To be horrified at how much worse the "grooming gangs" actually were than I thought

The man is either completely useless (quite possible) and presided over a monumental failure and just says "but there's nothing to be done about the industrial rapes of our little girls". or he's just not taking responsibility for the mess. Again, quite possible. He's not one to hold his hands up when he's messed up let's face it.

I think it's in extremely bad fath to suggest that racial tensions were the only reason that the police didn't take these crimes as seriously as they should..

It's because this is the specific issue people are talking about today.

You didn't have the Epstein prince Andrew threads with cries of but look at x yz.

It's quite glaringly obvious it's a men problem.

But these men are allegedly told by their religion that anyone who isn't Muslim is lesser and inferior.

It seems that within the religion itself,like most, patriarchs and women are inferior
So non Muslim girls are even further down the scale.

How on earth can we tackle that mindset if the allegiance and life rules coupled with a lack of education are ruled by a religion?

Everyone called them slappers.

Let me try again.

What could or should KS as DPP have done differently?

In so far as these cases got as far as the CPS and they declined to prosecute were the extant guidelines followed?

We know those guidelines were re-written so as to move towards a culture of belief rather than doubting the credibility of victims and that was done during KS's time.

And that's a good example.. about culture and religion. I am Irish and I do know that the "religious aspect" is sometimes much more a cultural thing than it is actually about the religion..
Irish Catholicism can often be a cultural identity more than it is a belief or faith of Christianity.
I'm agnostic but I'm still culturally Irish Catholic. I haven't attended mass since my early twenties but I'd be considered Catholic by Irish protestants.

Doubtless many of these men committing these crimes considered themselves Muslim when they will have barely understood what Islam was, it's just a cultural identity.
So no it's not really about Islam.
But yes cultural factors are important..
But they still aren't the reason.
A predatory man will find any reason.
But yes the cultural factors surrounding why they managed to commit the crime and get away with it for so long are important.

But that also applies to being white British. We also need to be looking at the cultural factors in our own society that allowed some people to turn a blind eye to what was occurring here.
And they did!! And it wasn't because no one reported it or no papers reported it.. there was a certain attitude towards working class and vulnerable teenage girls

I wish I could say I was surprised at some of the responses on here but I am not. It will take time to chip away at the solid walls of denial that are in place to protect from weaponised accusations of racism/Islamophobia/bigotry.

One thing I would say though is that claiming that talking about the cultural elements behind these matters is "fodder for the Far Right" is absolutely no different from the senior police officers/council members who down played this decades ago for fear of Race Riots were it to emerge that thousand of young girls were being raped & abused by Pakistani/Muslim gangs. Shameful that women on a site for women would still offer these justifications which we know have historically failed the girl children attacked and prioritises the cultural beliefs & rights of the men involved, over the agony of the girls.

Facts. I'm afraid.

White British culture has a massive problem with misogyny and with only believing 'perfect' victims. No arguments from me there.

But in the case of the subject of this thread, culture was a massive factor both in the behaviour of the abusers and the way that public agencies chose to let them carry on with the abuse. It was, police and local government officers have gone on record saying as much. We need to be able to talk about that openly without being called racists or being whatabouted. Pakistani Muslim men commited these crimes and the police and local government looked the other way on purpose to stop 'communities' kicking off. We have to be able to say that is what happened, in order to stop it happening.

And the head of the CPS who did not prosecute the grooming gangs is currently sitting in Number 10 in his designer glasses and Labour are refusing a national enquiry in order to protect him.

What arrant, spiteful, ignorant nonsense.

Just for clarity here...we are still talking about the rape and torture of little girls?

Why were independent investigators not drafted in? So much could have been done at the time that wasn't & still isn't...

On another thread someone tried to say "it happened years ago and the perpetrators have been prosecuted so we should leave it in the past for race relations" or words to effect.

Fucking crazy do these people seriously think it's not still going on? Not to mention it's the same people who think that way that are obsessed with teaching school kids about all the bad things white people did to black people centuries ago. But apparently we should leave something that's still happening right now in the past???

Google the Barbary slave trade if you want to find out something new btw.

Sweden has changed its asylum and migration laws quite radically. I think it is something the UK should consider doing. Along with making it very hard to get a UK passport.

Yes. Slight stable-door-after-horse-has-bolted feel but at least they have acted.

Sweden has changed its asylum and migration laws quite radically. I think it is something the UK should consider doing. Along with making it very hard to get a UK passport.

I would favour publication of these statistics on crime and ethnicity. Otherwise we look like we can’t face issues; and btw the Tory Party know exactly what these stats would say. They sat on them too.

Reform will clean up unless we can talk about this openly.

By making this solely a Muslim issue you’re overlooking the majority. ALL these men need stopping, Muslim or not.

We are currently discussing a particular issue where the religious/ethnic background of a particular community IS a factor though. In fact doubly so, as it firstly allowed a mindset to flourish that thought of these poor girls as worthless, and secondly meant that police, social services etc were far too hesitent in dealing properly with the issue (and that's probably a massive understatement).

So in this case, it makes sense to keep the perpetrators' backgrounds in focus.

Yes but we need to make sure we aren't just focusing on the culture and allowing that to become the 'reason'
This is a problem within white British culture too. Male predatory violence is a big issue. We don't want this to become "foreigners abuse our girls and we need to stop them!" This is an issue of male violence and that is massively being swept under the rug all the time here!!
It's like people will do any gymnastics not to have to deal with the misogyny prevalent in our own culture. We shouldn't facilitate that by allowing them to focus on this as an issue of some other culture. It's not.
There were cultural factors at play in some cases.. but these are far from the only cases. The bigger picture needs to be looked at at the same time.
It makes me extremely edgey when I see people solely getting angry about the police response due to cultural factors..
It's as though they just don't care about how these girls were viewed by US by our police force, by society.. this was to me the largest factor in these crimes not properly being investigated at the time.
And as I've said you still see this attitude prevalent.. thats scary.

If you're going to publish data on anything you really need to be sure your data is reliable. I assume ethnicity relies on self identification and is probably not mandatory.

Yes obviously all rapes should be prosecuted. I don't understand your argument. Are you saying that we should ignore the common religion, ethnicity and culture of these paedophile rapist gangs? And the religion and ethnicity of their victims?

It is very difficult to have a sensible discussion with some posters on here it’s laughable also so very sad.

This is misinformation.

The annual Europol TE-SAT Report usually has right wing extremism accounting for about 3% of terror threats. The UK data is no longer included in the report since we left the EU but the trend remains pretty consistent.

Here's the edited highlights with a link to the most recent full report:

https://www.europol.europa.eu/media-press/newsroom/news/new-report-terrorists-exploiting-global-tensions

It's true, but the PP said that it was 'never' women and that isn't true at all.

Fewer than 3% of all rape/child abuse/sexual assault crimes result in charges. Three percent. That’s not because they’re scared of upsetting a particular community, it’s because they’re men, and the victims are only women and children. The vast majority of perpetrators are white men.

I could understand people being so focused on ethnicity if 79% of rapes/assaults by all men resulted in charges (in line with other crimes) but they’re not. By making this solely a Muslim issue you’re overlooking the majority. ALL these men need stopping, Muslim or not.

I'm sure it does. But if I was one of the hundreds of thousands of white non Muslim girls raped because I was considered dirty due to being non Muslim I'd want to know why.

And not all the victims were in care..actually a lot of them had parents who loved and cared for them, hard as this may be to believe as they are poor and white working class so therefore must be assumed to be completely dysfunctional.