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AIBU?

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To have objected to ‘prayers’ at work

587 replies

Iamthewintersale · 21/01/2025 13:56

Will try to keep this brief… Work in a team of 12, 6 in U.K. and 6 in USA ( mid-west) and once a week we have a team meeting that we take turns in running.

Tomorrow is the turn of A. A is a Republican, church goer, voted Trump because she wanted, quote ‘More money in my pocket book and illegals dealt with’.
So far so MAGA. This came up pre-election as she’s the only Trump fan on the team and was open about it.

On the agenda for the meeting is ‘Prayer’ as point one. I pinged manager a note saying what?? A thinks it would be nice to start off with a prayer. As a team. I have asked for it to be OFF the agenda. US manager thinks it’s ‘harmless’ but has said will clarify.

AIBU to think it’s totally inappropriate??? I’m an atheist for a start, most of my U.K. team are the same or at least agnostic.

Seems weird that she’s never tried this before, but suddenly Trump ‘god saved me to MAGA’ is inaugurated and a team prayer is in the agenda.
We are a large global company, BTW, not some local mom & pop outfit that sells bibles…

YANBU - work is secular. She keeps her views and prayers to herself own time.

YABU - lighten up, what harm can it do.

OP posts:
Coffeeandwalnutcakes · 21/01/2025 20:10

mitogoshigg · 21/01/2025 20:04

Just checked, it's perfectly legal to put prayers on a U.K. work agenda but you can be forced to attend that part of the meeting

Can’t be forced, surely

Iamthewintersale · 21/01/2025 20:04

TunnocksOrDeath · 21/01/2025 20:01

Depending on whether you actually have to pretend to like this colleague in order to work with them, it might be fun to take prayer time to its logical extreme, in order to get it banned.
Probably the best way to do this is joining the Church of the Flying Spaghetti Monster. The members call themselves Pastafarians, revere pirates, and often wear pirate hats as an outward sign of their faith. The officiants wear a colander on their heads for services.
So there's a lot for you to work with there when it's your turn to host, and you can choose the form of worship.

I do like her! In small. Long distance, meet in person 2/3 x a year kind of way. Though Pastafarian is bloody genius!

OP posts:
mitogoshigg · 21/01/2025 20:04

Just checked, it's perfectly legal to put prayers on a U.K. work agenda but you can be forced to attend that part of the meeting

DangerPigeon · 21/01/2025 20:04

Probably a good time to hire/borrow/make a jedi cloak and keep it in your desk drawer

SilenceInside · 21/01/2025 20:03

LadyLapsang · 21/01/2025 19:56

Sittings in both the House of Commons and the House of Lords begin with prayers.

https://humanists.uk/action/parliamentary-prayers/

That gives an advantage to any MP in the House of Commons who attends the prayers, as they are able to put down a ‘prayer card’ on their seat, which reserves it for the whole day. This means that non-Christian MPs, who don’t want to attend prayers for a religion they do not believe in, are less likely to get a seat or be selected by the Speaker to take part in the day’s business.

FairDuck · 21/01/2025 20:03

Seeing as the meeting is only 12 people with half in US and half UK, is there a risk that you are going to look a bit intolerant because you could just sit quietly while this woman prays. As you say you all take turns to lead By taking it up with your boss are you making it into a BIG deal that everyone will be talking about whereas if you just ignored it then for the next 11 meetings there will be o prayers and when it is As turn again she might have worked out for herself that it didn't go down well and just drop it?

SiobhanSharpe · 21/01/2025 20:01

Iamthewintersale · 21/01/2025 14:29

Well, it’s a video call so I suppose I sit there and listen to her thank god for Trump or whatever the hell she wants to pray about????

I was wondering if she would be thanking god for Trump's victory and to guide his hand in Making America Great Again, going forwards.
Religion and politics!

TunnocksOrDeath · 21/01/2025 20:01

Depending on whether you actually have to pretend to like this colleague in order to work with them, it might be fun to take prayer time to its logical extreme, in order to get it banned.
Probably the best way to do this is joining the Church of the Flying Spaghetti Monster. The members call themselves Pastafarians, revere pirates, and often wear pirate hats as an outward sign of their faith. The officiants wear a colander on their heads for services.
So there's a lot for you to work with there when it's your turn to host, and you can choose the form of worship.

PurBal · 21/01/2025 20:00

I’ve worked for employers that prayer at work: churches.

LadyLapsang · 21/01/2025 19:56

Sittings in both the House of Commons and the House of Lords begin with prayers.

TwigletsAndRadishes · 21/01/2025 19:55

MissionBiscuits · 21/01/2025 19:29

I see the point you're trying to make, but for starters Democrats aren't known for trying to force their religious beliefs on others, so it's unlikely they would do something like this. They might invite the team to join them for prayer prior to the meeting if that was normal for them, but it wouldn't be on the agenda.

Trump literally has the support and involvement of fundamentalist christian groups who want to see America governed according to their religious beliefs and in many evangelical churches support for Trump is preached as though it's integral to their religion. They vote according to their religious beliefs and pray according to their political beliefs, so it really is relevant because there is a strong possibility she will want to pray for/about Trump.

for starters Democrats aren't known for trying to force their religious beliefs on others

I beg to differ. We have American Democrats to thank for the modern religions of Diversity, Equity and Inclusion, Critical Race Theory and Trans Ideology. I don't want to forced to worship at the alter of any of those thank you very much, or risk being ostracised by my colleagues or lose my job if I dare to speak out and say so.

HauntedPencil · 21/01/2025 19:54

I agree with you completely. It should be separate and totally optional.

Iamthewintersale · 21/01/2025 19:52

‘The point I am making is that the same request for a prayer could have been made by a Democrat.,

ok, well it wasn’t.

OP posts:
DangerPigeon · 21/01/2025 19:49

I have a few friends that are pagan and they have some lovely prayers, they'd probably make her completely explode

Ger1atricMillennial · 21/01/2025 19:46

Nah not being unreasonable, it will be interesting how she deals with the pushback, maybe you could stand up after an offer a pagan blessing afterwards :)

In NZ we start and end our meetings with a Karakia i.e. Māori blessing. The idea is its to set the tone of participation and focus us on the subject. There is no appeal to any deity in them but I have noticed alot of people say "ameni" which is Te Reo for "amen" at the end.

NeelaBlue · 21/01/2025 19:43

This reply has been withdrawn

This has been withdrawn by MNHQ at the poster's request.

Zanatdy · 21/01/2025 19:41

Religion should be kept off team meeting agenda’s. No way would I agree to this, massively inappropriate. Keep religion out of workplace meetings

Taigabread · 21/01/2025 19:37

Growlybear83 · 21/01/2025 14:20

I'm assuming the OP won't be expected to participate in the prayers so I really dont understand the issue.

It's completely, completely inappropriate in the workplace and frankly borderline offensive.

If a colleague if yours announced the meeting would be starting with a quick pagan ritual, would you consider that appropriate? Absolutely not. It's also very disrespectful to those of other faiths for whom this might be inappropriate, such as those communities in which men and women do not typically pray together.

Faith is a personal choice and there's simply no reason at all to include it in a work meeting. For one thing, if you want to pray, do it in your free time not the time the company are paying you for?! It's akin to asking to read a chapter of a self help book you like to the group at the start of a meeting!!

CrowleyKitten · 21/01/2025 19:37

religion is between you and your Gods, or ancestors, or whoever it is you venerate.
this is deeply inappropriate. they can pray on their own time, not try and push their religion on others. I'm sure they'd soon object if someone of a different religion wanted to start the meeting with group prayer.

Hotflushesandchilblains · 21/01/2025 19:35

shuggles · 21/01/2025 18:42

Do you know what "state" means? "Separation of church and state" in the US has nothing to do with privately-owned businesses.

I am very familiar thanks, having lived in the US for 20 years - are you always so rude? The phrase is usually extrapolated to thinking about the limits of religious influence, with the view that religion should not impinge on daily life or how you are treated. Since this is a workplace, this is an impingement. The right not to have other beliefs imposed on us is vital, but being eroded. I worked for 10 years for an organization which was acquired by a charity set up and run by a religious group. Even they did not insist on prayers in meetings.

CarolinaInTheMorning · 21/01/2025 19:32

Ponderingwindow · 21/01/2025 14:08

I’m in the United States. It would be considered completely inappropriate in any workplace I have been.

If this is not removed from the agenda, contact HR.

Same for me. And I live in the Deep South where I assume most of my colleagues are probably churchgoers. It would be considered highly inappropriate in my workplace.

FairDuck · 21/01/2025 19:29

Iamthewintersale · 21/01/2025 19:23

‘It's also not legal in the US.’

ok. Here too apparently. I have no idea about laws around this, I doubt most people would.
and as for the US in my experience laws vary vastly from state to state but I’ll bow to your superior knowledge…

I do not think prayers at the start of meetings is THAT unusual. I'm sure I read that our local council only abolished them recently due to objections. Not sure if a compromise was offered of allowing those who wanted to pray to go into the meeting room 5 minutes earlier, and those who objected could wait outside. If the house of commons can have prayers then I can't see how it can be illegal to have them. Making it illegal to make people participate is more likely the truth of the matter.

MissionBiscuits · 21/01/2025 19:29

shuggles · 21/01/2025 18:45

@MissionBiscuits When it comes to American evangelicals, their political leanings are very much not irrelevant to their religious beliefs. For an awful lot being a Christian and being a Republican are one and the same.

The point I am making is that the same request for a prayer could have been made by a Democrat. While a higher proportion of Republicans are religious, this does not mean that being religious and being Republican are linked- just that they are correlated. So MAGA lady being a Trump supporter isn't actually relevant.

I see the point you're trying to make, but for starters Democrats aren't known for trying to force their religious beliefs on others, so it's unlikely they would do something like this. They might invite the team to join them for prayer prior to the meeting if that was normal for them, but it wouldn't be on the agenda.

Trump literally has the support and involvement of fundamentalist christian groups who want to see America governed according to their religious beliefs and in many evangelical churches support for Trump is preached as though it's integral to their religion. They vote according to their religious beliefs and pray according to their political beliefs, so it really is relevant because there is a strong possibility she will want to pray for/about Trump.

AlmostCutMyHairToday · 21/01/2025 19:24

Any time I worry about having given up my US citizenship I'm reminded why it was the right decision..! Good luck OP! Would love to know what HR says.

Iamthewintersale · 21/01/2025 19:23

‘It's also not legal in the US.’

ok. Here too apparently. I have no idea about laws around this, I doubt most people would.
and as for the US in my experience laws vary vastly from state to state but I’ll bow to your superior knowledge…

OP posts: