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To think London is in a major decline?

642 replies

Phannyphart · 17/01/2025 12:07

I’ve lived in London (zone 2) for 10+ years. It’s always been pretty ‘real’ here but since the end of covid really everywhere just seems so, so awful.
Dog shit everywhere, spit everywhere, council owned parks closed and locked, people littering more than ever before. Get on a bus and it’s just people screaming in to a FaceTime on top volume, people blasting TikTok. Kids being stabbed in broad daylight, people shooting up heroin near the nearby primary school. The area has a lot going for it but it really seems wherever I go there is an awful decline.
Has anybody feeling the same actually moved out? Do you regret it?

OP posts:
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5
Shwish · 19/01/2025 10:14

BoldBlueZebra · 19/01/2025 08:35

I just hate London and people are rude. It’s just one massive trample to get anywhere and the noise the crowds. I don’t like it at all. Tbf my only experience of London before this was coming down for the olympics when it had its best face on. I imagine if I lived there I would get accustomed the noise and crowds in exchange for public transportation that works and the facilities

Have you actually spent much time in London? It's unclear from your post. If you've only been as a tourist and spent your time in places like Leicester Square, Oxford Street and Madame Tussaud's then I can see why you'd think it's a horrible crowded dirty place.
I've lived in London my whole life and I've never been mugged nor do I feel unsafe walking around at night. I think a lot of people who talk London down don't actually know it.

OldScribbler · 19/01/2025 10:13

JHound · 19/01/2025 02:22

They never have stats.

https://www.statista.com/statistics/380963/london-crime-rate/

HERE ARE STATISTICS

Rewindpresse · 19/01/2025 10:09

dontcryformeargentina · 19/01/2025 09:34

We have parent patrols near our school now to protect children. It wasn't like that before.

Where on earth do you live? I’ve never heard of anything like this and have friends and colleagues all over the city.

BeAzureAnt · 19/01/2025 10:08

Packetofcrispsplease · 19/01/2025 10:03

oh no !
where were you in Edinburgh?
I am not far from the city and while Princes St is definitely nowhere near as lovely as it used to be , I always feel safe .

I think the Meadows Walk in the university quarter in Edinburgh is one of the loveliest in the world.

bakebeans · 19/01/2025 10:04

Flyingtonight · 17/01/2025 12:08

I think the same decline is happening everywhere, except outside London you also have to deal with crap public transport.

This! Spot on.

I live in the North West. It’s cheaper for me to get a flight and hotel to Spain or Dublin than it is to go to London!

Packetofcrispsplease · 19/01/2025 10:03

Beryls · 17/01/2025 12:31

I can only speak as a tourist but it had been quite a few years since I'd been to London when I went last year. From social media etc I fully expected to be stabbed on arrival, robbed, see marauding gangs waving machetes or be caught up in a Palestine march.

Needless to say none of that happened. I felt really safe, even at night. It was clean as any capital city and my God, as someone from far up north, what I'd give to be able to get around on public transport the way you can in London!

Obviously that's only central London I'm talking about, not outside of there but nowhere is perfect.

When I went to Edinburgh before christmas I had the opposite experience, I didn't feel safe at all, drunks and druggies all over the place, got accosted by someone shouting about Palestine and then a man was demanding I go back into my hotel (as didn't have cash on me) to get him some money for a sandwich. Compared to the previous times I'd been to Edingurgh I really noticed a change for thr worse. I'm also sure that's not everyone's experience but it put me off.

All places have pros and cons but I thought London was brilliant.

oh no !
where were you in Edinburgh?
I am not far from the city and while Princes St is definitely nowhere near as lovely as it used to be , I always feel safe .

UpSkilling · 19/01/2025 09:53

I went to Whitechapel the other day, I hadn't been for over 20 years and it was vastly improved in terms of infrastructure.

I live in North London and actually like my area, since an elderly man near us died the volume of dog poo on the pavement decreased exponentially. Amazing the impact just one person can make. The general rise in dog poo on pavements is due to increased dog ownership during Covid, it's probably relatively few individuals who don't pick it up but is more noticeable.

Drug use is crazy, it's everywhere and with it comes gangs muggings etc. At my local tube station the staff say the issue is much worse than in the past. I never noticed how many dealers there were before and while I don't feel unsafe, I'm concerned for my DC.

Mugging has increased because stealing a phone with bank details etc saved on it is easy and very lucrative you can access thousands of pounds in minutes often.

Also drugs are a global issue, in both the rich and poor countries. Synthetic drugs are super cheap and lethal. We need to tackle this issue globally as a priority.

Retail is depressed on the high street with online shopping, I think we need to rethink high streets to make them useful again maybe not with shops but destination experience shops.

Technology has changed our world more than anything else in the last couple of hundred years, particularly the smartphone, but we need structures in place to change how we live now, it's still early days so fingers crossed 🤞

justteanbiscuits · 19/01/2025 09:43

OldScribbler · 18/01/2025 22:58

The crime rate has indeed gone up in the last 20 years - by nigh on 50%.

Reporting and recording of crime has also improved massively in the last 20 years.

dontcryformeargentina · 19/01/2025 09:34

We have parent patrols near our school now to protect children. It wasn't like that before.

dontcryformeargentina · 19/01/2025 09:30

I feel the same OP. I'm in SW London ( zone 2). I don't feel safe coming back home at night ( had an incident when a male was following me till my doorstep and I was literally saved by a female neighbour), my secondary school son and his friends are at constant risk. He personally was stopped three times on his way back home from school by masked youth gangs since he was 12 and asked for money / phone. Every single day my neighbours post on Nextdoor about attempted robberies, stolen cars. The crime is massively up and I feel it will get much worse.

BTshun · 19/01/2025 09:27

I’m in SW London also (SW3) and I’ve never felt unsafe anywhere. I love London. I have friends in various parts of SW (Battersea, Wimbledon, Clapham Common, Balham) and in the main they’re all great places to live with great transport, lots of open space and plenty of busy bars, restaurants and cafes. It’s a great city.

BoldBlueZebra · 19/01/2025 08:35

I just hate London and people are rude. It’s just one massive trample to get anywhere and the noise the crowds. I don’t like it at all. Tbf my only experience of London before this was coming down for the olympics when it had its best face on. I imagine if I lived there I would get accustomed the noise and crowds in exchange for public transportation that works and the facilities

YesYesKitten · 19/01/2025 08:15

paranoiaofpufflings · 19/01/2025 02:48

I think you must be a very close neighbour of mine! I've read your post and the updates. I am also zone 2 east London and agree with everything you've said.
The crime, drugs, gangs, mopeds, swearing, spitting, permanent smell of weed, dodgy men just hanging around in the street, stabbings, kids setting off fireworks, it's like everyone has given up living as a decent human being. I've lived here 15 years and noticed this shift particularly in the last couple of years.
The huge cultural divide and lack of Bangladeshi integration made significantly worse by mayor Rahman.

Interesting still no-one blaming Farage or racist rioters.

Karneval25 · 19/01/2025 07:52

Aceh2 · 18/01/2025 19:48

I live in Tower Hamlets, I guess you’re not far away? It isn’t always as clean as I’d like, but the parks are stunning, schools are excellent, shopping and food choices are amazing thanks to the borough’s diversity, people are friendly. Personally I love living here and find it hard to think about leaving.

“84 per cent of people are satisfied with our local area and 90 per cent say people from different backgrounds get on well with each other in our cohesive community”

www.towerhamlets.gov.uk/News_events/2025/January/Tower-Hamlets-welcomes-being-named-as-the-best-place-to-live-in-East-London.aspx

Got to wonder about a London Borough in which 84% are happy to live in an area controlled by a corrupt Mayor. I do not believe this survey.

Fridayfridaycatsandblamange · 19/01/2025 07:32

Peckham has been desirable for at least last 14 years. I tried to buy there when I moved to SE London and still couldn’t afford it then.

Believeitornot · 19/01/2025 07:32

Not sure what you expect OP in a country with massive inequality which has got worse.

Local councils can’t afford to do the basic maintenance they did because their main source of funding was cut. Unless you live in Westminster which has loads of money and one of the rare ones.

There is also a hidden parasite which is taking wealth out of the country. I noticed you dropping in a comment about assimilation. It’s not that. But it’s the rise in money and wealth being tied up in mortgages and investment funds. Money has to be used to service that, leaving less money for other things. Take an example:
House prices have massively shot up. Now, you may not know this, but the same has happened for retail and commercial property. Not many companies own outright, they too have to borrow. So it’s cheaper for them to move online.
Similarly for councils. They’ve had to borrow via PFIs.
As more has to be spent on servicing debt = less money for wages and other things. Plus, profit has to be made!
So yes, things are screwed but, as ever, like in Roman Empire, it’s the Uber rich doing the screwing. And just like in Rome, they’ll fall eventually.

Fridayfridaycatsandblamange · 19/01/2025 07:29

kell4life · 18/01/2025 19:26

My family and I visited central London for the first time in 2 years over the Christmas period, we travelled in from the tube near Hertfordshire, it felt unsafe, druggies on the tube rocking back and forth. I hate the place nowadays, I hold onto my handbag incase it gets snatched and was mighty relived to get back out. The place is a bog hole. I have London roots and feel my grandparents would be upset to see what London now is. I’d be happy if I never went there again and wonder how on earth people cope living there, especially considering the cost. Hell!

Where did you visit? I mean that does sound awful but I live and work in London and don’t recognise that at all.

HarrietsweetHarriet · 19/01/2025 07:15

I worked all over London for several decades. Parts were rough, but nothing like now.
It's decline since Covid, Brexit, recession, is dreadful.

When I visit now, I generally can't wait to leave. Probably because everything is so bloody expensive it just makes me miserable.
I think the general mood for the working and middle classes s that we've been royally shafted. Some of us reluctantly put up with it, keep calm and carry on,, whilst others just don't care about the environment, other people/their community, and behave like arseholes. The rudeness of some people is a disgrace.

EasyTouch · 19/01/2025 04:16

Greyish2025 · 17/01/2025 16:25

It was shit well before Brexit so that really can’t be blamed for it

Yep.... the UK has not recovered from the 2008 Credit Crunch/banking crisis.
It was that that revealed how surface the progress that the then eleven year Labour progress had been.

Post Covid Tory era just ripped the sticking plaster of delusion off for all but the evangelical.

Brexit is just a convenient scapegoat for those who weren't open eyed before it.

And I voted "remain", completely open eyed to the decline of the UKf for too mant which caused many to vote the opposite way.

EasyTouch · 19/01/2025 03:54

What is shocking about London is that there are hardly any areas where the houses and streets are all clean and pretty.
As a population, us Londoners are not civic minded where it comes to aesthetics and the upkeep of our surroundings.
As for Peckham. Rye Lane has gone completely downhill since "aspirational/standard having working class" stopped being the target .
So many name brand and non corporate/cabal stores closed down on the Lane and Choumert Road between the late 80s to 2005.
Walworth Road and East Street has gone the same way, but does not look as frownsy as Rye Lane.

Big up to Harte's butchers, the only Peckham business that stops me doing the whole of my grocery shopping in Brixton.

echt · 19/01/2025 03:22

JHound · 19/01/2025 02:22

They never have stats.

Innit though?

Wikipedia comes to the rescue:

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Crime_in_London

Crime in London - Wikipedia

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Crime_in_London

paranoiaofpufflings · 19/01/2025 02:48

I think you must be a very close neighbour of mine! I've read your post and the updates. I am also zone 2 east London and agree with everything you've said.
The crime, drugs, gangs, mopeds, swearing, spitting, permanent smell of weed, dodgy men just hanging around in the street, stabbings, kids setting off fireworks, it's like everyone has given up living as a decent human being. I've lived here 15 years and noticed this shift particularly in the last couple of years.
The huge cultural divide and lack of Bangladeshi integration made significantly worse by mayor Rahman.

JHound · 19/01/2025 02:33

ReturnoftheBink · 18/01/2025 20:18

Peckham no go 10 years ago is ridiculously overstated.

Yeah I was blown away by the comment.

I used to go to Peckham regularly in the late 00s and have no idea it was meant to be a “no-go” zone!

JHound · 19/01/2025 02:22

echt · 19/01/2025 02:22

This shows the crime rate in London down over the last ten years. Do you have figures for the last twenty to support your assertion?

https://crimerate.co.uk/london

They never have stats.

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