To think the call back into the office is an example of the patriarchy very much alive and well?

Oh I take it back. All posts before 9am or during a lunch break, which I suppose everyone is allowed 😉 sorry @chocolatespreadsandwich

Lots of "internal admin" being recorded on @chocolatespreadsandwich timesheet today 😅

I don't use after-school childcare because I WFH. But. That doesn't mean I work less than I did before . My time is all recordable in 6 minutes blocks anyway.
Dd either relaxes and plays with Lego /the dog /watches TV, or (most nights) I drop her to a dance class or her tutor at 4 and then carry on working and DH picks her up.

I have increased flexibility in how and when I work but I still exceed my targets

Can you remind me what your point about WFH with children present is?

There is a HUGE difference between supervising a young child all day and an older child entertaining themselves for a couple of hours in the afternoon a couple of times a week. The latter is no different to said child letting themselves in when no parent is at home (latchkey kids) which has been happening for a very long time.

Of course I would never cancel a cc to collect a child.

@Yestttlo
"However the point remains that someone has to do more, it’s never 50/50, and that’s usually women due to breastfeeding, time off from maternity leave etc. The right to work from home is essential for women"

What about women that have to go into work. Like cleaners, retail or restaurant staff, nurses, doctors, barristers, bus or train drivers, construction workers (to name just a few). What message have you got for them? You sound entitled. Besides, anyone working from home is supposed to be doing just that, not looking after kids or putting the washing on.

Thank you but that clarifies my point about people cancelling cc whilst WFH or parent WFH while children present

I sit on several Boards so I have some insight.

A CEO is not supposed to be on site every day - that’s more the role of a COO. Of course, it’s inspiring etc if the CEO makes an appearance, but I would imagine, in this case, he spends a lot of time in the air etc.

This is all dependent on which sector one operates in of course.

Obviously he’s legally allowed to! It’s just such an incredibly shit example of leading from the top when equally obviously most of your staff cannot wfh ever and he gets paid such absolute megabucks he could get a helicopter ride to the office every day if he wanted. How is he ever supposed to inspire or motivate any of them?

Fucking hell OP - who pissed in your tea this morning - what are you SO angry. It's only Tuesday as well 😂.

A CEO would be subject to a stringent contract - if that contract entitles him to WFH, that’s up to him and SB.

As to the workers earning minimum wage, assuming many were baristas etc., then of course they need to be on site. I assume a significant number would be seasonal workers and students etc., meaning temporary roles.

I think unions can be fantastic. I also think few of the generally well paid people complaining that they have to go to work at JPMorgan have a leg to stand on.
What I think is truly offensive is the Starbucks ceo hired last year from chipotle. The man is being paid something like $80 MILLION and he was staying in his home in San Fran not relocating to Seattle to work full time in the office, despite most starbucks workers earning minimum wage and having to physically turn up. That’s offensive.

To be clear, I am not advocating for union membership.

I am private sector and the area I am in - it would never happen.

@chocolatespreadsandwich

Of course. But it does wind me up when people who have no experience of it unthinkingly parrot out this "productivity" mantra.

In my household, dh and adult son wfh (occasional days in office) and I go out to work.

I am neither for nor against the return to the office, I think what is best varies widely from job to job and person to person.

And I have no issue with my team chatting at work or putting the laundry on at home etc as long as they are getting the job done

My point is her clients were perfectly happy with her work whether she did it at home or in a beach side villa on a tropical island - and they were none the wiser

@chocolatespreadsandwich

Those chats aren't pointless, they are part of what makes you feel like a team, part of what roots you in a work place.

Maybe, debatable. I personally find them draining and tedious but the argument that’s always being made by the all back to the office contingent is that people are more productive in the office. Which in my case is demonstrably not true.

Theres a lack of consistency in this argument: why is it OK to waste 40 minutes making tea and talking about Baby Reindeer in the break room but not OK to put laundry on while you WhatsApp your desk mate?

The clue is in the term ‘self employed’

You will see that I said he was old enough to walk home. You can infer from this that he was therefore old enough to take care of himself for a little while at home.
Some days he had after school clubs, other days he would go to the childminder (as I work full time and preferred him to have company) and some days he'd enjoy a few hours entertaining himself at home.

My friend is self employed and spends a decent chunk of each year working from abroad while travelling. She takes multiple holidays each year but some of those days she will spend working. Her clients don't even need to know where she is. She earns a fortune so it hasn't affected her output .

I definitely have occasionally had long and totally unwork related chats with colleagues, both in the office and other teams.

Those chats aren't pointless, they are part of what makes you feel like a team, part of what roots you in a work place. Other days I might intensely and flat out.

But if we dismiss all the intangible benefits of chats with colleagues then work becomes sterile. I expect that where people get on well with colleagues there is much better workplace retention

As a manager I was always pleased to see some chat between the team, or those in other teams. It's those chats that build a team far more than an occasional away day does

I have never in 35 years of working spent 2 hours talking about Netflix or any other non work chat
I am all for some flexibility ,but essentially I think the employer decides where they want the staff to work from and if staff aren't happy they move on

There could be a tax problem with people relocating for large portions of the year.

Is this real?
Says it all

Oh, I don’t mean that she is saying anything offensive by saying “give your head a wobble”, but I am saying that i have never heard anyone say the phrase in real life! It’s such a mumsnet cliche