To wonder if Starmer can survive the vibe-shift?

@Ch01c3s and @Guinessandafire I agree with both of you.

I saw Wes Streeting being interviewed yesterday on how they need to start to scrutinise Reform / Farage head-on and thoroughly in terms of policies, funding, etc, which I think is something they really need to do - sunlight is the best disinfectant. It will be interesting to see if/how they cope long-term, especially as the EDL/Tommy Robinson supporters they’ve courted already seem to have turned on Farage.

But I do think the government also need to take a close look at traditional, old Labour areas/voters who voted for Brexit, then for Johnson and are now supporting Reform - places where there have been long-standing Labour councils and MPs, but obviously under a Tory government and all of their mess. I think it was Jonathan Reynolds talking about this just after the election, how they’d spoken to many ‘good people’ voting for Reform whose leaders/MPs were not ‘good people’… I think Labour need to take hold of ‘the story’ a bit more, if that makes sense, which is difficult for them with MSM being as it is.

Also, sadly, I think it’s partly the era we’re in - constant news cycles, immediate gratification with no patience, focus on popularity and being social media savvy.

The desperation in clinging to polls because you have nothing else is palpable. We’re 4 years away from an election.🤣 Check back in 3 years time.

I mean you can do the whole line of emojis, cry laugh your head off and all that, but it won't change the reality of how much support Labour has lost

The only thing they have so far is how early they've managed to do it, has any new gov lost it this quickly?

It's not the glowing feedback your posts would suggest

I think pps have difficulty grasping the concept that polls are not static and that they change over time.

The desperation in clinging to polls because you have nothing else is palpable. We’re 4 years away from an election.🤣 Check back in 3 years time.

And as for turning to reform 🤣 nice try but that so isn’t happening.

They are already polling higher than Labour and there's a fair way to go

Things are going to get a hell of a lot worse in this country, and it won't be because a good man - a much better person than the last three Prime Ministers - has an incredibly difficult job to do undoing the incompetence corruption and self serving greed of the last Government.

I agree but re things getting worse I think it will mean we will be poorer for a while whilst we get services back on track. Instead of the Tory empty sound bites of “we’re all in this together” when the rich most definitely weren’t we now will be which is why we have more chance of better services and a more stable country under this government . I think the vast majority know and are resigned to this.

And as for turning to reform 🤣 nice try but that so isn’t happening. Even less likely to happen now we’ve got the US car crash to sit back and watch. Nazi salutes, ICE trying to enter schools and day care, withdrawal from WHO( already blocking coverage of bird flu) alongside Kennedybin charge of health,withdrawal of diversity departments and employment with threats of consequences, ignoring of climate change even though the world is burning and they already have huge states suffering from extreme weather conditions and fire, deciding land belongs to the US…..and that’s before we look at the dire health system they have.

Sound familiar? Maybe read up on the run up to World War 2. At times like this I think most “ normal people” appreciate the democracy we have( which America is rapidly losing ) alongside valuing human kindness and sanity.

The starter of this thread admits to voting Reform...a knee jerk, no policy, racist , populist mouthpiece with an appalling manifesto and dodgy funding.

Sadly there are too many posters like this that will sweep the far right into power, led by Farage, at the next election. People just do not have a moral compass anymore.

The clamour to believe an unashamed, proud Fascist in Elon Musk on this site shows a very worrying trend in this country.

Things are going to get a hell of a lot worse in this country, and it won't be because a good man - a much better person than the last three Prime Ministers - has an incredibly difficult job to do undoing the incompetence corruption and self serving greed of the last Government.

You can’t pin illegal migrants, cost of living and knife crime on Starmer. He has barely been in power and rises the past few years are down to the Tories nobody else- NHS, MH, education, SEN , police funding all plummeted whilst contracts were made for mates. What do you expect?They lied about Brexit and the impact on CofL( we’re only just seeing the start of the impact). And as for immigration the only policy they cared anout( to keep backbenchers happy) they screwed that up too with yet more vanity by projects.

And what do you mean by normal and resilience?

What do you think people feel ignored about?

There was a real hope when Keir Starmer was elected - that has gone. The problems of illegal migrants, knife crime and rising cost of living appear to getting worse. If Trump shows he is solving the US illegal migrant issue I think people will move to Reform. I also think he average person feels too many people excuses are being made in the name of poor mental health. Undoubtedly there are some people who have genuine issues but resilience is needed and we should be tougher. The average person is not a drain on society and they feel ignored and often silenced that is why people are turning to Reform.

I think they’re certainly marketing themselves as that (and anti-establishment too, which is ironic) and I understand where you’re coming from, it certainly has to be part of it, but also there are other factors too, in my opinion - thinking back to Brexit, the red wall votes for Johnson, etc. and how that relates. Certain Tories (e.g. Jenrick) certainly seem to be trying to adopt a Reform-like approach…sadly, I can’t think of any witty chicken-shellfish process food product to describe them/him.

No worries.

@TheNuthatch Reform did indeed come second in my hometown - I know people who voted for them. So while I’m disgusted by Reform’s rhetoric and tactics, critical of their lack of policies and political credibility, and suspicious of how a limited company run/led by tax-evading millionaires born into wealth will really be focused on the best interests of working class communities, I’m also able to recognise a lot of the how, why and where factors contributing to their popularity - I get why they have got to where they currently are. I wouldn’t describe it as a ‘vibe-shift’ personally (and X is something else entirely), but I think for the government to dismiss and ignore Reform and their supporters would be dangerous. I also think that a government with a significant majority of MPs, who were elected in July should be getting on with their jobs in governance (with scrutiny and criticism, of course), and not pandering to every social media bandwagon, weekly popularity poll or petitions for another general election/resignation.
As an aside, you don’t have a monopoly on what constitutes ‘the real world’ you know - you have no idea at all about other people’s lives and the worlds in which they live and/or move between.

True op.
I don't think it will be popular in the ranks if Labour introduce austerity mk2 in the spring. Having a large majority can be a blessing and a curse.

Apologies, I wash a bit harsh.

So as you're in the 'red wall', did reform place second in your constituency in the GE?

Some posters spend hours every day agonising about whether complete strangers like or approve of them. They would not last a week in politics. Serious politicians are in politics to get things done, not to be popular.

Tbf some posters spend more time telling everyone how well someone is going when it's really not the case.

As for 'serious politicians getting things done' do you mean shrinking the private sector and stalling growth?

Ok thank you for clarifying, and for the recommendation for next Wednesday.

Does that mean your view that Badenoch isn't doing worse than Starmer in PMQs and the public actually care about PMQs is just based on comments you've seen in the Daily Mail below the line?

Given that I’m from a working class background in a red wall town and my husband is a small business owner, then I’m actually very far from ‘sticking my fingers in my ears and pretending it isn’t happening’ but you enjoy your rant and meaningless tales of builders doing silly impressions and buying eggs from farmers.

Some posters spend hours every day agonising about whether complete strangers like or approve of them. They would not last a week in politics. Serious politicians are in politics to get things done, not to be popular.