To think London is in a major decline?

The road my youngest's school is on, and the other school a few hundred meters away, are the worst streets for it in our area.

Phone and bag theft in London is rife - at least half my friends have had at least one phone or bag stolen in the past couple of years, mostly in the West End and central West. I had my clutch bag snatched in Soho about six months ago - gang of youths on bicycles just swarmed the pavement from behind and grabbed any phones or bags that were easily detached from their owners. Likewise shop raiding - I’ve been in Lewisham shopping centre twice now (and I don’t go to Lewisham shopping centre that often) and just seen a group of men in hoodies and balaclavas shove their way into a shop, grab armfuls of stuff from shelves / rails and leg it.

Our council is pretty great about clearing up fly tipping, but it’s still a problem.

I think politicians should take note of the number of references to litter and dog shit on this thread.

Stop people doing that and you will masssively improve the quality of life of Londoners.

Start with campaigns in schools.

How so, specifically?

London is not what it was it the late 90s it’s deteriorated big time …we have millions more people now and it’s a mess and so sad to see.

I’ve seen grown men doing the toilet in the street in central London beyond grim.
also people spitting which is gross 🤮. We have lots of cultures London is a melting pot always has been but now we are seeing behaviours that just don’t fit with our ways …think someone else law touched on that sanitation etc …

People are scum.

That's the answer.
I'm not sure why.

I was raised to not litter, not swear near kids, be polite, move for other people,.don't park your car like an asshole, leave space on pavements for wheelchairs and pushchairs, pick up dog mess, don't let dog off lead if you're not in a park, put dog on lead if you see someone you don't know etc etc.

All this has gone out the window with the majority of people it seems.

Sure there's one or two who aren't scum, but they're fewer and further between now than they were...

Remember Keeping Up Appearances?

Hyacinth and Onslow..
In a weird way it seems the country is now full of Onslows and there's fewer Hyacinths then ever..

@catcafeatno10 this is so true! Your "on the other hand" list is everywhere I have links to so I go there!

Was it Dr. Samuel Johnson who said that last line?

It's an amazing city I have to agree. History is teeming everywhere. That blue plaque scheme is great.

Remember my first time in London and singing to myself "Panic on the streets of London". Very excited. Eyes lit up when on the train coming into Liverpool street station when I saw the gherkin.

In terms of safety, any major city is the same. New York (far safer than it was in the 80s when over 2,000 were being murdered per year) is now seen as one of the more safer US cities yet it still has 5 times the homicides of London (and both have similar populations so it's very like for like)

I see people dropping litter, stealing phones, raiding shops in gangs, dumping rubbish and mattresses, dog crap everywhere and generally not taking care of where they live.

Where on earth do you go and see this? I've never seen anywhere like that, particularly not stealing phones or raiding shops in gangs, and have lived in London all my life. I have seen fly tipping a couple of times, not anyone doing it but after the event, they tend to do that late at night, and both times involved a mattress but that was years ago. The council cleared both.

Hmm, I live there and there is plenty of litter and dog shit. And a lot of empty shop/restaurant units in Blackheath. Not saying it isn’t nice in lots of ways, but it’s not utopia!

I don't know... I lived in London as a child in the 70s and literally the overwhelming memory I have of it was that there was dogshit EVERYWHERE. My earliest memories are of dogshit on pavements.

I'm not saying I like it but the idea that its suddenly got worse it a myth.

<takes out false teeth>

Eeh, you should have been around in the 1960s and 1970s. Dog shit everywhere, because if you'd told people they needed to pick it up, everyone would have laughed in your face.

Sounds like you're in certain pockets of Tower Hamlets, which is rather notorious for being badly run/interesting politics. Waltham Forest has definitely improved. Newham has some way to go. Every area is different, shop around before you leave! And do your bit. I hope I do mine by keeping a tidy, nice front garden.

That said, over a decade of national underinvestment in public services hasn't helped.

I agree that austerity, brexit, lockdowns all had a hand in this but I think the community makeup also has a part to play.

Where I live in East London I see so many different cultures doing their best to live within their own bubbles that all problems are just somebody elses problem.

I see people dropping litter, stealing phones, raiding shops in gangs, dumping rubbish and mattresses, dog crap everywhere and generally not taking care of where they live.

Theres no sense of pride anymore because nobody seems to be pulling in the same direction. I love(d) London but it is indeed turning in to an absolute shit hole. I've spent my whole life here but I'm fast approaching the point where I want to move out.

JFK had it right when he said:

"Ask not what your country can do for you, ask what you can do for your country"

Same up north where I am. Pavements caked in shite (second time this week I’ve had to scrub my pram wheels down 😡).
Smackheads and feral teens running riot. One threw a brick at a bus for no reason beside mine last week. Week previous it was on the local Facebook page kids had climbed on the GP surgery roof and were pelting rocks at passing traffic!
I used to live in an area of town with a high Asian/African /Jewish population. Still quite a rough area but never experienced such antisocial behaviour and the streets were clean. It’s a disgrace and utterly grim.

Me too; we recently have been in Sutton, New Maldon, Kingston, Thames-Ditton and so on - it is absolutely gorgeous

I wondered how long it would be before the OP returned to post about how it’s probably the fault of immigrants. Yawningly predictable.

The whole of the UK is in a gradual decline due to general underinvestment and mismanagement, largely by the last govt. How anyone expects growth outside the single market on our doorstep is beyond me. Anyway, problems re: drugs, littering, anti-social behaviour etc will always increase when investment in education, central funding for councils, rehabs, homelessness services etc fall. A mere glance at any economic history text book will show you that.

Maybe stop assuming it’s all the fault of black and brown people.

Leaving aside austerity, Brexit and various other undeniable macro-influences, the number of people who have mentioned dog shit makes it clear there's definitely also been a decline in personal responsibility.

I don't want to go into politics whether Brexit has made an impact on London or not. What many of us living outside the UK who loved London is how much the city has changed for the worse since the 90s/2000s to the last few years.

I'm also a bit fed up always reading the justification of "European countries/cities have also declined". Yes, living costs have hit western societies the same but many cities in Europe keep investing heavily in their cities, unlike London - a city seriously in decline for those of us who loved it many years ago.

I grew up in London and live on the border of zone 2 & 3 in an area I remember from the 80s and 90s. It is so much nicer than it was, the swimming pool was redone just before austerity cuts and is now well run as is the gym. The coffee shops on the high street are thriving, there's a good sense of community.
But there is still some dog shit and very often beggars.

I do think there was a high point in the late 2000s when all of London was looking pretty good and it's kind of been going downhill since

I've left London now (emigrated) but my pocket of SE London was lovely. So it might just be an East London thing.

I think it's a great city and it didn't feel like it declined in the 12 years I lived there. Admittedly I mainly frequented nice, leafy areas and stayed away from famously sketchy areas.

I grew up in the 80s and it was super grim then and so much dog poo and crime. Personally, I think London is still much better. I live in zone 3 and think things are on balance ok, over the years our high street has lost a lot of the old retail giants but it has gained some community led arts areas and independent shops. I go into central london often and I don't see major decline, it's really buzzing and there are new buildings including theatres but yes Oxford street needs a revamp. Plus the Elizabeth line has proven to be really useful. The big problem is poverty and homelessness, never have I seen it so bad.

I’ve not noticed it in my little patch of London. I have noticed more bobbies on the beat here, maybe that’s why?

Not in my price range in Wimbledon village sorry to say. I have prioritised other expenses that involve my children and their futures. Not that my uk home is in the village, it's midway down where the commoners are!

Sorry you find that weird, in my family this is normal.

I also maintain two homes in different countries plus children (and specific sport) and pets.

Maybe rather that be sarcastic think outside of your own little box that some people can't afford the ivy or the little posh boutiques and down the hill there barely anything there, some charity shops, Greggs, Starbucks etc. Shocking that I don't shop designer nor eat out, as a single mum too so 🖐

Very true. Although it's housing and lots of other long standing decisions that have fucked the economy!