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Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

To feel a bit like everyone hates me when I'm a British tourist in Europe now

341 replies

Everythingisnumbersnow · 17/01/2025 16:23

I try with the language, I try not to get in people's way, I tip and I don't complain.

But everything still feels much more hostile than it used to.

OP posts:
Applecharm25 · 18/01/2025 16:57

Hipalong · 18/01/2025 16:49

Oh dear, no. Germany did NOT colonise Poland. Are you confused about the German (and Soviet) invasion.and occupation of Poland?
That is categorically not what colonisation is.

Maybe you should read some history love, as you dont have a clue what you're on about,
and yes Germany did colonise Poland.

I went onto a history website just there and copied this phrase from it:

"Germany colonized Poland during World War II when it invaded the country on September 1, 1939'

Applecharm25 · 18/01/2025 16:54

Hipalong · 18/01/2025 16:49

Oh dear, no. Germany did NOT colonise Poland. Are you confused about the German (and Soviet) invasion.and occupation of Poland?
That is categorically not what colonisation is.

I've looked up the definition of colonisation , and it is exactly what I've said it is.

Its Invading, taking land and enforcing a culture on the inhabitants.

What do you think colonisation is?

crackofdoom · 18/01/2025 16:53

Snakeoilmaks · 18/01/2025 16:46

As well as the Spanish Inquisition

Well I didn't expect that. I don't think anybody did, tbh.

crackofdoom · 18/01/2025 16:51

Applecharm25 · 18/01/2025 16:41

I just never understand why England gets the reputation as the coloniser and invader.

When nearly every country has invaded other countries in history.

It's a bit annoying.

To be honest, I'm not convinced that it does overall. I mean, it certainly has the reputation of coloniser and invader in countries it colonised and invaded, but in my limited experience in Central and South America, for example, they have much more against the Spanish, logically. Similar for North Africa and France.

I see a lot of debates on Mumsnet with posters wailing "Why are we always the baddies? Other European countries were colonisers too!", but Mumsnet is a British site, and I strongly suspect that on the French, Spanish, Dutch or Belgian equivalents there may be similar breast beating about their respective colonial histories.

Hipalong · 18/01/2025 16:50

Applecharm25 · 18/01/2025 16:41

I just never understand why England gets the reputation as the coloniser and invader.

When nearly every country has invaded other countries in history.

It's a bit annoying.

Maybe read some history, and be less annoying..sorry, annoyed.

Hipalong · 18/01/2025 16:49

Applecharm25 · 18/01/2025 16:38

Yes colonising is invading and taking land. And enforcing your culture on the inhabitants.

England did it to Ireland.

Germany did it to Poland etc

Oh dear, no. Germany did NOT colonise Poland. Are you confused about the German (and Soviet) invasion.and occupation of Poland?
That is categorically not what colonisation is.

Snakeoilmaks · 18/01/2025 16:46

Partylikeits1985 · 18/01/2025 16:39

They certainly caused some trouble for South America.

As well as the Spanish Inquisition

Applecharm25 · 18/01/2025 16:41

I just never understand why England gets the reputation as the coloniser and invader.

When nearly every country has invaded other countries in history.

It's a bit annoying.

Partylikeits1985 · 18/01/2025 16:41

This reply has been withdrawn

This message has been withdrawn at the poster's request

Partylikeits1985 · 18/01/2025 16:39

Applecharm25 · 18/01/2025 16:36

Spain not on the same scale?

Do you know how many countries Spajn invaded?

They certainly caused some trouble for South America.

Applecharm25 · 18/01/2025 16:38

Hipalong · 18/01/2025 16:36

No they didn't. Do you not understand what colonising is?

Yes colonising is invading and taking land. And enforcing your culture on the inhabitants.

England did it to Ireland.

Germany did it to Poland etc

MrsMust · 18/01/2025 16:37

Applecharm25 · 18/01/2025 16:33

Of course it's the same.

Germany colonised nearly the entirety of Europe!

They murdered millions of people. And they displaced millions of people around Europe

Yet people somehow forgive germany but don't forgive England?

Why? It doesn't make sense.

Edited

I could be wrong but don't people say German people carry a sort of guilt about that time and feel like they have to do more to show that they aren't hostile? And maybe people want to see more of that attitude from the English.. IF that is actually what the hostility is about.

I feel like the whole notion that Europeans don't like the English is more a post-Brexit attitude. And maybe it's a "well if you don't like us (and want to leave), then we don't like you either". That, plus maybe our political landscape in the last decade has caused the UK to lose a bit of its gravitas and become a point of jokes (eg. Bumbling Boris, Liz truss the lettuce etc)

Partylikeits1985 · 18/01/2025 16:37

Applecharm25 · 18/01/2025 16:35

Did you read the rest of my post?

I said it doesn't make sense that England has the reputation as being the coloniser.

When germany brutally colonised nearly every country in europe last century.

Yes, I know. I just find the idea a bit silly. Surely the Europeans are aware of their own history?

Hipalong · 18/01/2025 16:36

Applecharm25 · 18/01/2025 16:35

Did you read the rest of my post?

I said it doesn't make sense that England has the reputation as being the coloniser.

When germany brutally colonised nearly every country in europe last century.

No they didn't. Do you not understand what colonising is?

Applecharm25 · 18/01/2025 16:36

Hipalong · 18/01/2025 16:35

Er ..not remotely on the same scale?

Spain not on the same scale?

Do you know how many countries Spajn invaded?

Alaimo · 18/01/2025 16:36

I think this is all a bit main character syndrome-like.

I'm part-British. My husband is 100% British. We live in continental Europe and travel around quite a bit during the holidays. Literally noone cares. They might still be a bit bemused by Brexit, but that's about it. Europeans have their own cost of living, house prices, school choices, car MOTs, birthday planning, grocery shopping and so on to think about. The time spent thinking about Brexit and Brits is approximately zero.

Hipalong · 18/01/2025 16:35

Partylikeits1985 · 18/01/2025 16:34

England has the reputation as being the nasty coloniser that invaded everywhere

Er.. France? Portugal? Spain?

Edited

Er ..not remotely on the same scale?

Applecharm25 · 18/01/2025 16:35

Partylikeits1985 · 18/01/2025 16:34

England has the reputation as being the nasty coloniser that invaded everywhere

Er.. France? Portugal? Spain?

Edited

Did you read the rest of my post?

I said it doesn't make sense that England has the reputation as being the coloniser.

When germany brutally colonised nearly every country in europe last century.

crackofdoom · 18/01/2025 16:35

ObelixtheGaul · 18/01/2025 12:28

I don't think it's as simple as, 'they don't like us'. The problem in a lot of places where there have been protests is down to the sheer volume of people descending upon areas where the infrastructure cannot cope, and local government pushing for more and more.

The 'we are paying their wages' argument would have been all well and good when most of the hotels and businesses were locally owned. The problem now is that in some areas where the biggest local pushback is, the locals aren't making the money any more. International corporations are, and the locals are the ones working ridiculous hours for shit wages.

The rise of all-inclusive chain hotels has resulted in some areas being swamped with tourists, but very little of their money actually going into the local economy. It's one thing putting up with (and in some cases actively encouraging) the drunken idiots when everybody's making money hand over fist, but it is an entirely different kettle of fish when there's more and more people with less and less local benefit.

Some areas are suffering water shortages, massive strain on emergency services, roads not coping with the huge amount of traffic. The cost of this will be born by the locals, and it's a heavy price to pay for the minimum wages and long hours of the industry.

It's not really the tourist's fault that some destinations have reached saturation point, but they've become the target of local frustrations. Frustration at yet another massive hotel being built to price smaller, local concerns out of the market, whilst adding to load on the public infrastructure. Yet more Airbnbs that, despite the ads promoting staying with a friendly local for that 'real' experience are more likely to be owned by someone from abroad these days. Not dissimilar to the 'holiday let' problem here affecting the housing market and shoving up prices for locals.

A lot of this can be laid at the door of government greed and the mistaken 'eggs in one basket' economical approach.

It's all got too big. It's a 'can't live with it, can't live without it' situation. It's no excuse for water pistols, etc, fired at some perfectly decent person who's just come for a nice holiday, but I get why that's how some have chosen to protest.

Agree. I used to live and study in Venice, and speak Italian, and Venetian dialect too. It's been weird going back as a tourist, and being treated as such, especially when they don't know that I understand what they're saying. I was on the island of Torcello late one evening, and peered round the back of the church because there was a strange noise. It was a guy fixing the AC unit, and he went off on an extended rant about just when you finally think the tourists are gone someone's staring at you and you're never left in peace for a moment etc etc...😳😆 God, I could see his point though! I'm not surprised people are frustrated, but it's hardly personal.

In Venice, and again in Genova, which is a relatively untouristed city where people on low incomes can still live in the historic centre, I have seen anti tourism graffiti. I don't take it personally, but understand that people don't want their home utterly transformed and their communities destroyed.

MrsMust · 18/01/2025 16:35

A shopkeeper in Amsterdam was vehemently anti-English a few years ago. She herself was from a Scandinavian country but her husband was English and she said she had found English people intolerant of others in recent years. I don't know if it was something lost in translation (she was speaking in English) but she was very very sweary when speaking about it. Other than that, I haven't really encountered any hostility.

Partylikeits1985 · 18/01/2025 16:34

England has the reputation as being the nasty coloniser that invaded everywhere

Er.. France? Portugal? Spain?

TheNewHiker · 18/01/2025 16:34

Everythingisnumbersnow · 17/01/2025 18:13

Big round face, constant mild rosacea flush, pale and pink and a fan of floral frocks. A big tum relative to the rest of me. A constantly anxious "God I'm so sorry" facial expression. There's probably more I don't realise.

Possibly they are intrigued by this floral vision rather than full of hate!

Applecharm25 · 18/01/2025 16:33

Hipalong · 18/01/2025 16:32

It does. The British did it for a thousand years and colonised half the world. It's not the same.

Of course it's the same.

Germany colonised nearly the entirety of Europe!

They murdered millions of people. And they displaced millions of people around Europe

Yet people somehow forgive germany but don't forgive England?

Why? It doesn't make sense.

Hipalong · 18/01/2025 16:32

Applecharm25 · 18/01/2025 16:31

No she hasn't. Look up racism
It includes country of origin.

No it doesn't.

Hipalong · 18/01/2025 16:32

Applecharm25 · 18/01/2025 16:30

I do agree that the English are not liked around Europe.
England has the reputation as being the nasty coloniser that invaded everywhere.

It's weird because Germany has caused much more destruction, and colonised countries much more recently round Europe.

Yet Germans don't have the reputations as "the colonisers". England has that reputation. It doesn't really make sense.

It does. The British did it for a thousand years and colonised half the world. It's not the same.