Why do so many people criticise vegans?

I’m not reading further, because this post seems to me to have delivered the final correct and nuanced statement. @BogRollBOGOF thank you.

@Hunglikeapolevaulter I do understand your point, but I don't think any of the deaths are "humane" though. It is not possible to "humanely" slaughter an animal. Even if the cow was stunned beforehand or whatever. Nor the methods of artificial insemination, taking their babies away from them or whatever - I believe that's another point of cognitive dissonance.

@macaroniandcheeze I agree with you about trying to convince people in real life (not talking about this thread, which was opened to discuss veganism and so is a valid space for debate) - it doesn't work, unless they are somewhat open minded about it.

However I think people are influenced in different ways - when they see the health benefits, for example. Non-aggressive ways. Veganism being "cool", benefits to environment, and also when they see that you are a proponent of kindness and so on - these are the things that catch on. Hence we've seen such a shift towards veganism in recent years. These are ways to influence people which work way better. Mostly leading by example.

On another note I do think some of the videos about slaughterhouses also really do work - but will you find anyone prepared to watch them? Unlikely. And pressurising them to watch them often puts them off even more.

"I like cows but am more than happy to eat them."
How can you "like" an animal, but be prepared to have it killed on your behalf, and then eat it? Just weird.
Not trying to be provocative here, just find it baffling.

Pragmatism, really. And I'm not really upset about things dying as long as it's quick and humane.

The same way farmers can care carefully for their livestock, and genuinely feel affection for them, but be pragmatic about the end result.

As a vegan can I give you my perspective on this. For the record I have never ever lectured my family on animal farming, cruelty etc. But I can totally see why others do.

The thing is, when you become vegan, the only way I can describe it is like you’ve left a cult, and all your family and friends are still in the cult (it’s just an analogy). You have realised how awful farming is, seen how the animals suffer, etc etc (not going to lecture here either!) and you want everyone to know! You didn’t know, and now you do, and it’s suddenly shocking and appalling that people don’t know! Why doesn’t everyone know this?! Everything would be different, if these good people, kind people that you love, knew and cared in the same way you do.

And it’s incredibly hard for some people to accept that you can’t influence people, and that some people who will always be good kind people that you love will never know or care like you do.

But you have to remember that you were them once too and nothing would have changed your mind either. 10 years ago I’d have laughed at the idea of being vegan, I loved cheese!! No amount of vegan ranting would have changed that.

Personally I accepted pretty much straight away that I’ll never convince anyone to see animal welfare/ farming / veganism the way I do so I won’t try as it’s just upsetting for everyone. That’s why it feels culty, as soon as you speak out about it you’re looked at as a troublemaker.

Don’t get me wrong I still wish people would abstain from animal products. It would be a much better planet if we didn’t abuse it so. But I know yelling at my aunt about pigs being slaughtered isn’t going to help.

Yesterday:
B: porridge with oat milk and banana and half a grapefruit. L: peanut butter on whole grain toast, bowl of home made veg soup. D: lentil shepherd's pie with brocoli. Snack: coconut yoghurt with berries.
My dinners are not that different from the usual family menus except I substitute beans, nuts pulses for meat. So I might make a nut roast in place of beef (recipes on line) bean chilli (no mince obvs) lentil curries, bean burgers etc. I do cook a lot from scratch as don't care for substitutes much, but its very quick and easy when you don't have to faff with meat.

You see, I don't get the cognitive dissonance in statements like this.

"I like cows but am more than happy to eat them."

How can you "like" an animal, but be prepared to have it killed on your behalf, and then eat it? Just weird.

Not trying to be provocative here, just find it baffling.

For anyone interested in following a balanced vegan diet, try Challenge22

https://challenge22.com

On a side note, with reference to the biological age and longevity studies, all the vegans and veggies I know all get frequently told they look way younger than their biological age. I do personally think it really does make a difference.

Small correction to my post above, I should have said "in areas where soil lacks sufficient cobalt to allow them to make b12"

But who’s shoving their views now? You were making incorrect assumptions and people have been correcting you.

There is no medical condition that requires you to eat meat. Sorry you didnt know how to eat a balanced diet as a vegan. No shame, plenty of meat eaters don’t know how to eat a balanced diet that’s why the hospitals are full with patients suffering number one killer - heart disease.

Hello!
For breakfast I usually have oats or granola with almond milk, or brown toast with marmite or baked beans if I have time.
For lunch usually a vegetable soup (sometimes shop sometimes home made) with some tinned beans added for bulk and protein. Or a wrap with falafel, salad and hummus. Yesterday I had cold pasta leftovers mixed with roasted veggies and pesto.
Often I have a coconut or soya latte and an “accidentally vegan” snack like some Oreos or Soreen malt loaf. I like nuts and an apple as a snack too.
For dinners we have recently had a sweet potato chickpea spicy stew with spinach, a mushroom risotto, pad thai (with tofu instead of egg), lentil cottage pie.

If you want to be pedantic about it, yes, ruminants are given cobalt, a necessary supplement for areas where b12 is not present in soil in sufficient quantities, to enable them to make b12. Just read an online figure that around 73% of ruminants are given cobalt (in order to create b12) due to soil deficiencies. So in aroundabout way, the majority of ruminants receive a supplement to enable them to create B12.

I did not refer to game animals, but in commercial poultry farming, B12 is routinely added to chicken feed as part of a vitamin and mineral premix to ensure they meet their nutritional requirements.

Secondly - I did not make the "all female mammals" statement. Please direct that to the correct poster.

You love an elephant but you don't love a cow. Yeah, the elephant is cleverer than the cow, but we specifically bred the cow to be our slave.

I like cows just fine. It doesn't preclude me eating them, that's all.

All this propaganda about how bad it is for farm animals, is mostly just that. I live surrounded by sheep and beef cattle. They have perfectly nice, peaceful lives, and at some point a quick end.

The dog in question would be pts

Yes I’ll continue to eat my meat thanks as I know where it’s came from and wasn’t the supermarket.

I have to as being a vegan would make me ill as I’ve done the vegan diet and was told by my GP to stop as it was making me ill as in really ill, but you shove your views down my throat thanks.

If a dog killed a cat plenty of people would call it a dog out of control and vicious. You know it.

@Sevenwondersofthewoo It has been mandatory for a vet to be present in slaughterhouses since 1995 so that’s not changed since footage was filmed. Some vets have harrowing tales of what they have witnessed in slaughterhouses, it’s heartbreaking. But yeah you keep trying to justify the killing of innocent animals for your meal / sandwich.

humanely just like we’ve done for years quickly @Pinkbonbon

I’m not bothered by other people’s food choices. However, what I am bothered by is a family member, who upon becoming vegan, made this the absolute centre of their personality. The rest of us get told we are animal killers (in those words) and lectured over and over every time this person is present.

So I personally don’t want to hear anything about veganism as a direct result.

And? How do you kill something humanely?

People have gone onto these places and found that 1 in 3 cows arent even stunned correctly before being killed.

And the problem for many animals is the environment before the slaughterhouse.
And we're not talking about family farms here.

And how do we justify getting dairy cows pregnant over and over again until they are spent, then sending them to the slaughterhouse?

Even if killing was done right and humane, there animals suffer. 'Oh there's a vet' doesn't really mean anything.

If you want something more recent.

This guy went into a UK turkey farm this year.

Go back and watch the time line it’s dated from 2010 to 2016

a vet is present at slaughter houses now it’s a bloody boring job but they are there daily over seeing it all.

@Sevenwondersofthewoo This was made into a documentary film since which hundreds of hours of further footage have been made. Which practice are you referring to that has changed?

I'm sorry, but you are wrong.

I'm sure there are plenty of nice little farms with 'high standards' but, as pointed out by the poster above, 'land of hope and glory' is brittish farms. There are still activists reporting back similar do don't believe the 'changes'.

The red tractor approved shit means nothing too as they WARN the farms before they visit. And I could be wrong on this but, I think that's the one ran by a farmers association...would you ask a wolf to inspect how nice other wolves were to the sheep they'd corner? Of course they'll say 'things have inproved'.

Also, we don't only consume meat and dairy from britain in Britain. Lots of it is shipped in from other places.

Uk is awful for welfare. Of course they don't want us to know.