Reasonable professional behaviour-Internal examination

Sunnywithchanceofshowers · 2025-01-07T20:40:55+00:00

Today i had a gynae appointment with an internal examination. The trainee decided to answer her bleep with her fingers still inside me. I’m not keen to ask my friends this so I’m asking all of you! I am quite surprised she thought this was ok and trying to decide whether to give some feedback to the department. If i do, i would prefer to do it in a constructive way. The rest of the appointment wasn’t good either as she clearly hadn’t read my notes, but i suppose i did get the information i needed in the end.

MellersSmellers · 08/01/2025 20:39

Can't say I'd have been comfortable with that one either! Yes, do give feedback - she's a trainee after all so being sensitive to the patient when they're in a vulnerable situation is an important part of her learning

Oops, I see I was late to the party. Good that you did it

Original poster

Sunnywithchanceofshowers · 08/01/2025 20:29

To update- I phoned patient liaison to ask their advice. My main objective being that the doctor reflects on her practice. They were horrified and will take it forward.
The bleep was not an emergency- the conversation was a nice back and forward chat. Hi, no I’m in clinic at the moment, I’ll phone you later. Etc

As someone else has said it would have taken seconds to remove her hand or preferably give the bleep to the nurse to answer and reply.

Thanks for all your replies, they did really help me.

OP posts:

Zov · 08/01/2025 17:17

Deleted.

CBA.

.

5431go · 08/01/2025 17:11

LoremIpsumCici · 08/01/2025 13:01

Complaints like the one OP is contemplating is one of the primary reasons doctors are leaving the NHS. It’s like everyone is only thinking of themselves and not all the other patients that need them, and refuse to understand that yes sometimes another patient is higher priority than you. OP only suffered a little frisson of discomfort and annoyance, and she’s going to complain? When we have over 250 avoidable deaths in U.K. hospitals every week due to staff shortages? Come on. Have a look at the big picture.

Edited

Agree! We need to focus on the bigger picture. Not ideal. Feed it back. But ultimately you don’t know what was on the other end of that pager!

Brefugee · 08/01/2025 14:10

LoremIpsumCici · 08/01/2025 13:01

Complaints like the one OP is contemplating is one of the primary reasons doctors are leaving the NHS. It’s like everyone is only thinking of themselves and not all the other patients that need them, and refuse to understand that yes sometimes another patient is higher priority than you. OP only suffered a little frisson of discomfort and annoyance, and she’s going to complain? When we have over 250 avoidable deaths in U.K. hospitals every week due to staff shortages? Come on. Have a look at the big picture.

Edited

seriously? nobody is going to die because a doctor took the 2 seconds it needs to get her hand out of her vagina.

No wonder complaints are high when HCPs treat patients with no respect. (see, it goes both ways)

LoremIpsumCici · 08/01/2025 13:52

Comtesse · 08/01/2025 13:46

@LoremIpsumCici you dropped this chérie:

Merci beaucoup pour la miette de gâteau

WhydontyouMove · 08/01/2025 13:47

Sounds like you’ve never had a full internal examination because what I said isn’t stupid.

Ok. Educate me. How long does it take to remove your fingers from someone’s vagina?

Comtesse · 08/01/2025 13:46

@LoremIpsumCici you dropped this chérie:

LoremIpsumCici · 08/01/2025 13:44

WhydontyouMove · 08/01/2025 13:39

And taking her hand out and then re-inserting might have meant starting her exam all over again to be thorough, causing more delay for her to get to her next patient or the emergency and more distress for OP to go through half an exam and then have the exam restarted

What a stupid thing to say. It takes seconds to remove your fingers from someone’s vagina.

Sounds like you’ve never had a full internal examination because what I said isn’t stupid.

LoremIpsumCici · 08/01/2025 13:43

Comtesse · 08/01/2025 13:37

Yes and I am entitled to dignity during an intimate examination as are you and OP and everyone else…..

Oui, Comtesse, the preservation of your noble dignity is far more important than responding to an emergency bleep that could cost the life of a mere paysanne.
🫡

WhydontyouMove · 08/01/2025 13:39

And taking her hand out and then re-inserting might have meant starting her exam all over again to be thorough, causing more delay for her to get to her next patient or the emergency and more distress for OP to go through half an exam and then have the exam restarted

What a stupid thing to say. It takes seconds to remove your fingers from someone’s vagina.

Comtesse · 08/01/2025 13:37

Yes and I am entitled to dignity during an intimate examination as are you and OP and everyone else…..

LoremIpsumCici · 08/01/2025 13:34

Comtesse · 08/01/2025 13:22

That is the biggest load of crap I have read for a while. “Be grateful whatever crumbs the NHS gives you, don’t be so entitled”. Hell no!

Show quote history

Speaking of the entitled, we have a real live French countess on here. Of course milady the Comtesse du Délicat would complain. 🥹

Comtesse · 08/01/2025 13:22

LoremIpsumCici · 08/01/2025 12:56

I wouldn’t mind and I think it’s a bit preciously entitled to demand that a potential emergency be ignored because you’re in the middle of a follow up gyne exam.

What if it’s a maternity patient that has just had an ectopic pregnancy rupture and could die of it if that OB/GYN examining you in a post treatment follow up didn’t answer their work pager?

They don’t use these ones for gossip and social media…these are used for clinical priorities.

And taking her hand out and then re-inserting might have meant starting her exam all over again to be thorough, causing more delay for her to get to her next patient or the emergency and more distress for OP to go through half an exam and then have the exam restarted.

Consider the fact that the NHS isn’t exactly overflowing with extra doctors that handle everything at once. A doctor wrote a clear Op/Ed about how hospital directors are being forced to leave patients to die in corridors because Labour is prioritising ring fencing beds so that elective surgeries can go forward to get the wait list down.

Complaining is just a way to flex your privilege imho, we are not customers or clients of doctors, we are patients and for good reason, people would die if they had to adhere to standards of politeness like dedicating 100% of attention to you just because they are examining a certain orifice when a possible emergency bleep goes off.

Edited

That is the biggest load of crap I have read for a while. “Be grateful whatever crumbs the NHS gives you, don’t be so entitled”. Hell no!

LoremIpsumCici · 08/01/2025 13:14

Because of what happened to me in my early 50s, (and the appalling treatment by the nurse,) I never went for another cervical smear. I could end up getting cervical cancer and dying because of this.

@Zov, for your own future health & self, and if you haven’t given it a go, I would highly recommend trauma therapy focussed on what was done to you. As a survivor of CSA, trauma therapy helped me reduce the distress from panic attacks to profuse sweating and shaking which is manageable so I have been able to have the smear tests since 2015. Please don’t let what you suffered cast a shadow over your life. You can conquer it.

LoremIpsumCici · 08/01/2025 13:01

Complaints like the one OP is contemplating is one of the primary reasons doctors are leaving the NHS. It’s like everyone is only thinking of themselves and not all the other patients that need them, and refuse to understand that yes sometimes another patient is higher priority than you. OP only suffered a little frisson of discomfort and annoyance, and she’s going to complain? When we have over 250 avoidable deaths in U.K. hospitals every week due to staff shortages? Come on. Have a look at the big picture.

LoremIpsumCici · 08/01/2025 12:56

I wouldn’t mind and I think it’s a bit preciously entitled to demand that a potential emergency be ignored because you’re in the middle of a follow up gyne exam.

What if it’s a maternity patient that has just had an ectopic pregnancy rupture and could die of it if that OB/GYN examining you in a post treatment follow up didn’t answer their work pager?

They don’t use these ones for gossip and social media…these are used for clinical priorities.

And taking her hand out and then re-inserting might have meant starting her exam all over again to be thorough, causing more delay for her to get to her next patient or the emergency and more distress for OP to go through half an exam and then have the exam restarted.

Consider the fact that the NHS isn’t exactly overflowing with extra doctors that handle everything at once. A doctor wrote a clear Op/Ed about how hospital directors are being forced to leave patients to die in corridors because Labour is prioritising ring fencing beds so that elective surgeries can go forward to get the wait list down.

Complaining is just a way to flex your privilege imho, we are not customers or clients of doctors, we are patients and for good reason, people would die if they had to adhere to standards of politeness like dedicating 100% of attention to you just because they are examining a certain orifice when a possible emergency bleep goes off.

Brefugee · 08/01/2025 12:43

Maddy70 · 08/01/2025 11:28

Silencing a pager or checking if it's an emergency isn't ideal but totally understandable

not with your hand up somebody's vagina. The very least i would expect is "excuse me" to patient then, to the nurse/chaperone who was there "could you handle the pager please"

And if there was no option but to take it yourself? get your hand out of the patient and have some fucking respect.

Brefugee · 08/01/2025 12:41

oh come off it @HoppingPavlova

nobody is saying that surgery with a fully unconscious patient has to be like a library. We are not children so pack it in with the complete derail and minimisation of what has been (at least for some posters) a very distressing experience.

I hope that if you are a HCP it is only for patients who are unconscious, your bedside manner is appalling.

As i said: when you are treating a conscious patient - ESPECIALLY if you are fumbling around in their nether regions - have some respect. Or face the consequences of complaints.

Maddy70 · 08/01/2025 11:28

Silencing a pager or checking if it's an emergency isn't ideal but totally understandable

Zov · 08/01/2025 11:09

Also, minimising the traumatic experiences that some WOMEN have gone through, shitting all over it, and claiming we 'don't know what we're on about' with ridiculous and offensive whatabouttery is an actual fucking disgrace.

Zov · 08/01/2025 11:04

lateatwork · 08/01/2025 10:31

I think it's warranted to say something.

If the pager means 'emergency' then stopping the procedure to respond is fine imho. But halting mid flow to assess and respond (leaving hand inside) is not.

I'd differentiate my response between the situation with a conscious and unconscious patient.... I think most would?

Anyone with a grain of common sense can see the OP's situation (and the one I mentioned,) and a surgeon performing an operation/procedure are not remotely the same. Utterly ridiculous comparison. 🙄

Zov · 08/01/2025 11:02

WhydontyouMove · 08/01/2025 10:48

This would have really upset me.

It would have upset pretty much any woman. Utterly disgraceful behaviour!

Zov · 08/01/2025 10:59

Comtesse · 08/01/2025 10:54

That’s lovely but it’s not OP’s situation. What happened to her is gross (I would have complained on the spot).

This is just whataboutery from you - those clever clever doctors who can do more than one thing at once. Still need to think about how the conscious patient might feel, no?

Show quote history

👏

Comtesse · 08/01/2025 10:54

HoppingPavlova · 08/01/2025 10:39

@Zov Someone having 'surgery,' and having the surgeon chat to other people about the procedure, (whilst doing it,) is nothing like the experiences of the OP (and the one I posted about.) Not even a remotely similar comparison!
I doubt very much that they pop out and make calls, or go off to chat to a colleague about something halfway through cutting into the patient either!
Seriously HoppingPavlova! Utterly daft, and patronising response! Maybe YOU should not post about stuff you don't know about

Not the one being daft or talking about stuff I know nothing of. Worked in tertiary hospitals for decades. In certain cases surgeons most definitely pop into another theatre for emergency assistance etc. Not uncommon. They either stabilise or the next level there can take over for a bit, but not always. Patient is never left alone ‘half way through being cut open’, there will be people there but you can pack as appropriate, attend to something more urgent, and come back. For prolonged neuro sessions, they often pop out for a (protein)bar, skull a coffee, toilet, every few hours while the patient is ‘cut open’ on the table. Anaesthesia is always there though, they will swap over as necessary.

As for talking about the operation to those there. Not what I was talking about. I’m talking about surgery while answering questions from other theatres with the team (supervisors don’t need to be in theatre with them at all levels), questions from team in clinics wanting confirmation/approval on patients/treatments there etc, giving other areas info on patients they are treating that has cross over etc. All of this multi-tasking is standard. No idea why you think it isn’t or why any of this is daft, and r why after working in this space for decades I shouldn’t post about it? But sure, 100% attention only on every patient in front, no safe pivoting for emergencies, no playlists and singing along, and no multi-asking as that’s never done. As I said, it’s just that you don’t know about any of that, but let’s go with it doesn’t happen if it helps you.

That’s lovely but it’s not OP’s situation. What happened to her is gross (I would have complained on the spot).

This is just whataboutery from you - those clever clever doctors who can do more than one thing at once. Still need to think about how the conscious patient might feel, no?