To think the call back into the office is an example of the patriarchy very much alive and well?

BS. MH is just an excuse for anything now

Of course people are happier avoiding the rush hour but work is work. People cant just work from home cos its easier. Whatever next? A shorter week cos its good for MH.

Give your head a wobble.

@MattBerningerstrophywife so bosses are trying to make workers lives as shit as possible?

It's not a patriarchy problem it's a capitalist problem.

Mental health is hugely important. If employers don’t pay attention to it, they are shooting themselves in the foot as around 63% of UK companies admit that Mental Health issues are one of the most common reasons for long term sick leave

I think office working is just an excuse for crap managers not to train people properly. Oh just ask your colleagues.
I do not want to train people in using IT systems who are new to the role when it is not my job, and the manager has not organised proper training.

"if an employee was highly productive in-office, they’ll be productive at home; if an employee slacked off at the office, they’ll do the same a home."

https://www.forbes.com/sites/bryanrobinson/2022/02/04/3-new-studies-end-debate-over-effectiveness-of-hybrid-and-remote-work/

Well, studies seem to suggest that the majority of people believe that they're more productive working from home (73% in last one I read) but that management disagree. The reality is not yet clear but certainly a lot of data suggests that 100% wfh is the least productive and hybrid is sometimes on a par with working in the office but may not be.

There also seems to be a possible link between people who prefer wfh being significantly less productive at home when compared to those who prefer working in the office. I wonder if this reflects the fact that some people want to wfh for less ethical reasons (like longer lunches and being able to hide from management etc).

But who really knows at this stage.

really? My first job was sitting beside a woman who told me the square root of fuck all, and a manager who did not speak to me about a single thing I did wrong (because I wasn’t bloody trained), instead he just wrote “error noted”.

ive also implemented several software systems and migrated clients from one platform to another successfully while working from home

Well, I am more productive from home. So 🤷‍♀️

Others won't be (I'm guessing most in jobs where it's demonstrable are, in the main).

It seems we have a nation of piss poor managers who can't cope with dealing with people who aren't pulling their weight WFH. Some serious training is needed for those people!

It shouldn't be our job to fix it but realistically who else will?

Yes basically this. But mentioning MH is a bit of a piss take. Of course anyone is going to have a better quality of life if they arent sitting in traffic twice a day and have more time for gyms and homemade food or whatever.

But its work not a holiday camp!

I’ve read this whole thread with interest.
There’s a lot of women blaming other women for circumstances and situations that have been created by the patriarchy, in my view. And - as always - it’s not our job to fix this (like we haven’t got enough to do??)
There are also a wide range of valid perspectives presented.
It’s a complex issue experienced differently by us all.

Just reposting my previous post from yesterday for those that may have missed it - not had one solitary comment about these studies and I think they're interesting.

They're not in any way intended as a gotcha as most state that the findings aren't conclusive but they certainly bring into question the commonly stated dogma that people are more productive when wfh.

I work in a job where WFH is not possible. But having seen a few of these threads, the reasons the OP gives for wanting to WFH make it sound like she wants to do housework or childcare during her work hours. She’s then being given a hard time.

However if she’d said that her mental health is improved by working from home it would be perceived differently. In this case it might be she is able to go to the gym in the morning instead of commuting, has a healthy homemade lunch and finishes early enough to go for a run.

It somehow sounds more positive and worthy than saying ‘I’m less stressed WFH because I can use my breaks to get ahead with other tasks’ which is pretty sad.

A lot of the more recent studies have found that people that solely wfh are a fair bit less productive and that hybrid is about the same as being in the office. They also seem to repeatedly find that the vast majority of people think they're more productive when wfh (73% in last one I read).

Make of that what you will.

@CaptainCarrotsBigSword you do know you can share your screen over zoom?

Any those property companies are likely forming a good part of your pension investments portfolio, so be careful what you wish for.

I'm too young to be a boomer - I'm a millennial. I've also career changed recently and I'm now entry level in a totally different industry. We have hybrid working, most people in my work in office because a) they are young and they don't have the luxury of a dedicated work space at home, b) they enjoy the social aspect of the office, c) it is much, much easier the ask for help and to support others when they need help if you can just ask the person next to you to have a quick look at your screen. They and I are also aware that it is much easier to be on the lookout for opportunities and at the forefront of people's minds when special projects etc come up if you are actually there.

Some archaic people on this thread. Boomers.

Experts on radio 4 believe that the call to return is to prevent a fall in demand for office space, as many of these companies are headed up by investors in property. Really makes a lot of patriarchal sense.

It was not intended to be a clincher, but to show up the poster’s glib and evidence-free assertion.

OP I notice your post says I have a child why did it not say we have a child?
How did the childcare discussions between you and your husband go before you had the child? How did the career progression discussions go? How did the division of household chores discussion go?
Or did you both just assume that this wouldn't affect him and only your job would be impacted? Did you look at the options for his job? Why do your employers need to make allowances but not his?

But that's what wraparound care is for - working parents. My boys are in wraparound care every day and it's fine. I work full time and neither me nor my husband work from home ever.

Well you are very lucky then, companies are more compassionate than in the past, but Companies are there to make a profit they will not make any more accommodation for your circumstances than they have to.

I disagree.
When my son was at primary school, even though he was old enough to walk home, I'd often schedule my breaks so that I could walk up there (10 mins) to collect him. I got a walk and a little chat.

WFH has many positives from the employers perspective too. My husband has had a lot of difficulty finding the right people for his department previously. Since WFH came in he has employed people from the other side of the country who have fitted in perfectly. One has since had a child & recently returned to work after maternity leave.
My son also works for a company based in Europe but works from home. It just gives many more opportunities to employees and employers alike.

Learning to focus is a skill. I would have found it much harder when I was earlier on in my career or my children were younger. I also have a garden office so that I 'go to work'.
I think the quick chat issue is less of a problem when the whole team are remote. I did struggle with it when I was remote and the rest of the team were in CalTech.
We do have scheduled meetings but we are also available to video call during the day. I'm often pinging my manager asking to have a zoom call because it's easier than email.