To feel sad I'm going to end up 'managing' another man

Family wastrel 😂😂😂

This could be done with very very little effort on your part though..

Decide what 'fund' you want Uncle to have - stick it in an account, set it up to pay x by standing order every month. Forget about it forever more.

The difficulty comes if Uncle knows about the terms in the letter - and he may put pressure on you to hand over more than you decide is reasonable/surplus to your requirements.

So I'd speak to Dad about this, and say you appreciate the sentiment but its really only possible if Uncle knows fuck all about it (or whatever it is you actually want to do!).

Also worth pointing out that Uncle could challenge a will that cuts him out entirely IF there is any indication your Dad has previously supported him, or he can make it look like this is malicious. If your Dad leaves him a small fixed sum however, that won't work, (well he can challenge.. but he won't win!)

I would need the money, end of discussion and your ‘uncle’ can find his own way

It sounds like a right pain in the arse to me. Your dad is being very kind by the sounds of it but I think you need to tell him that his kindness is ultimately to your detriment 🤷‍♀️

You could consider saying to your Dad that either he leaves his brother a fixed amount or you can’t guarantee you’ll be able to fulfil his wishes. It may mean having to step down as executor.

I don’t think you’re wrong at all to feel the way you do about your uncle being looked after by a series of women and you having this put on you by your DF.

I understand you wanting to respect your DF’s letter of wishes while still feeling like the request is somewhat unfair. Since you say your DF would be open to a conversation about the whole situation, I would probably try that unless he’s particularly frail nowadays.

However, if what you’re after from this thread is a way to think about how much you should give your uncle given the vague wording of the letter of wishes, I would start with how much your DF currently gives. You say your uncle has been looked after by a series of women, which sounds like your DF has not stepped up. I wouldn’t be expecting to do more for your uncle than he has.

In terms of what counts as your “needs”, I would think a lifestyle of at least the standard your DF enjoys, with pension and savings in place to continue that once you retire, would be required before you could consider your own needs met. And in terms of what to give your uncle, certainly no more than would be required to sustain the lifestyle he currently has - which sounds fairly minimal. When he reaches retirement he will be on pension credit and have his housing covered, so a fairly minimal weekly top up payment would probably suffice (assuming you have a life as comfortable as your DF’s), if the amount of money your DF is leaving is large then maybe up to 5k a year (which would be about what you’d get from an 80k annuity), but not more. I’d also limit it to a maximum of 10% of the estate on the assumption that any more would need a much clearer expression of wishes. So an 80k annuity if your needs are met and the estate is over 800k after taxes.

My thinking here is that if you can put clear limits on the support you would provide and make it more clinical, it probably won’t feel as much of a burden and you don’t have to be interested in the life of a man who has shown absolutely no interest in you.

I actually think this is really unfair on you and your uncle. What if your circumstances change? Maybe you give your uncle a monthly stipend based on how much you (don't) need the money. Maybe your cousins help your uncle use this 'regular' income sensibly (maybe he rents somewhere near them for more support and turns his life around), it becomes part of his income and he is reliant on it. Then your circumstances change, you need the money. What do you do....? Potentially a pretty horrible situation to navigate.

Personally, I'd tell your dad that he needs to make provision for his brother in his will. Maybe some sort of trust set up where the administration is via your cousins?

The mix up of your inheritance that may or may not also be financial support for your uncle is messy.

Can he be put in a nursing home or assisted piv8ng accommodation so you don't have to directly involve yourself in his care.

I agree.

Right. Firstly as I understand it, her concern is that the other executors know NOW what is in the letter of wishes and will therefore know what the deceased wants and have "views" about the OP if she doesn't comply with their concept of the deceased's wishes. They may also tell the spendthrift uncle which could cause the OP problems. Secondly your suggestions, again as I understand it, are exactly wht the OP does NOT want. She doesn't want to get involved in his situations and she doesn't want him coming to her for money and being involved and making decisions for him. Does nobody read posts properly?

I suppose it depends on how much money you'll want from what's bequeathed to you. If you do decide to offer any funds to your uncle, set up a DD, and have very little to do with him from then on.

It's a bit galling though, isn't it?

When people say that tired old phrase "a woman is a daughter all her life, a man is a son till he takes a wife" THIS is what it means.

You, a grown woman, in the role of dutiful daughter/niece, asked to "do the right thing". Your uncle, a feckless grown man not even responsible for himself. The above phrase keeps women subservient to her birth family in a way men are permitted not to be.

This. The uncle got into this mess in the first place by everyone treating him like a child. Except he isn't a child, he's older than you! He made his own choices in life and chose not to work the majority of his life and presumably not to save. You are not responsible for his life choices and neither is your father.

It's just not your problem and your father is unreasonable trying to stick that burden on your shoulders. Get some boundaries and assert yourself,say no!

@twentyoneteacups

Firstly, if you predecease the other executors you won't be around to worry about what they do with any money for your uncle, so try to let that bit go.

You know, your dad saying 'Take care of yourself first' is very broad. At the time of his death you may be doing very well and only need 'a bit or so'. But that is not to say that in a year or 10 you may not need extra money very badly. So IMHO you need to plan and conserve for your future, first. Sorry, but it'd be 'me first' all the way. If that means investing the lot of it in your name, then that's what I'd do.

When it comes to your uncle, I'd probably go on a 'situation by situation' basis rather than a monthly stipend. Someone who is a spendthrift usually, well, spends. If you were to increase his monthly income by a stipend, he'll only increase his 'unwise' spending by that amount, rather than putting some by for a rainy day. That ends up with them 'needing' more and more. So I'd probably wait for him to come to me for any money he 'wants' and make a case by case decision. Money for a car repair or even a holiday? Sure. To invest in a hare-brained scheme? NO. I know, that's 'managing' him, but it's also using your dad's money wisely for both your and Uncle's benefit.

If you wanted to do something monthly then I'd pay some of his bills directly, like utilities, car/home insurance or other necessary living expenses, rather than handing him cash.

When the time comes, can you decide what you can spare from your Dad's estate and set it up as an annuity for your uncle? Tell him he gets £X per month. Do a Deed of Variation too to give him that much via the will (but as an annuity) if it would impact your Inheritance Tax otherwise. Then that's job done and walk away.

I think there's also a romantic side to my dad that always wants to be a 'rescuer' who does 'the right thing', and that's where this part of his thinking about what happens after he passes is coming from.

Key word here being after he passes. He won't be doing any rescuing, you will! He hasn't the right to force someone else into the role of rescuer. I would tell your dad that you won't do it. Either the money goes to you, it goes to his brother or is shared. But the last thing you would want is for this spoiled little brother, who has already shown that he only cares about the money, to come knocking on your door all the time, because he will.

If you father wants to "rescue" his brother with money, he needs to leave him a lump sum or set up some kind of trust for him, but he should not demand that you become his brother's keeper.

So when the time comes if there's any money left, you 'need' it so none left for uncle. I hope your Dad hasn't told him about this.

OP, perhaps this is a red herring, but aren't there potential tax implications of your Dad's suggested way of doing things? You haven't mentioned the sums involved, but there's a limit on how much you cash can give away each year without it having to be accounted for in your estate, should you die. (It's £3,000 pa I think, but don't quote me as I've never been in a position to give away that much 😆). It may not be an issue but something to check out, perhaps?

@twentyoneteacups Tell yourself you are not going to carry this responsibility now and make peace with it. Then decide if your dad can handle the discussion around this - I'm sure you know him well enough. If you do discuss and are 100% sure you will never need your full inheritance a trust fund is the best solution. If it's kinder to not tell your dad then so be it. I could not do everything my dad wanted for a close relative. After dad's death I made a compromise arrangement he never knew about with which I was comfortable. I'm not suggesting you compromise - just that you do what makes life easiest for you.

I think the important thing is to ensure that your dad (and the cousins come to that) do not mention to the uncle the letter of wishes, otherwise you'll get loads of hassle from the feckless uncle.

This sort of brain ache is a burden. You know what you can and can’t do, practically and legally and morally, but it’s the constant second-guessing and soul-searching.

One way to deal with it is to decide now (or when your father passes and you know what his estate comprises) to ring fence a certain amount for your uncle. Make that decision at the outset. Don’t give it, don’t do anything with it other than sensibly manage it, but have it in your head that x amount is for your uncle if and when he needs it.

Then put it out of your mind.

Try to remove the man-child element. I understand what you’re saying and it’s undeniably shit, but if this were an aunt I suspect you’d feel the same way about the burden of this. In this instance, it being an uncle is just grist to a pre-existing mill.

Haven’t yet RTFT, but full solidarity with you OP. It sounds like your dad’s diplomatically giving you an ‘out’, a safety net maybe. As he expects your uncle to come after your money when his other sources all run out.
You’re very much NBU. Your description of ‘management’ of a man is spot on. Your dad sounds lovely. Good luck 💐

My view is that is pretty deep to be thinking.

To me the letter of wishes reads less like " if possible, set aside some money for feckless uncle, please" and more like "it's all yours, but if you ever feel generous towards feckless uncle you won't be betraying my final wishes if you give some away."

I wouldn't think more deeply than that.

It's not legally binding.

OP you will never know when you will need the money, how would you feel if you bail out your uncle time and time again only later on to find that you really did need that money?

My thoughts are that can write your own will to his benefit if you die before him providing that doesn’t leave any of your loved ones without.

A wish is just that, something that can be done but only IF it can be done. If it can’t well, that’s just unfortunate.