I was hot, all made sense.

A few comments are saying it's slightly sad I needed that validation, and perhaps I was suggesting that I should have felt intimidated. Why? I didn't need the validation, I was an extremely confident teenager, but it came anyway and it didn't bother me. And why would it have been better for me to have felt scared, rather than making me feel aware of my own power? How would that have helped?

I wonder how some of the 'what's the big deal' posters would feel if their own dad or partner or brother or son engaged in this type of behaviour? I mean, surely it wouldn't bother you, because it's 'harmless'?

not Has said they were ‘massively upset’
They have said as they felt Intimidated and objectified. That’s just factual.
Massively upset is an odd take on women’s experiences.

A couple of posts above yours a poster sats the men know full well there's no chance of an interaction or anything coming of it. There's a pretty wide spectrum of what women feel about this I think. If you are not someone who gets lots of attention and hit on in bars etc, it might actually be that a whistle would, whilst cringy in the moment, make someone feel a little bit good. Yes it's objectifying, in the sense that obviously it's based on looks alone but if we didn't care about that, why do so many women spend so much time and effort on it? It can't be "just for us" or people would make the same effort on a day in the office as for a first date. I agree that young girls will find this mortifying, scary even and they absolutely should not be whistling at children but I don't think that, for a grown woman, this ought to be something massively upsetting or met with such hatred as some seem to feel.

I am older, it hasn’t changed.

I think women were conditioned to believe it was a compliment but really it was and still is about control, power and objectification.

So many women on this thread have mentioned that ‘back in the day’ they were children in school uniform when they were catcalled or mentioned it felt intimidating. That’s about power and control. Nothing has changed except it has become unacceptable.

The posters who have said they found it a compliment or that it didn’t bother really need to answer my question about whether they would feel the same way if a large group of men catcalled them on the street in close proximity. If it’s just a compliment why would it be different.

Well there you go then. You were never subjected to that, so of course you think it was fine. Those of us who were, were utterly terrified at wolf whistling because we knew from experience there was every chance it would be followed up by a leery remark and others would join in.

A wolf whistle or cat call back then may have meant the bloke found you attractive. I wouldn't know, I wasn't there, but maybe that was the general way of things. Thinking of it that way, I can see why people found it a compliment.

That's not what it means these days. A wolf whistle or cat call is nothing to do with how attractive a man finds you. Times have changed. The guy might actually think you're a right minger.

It's about how vulnerable he finds you, and in my experience ends up with you being followed and harassed. It never happens in a busy street. It never happens when you're with friends or your partner. It only ever happens when you're alone and no one is there to help you. The best outcome of the scenario is that he ends up just insulting you and saying what he really thinks ("you're fucking ugly" ). Worst case is... Worse.

When a man actually finds a woman attractive these days, they behave much better because they want to actually get with them or want the woman to think well of them - and they know a cat call isn't the way to do it nowadays.

If they're cat calling you nowadays, they want to hurt you or at least make you feel uncomfortable. It's not meant as a compliment.

All those saying it was harmless flirtation, please let us know whether catcalling on the street is also acceptable to you?

If not, why?

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/newsbeat-43718034

Would you have found it harmless if the same group of men were catcalling you on the street, yards away and you had to walk right by them?

if not, why not?

JFC 🙄

That PP has already said she knows she’s extremely attractive, that’s what I based my comment on.

Considering 1 in 4 women are raped or sexually assaulted in their lifetime, and given that I was regularly wolf whistled at as a child, in my school uniform, my opinion of some men is very low, yes.

I'd rather be wolf whistled at than a man shouting "suck my dick, bitch" at me. The former makes me roll my eyes, the second scares me.

I wasn’t aware it was either/or

But I’d rather men didn’t say this OR wolf whistle. I feel quite sad for men that we have such low expectations of them that we think they all do one or the other