DS wants to charge

If my son was an electrician, I would expect him to do my rewiring etc for free, yes. Family members look after each other. On the other hand, if he needed the money and I could afford it I would insist on paying him. I don't think you can insist on him playing for free if the offer is not there from his end, no.

@pineapplesundae Please Read The Full Thread. His parents subsidise everything he does including studies and he has NEVER ONCE got his parents a Christmas present or a Birthday present.

He probably needs the money, pay him.

I'm not a musician, but I did have to take a number of quite tricky exams to qualify for my own job, since when I absolutely have offered and done free professional work for friends and relatives, and I absolutely have benefited from friends and relatives offering to do free professional work for me. Isn't that just being nice?

I agree to an extent however there are many students starting out who are nowhere near close to being at the level of supporting known artists or even being paid for performing.

I agree. Throughout his career he will have people begging favours off him under the guise of getting him 'exposure' when it's actually free labour. Support him in this, as if he has any chance of making it a career he will need people who value his work and are prepared to pay him accordingly.

But I don't believe for one second that anyone with a child would not be hurt by being treated like a stranger / paying customer by them.

I absolutely wouldn’t be hurt by this. I’d want to pay my child in these circumstances. I’d want to support them.

I don’t understand your thinking around this at all. He’s still only a student.

When you are studying music performance you start your career as soon as you begin your course. It’s not like other subjects.

My son is currently playing alongside musicians who work on west end shows. He & his fellow students have supported a well known chart artist. It’s his career.

It's not his career, he's a student!

All 3 of mine were qualified sports coaches before they went to university and all of them coached both during the term time and in the holidays over those 3/4 years. Didn't make it their careers though...

I agree much depends on the tone of the discussion. It would never occur to me not to insist on paying my son in these circumstances. I'm also certain my son would protest. Then I would insist - and win!

But I still can't get my mind round the idea of an adult who has never bought his parents a present. And why his parents have allowed him to get away with it all his life.

"But I don't believe for one second that anyone with a child would not be hurt by being treated like a stranger / paying customer by them."

I get what you mean but I can envisage NOT being hurt by something like this. It depends on how the message was delivered and the relationship between the two.

If he'd smiled and said something like, I know you are my parents but this is also my career, then I wouldn't be upset. But I also would WANT to pay my child in that situation. I'd be happy to be giving them an opportunity to perform if they wanted that. I don't really understand why you didn't feel the same. (I do understand your upset about the lack of presents and tendency to "take".)

If he was a 'one man band', then I'd expect him to do it for free. But it's a funny dynamic when his band members are there and getting paid.
That said, he still shouldn't insist on payment.
YANBU.
Can I just ask out of interest, do you still contribute financially to his life? Pay fees, digs, or whatever?
This would have a massive impact on how I feel about it.

My husband is in a trade and he absolutely does work for both his parents and mine for free - I’d be so embarrassed if he tried to charge them for his time! (They pay for materials, as is only fair).

In return, they help with childcare and would be mortified if we tried to pay them for that. Immediate family help each other out in whatever way they can - it’s just what you do!

Sounds about right.

Threads are full of the most judgmental, rude and extreme comments all the time. People are so weird.

But I don't believe for one second that anyone with a child would not be hurt by being treated like a stranger / paying customer by them.

My DD has her own side gig and when I want something I pay for it - she might turn it around quicker because it’s for me and we’re in the same house but the product still gets bought 🤷🏻‍♀️ I see nothing wrong with it, she’s put skills and material into it.

Having children is not a purchase that you get refund for.
You don’t care for them and meet their needs and put them through school so you can be reimbursed. It’s just called parenting.
Also why are you making this a personal attack on me? I don’t know you, yet all because I believe someone should get something for they I deserved to be attacked.
You seem pretty selfish and triggered by the idea this young person can be paid for something.
Maybe you should take a look at yourself if you feel it’s appropriate to be little someone especially after you go on a racist and agiest rant about British people’s

An still an adult who won't even do this for his own parents. He's a dickhead.

He's a student.

Helping to facilitate education is part of the responsibility of being a parent. Even when they are over 18. The whole grant/student loan thing is set up that way.

He takes from OP as an adult male in the form of free accommodation, education support, cash and gifts.

As he is an adult he isn’t entitled to any of those things, they are within OP’s gift.

If he can’t gift OP a free gig then he shouldn’t expect gifts himself.

You said that he is only taking, not giving anything back.

It's not like he's expecting to be paid in order to attend the party - he's expecting to be paid in the same way as his bandmates, for services being provided. In what way can that be defined as 'only taking, not giving back'?

Actually OP, I think you could/should have the whole thing out with him, including the lack of reciprocity re. presents. You can make your point, forcibly if necessary, but of course try to stay calm. Being honest is much better imo than passive aggression or you stewing on it. Give him something to think about. He may be miffed or even fall out with you for a while as a result, but that’s on him, let him be a grown up and deal with it. Meanwhile pay a professional band so you don’t have resentments or drama on your birthday.

Even though I think it's cheeky, I would pay to support him and brush it off. You are understandably upset.

How is he giving back to OP by making her pay for his services?

I agree that up to a point joiner’s work is there to be inspected by others later, but a joiner also has time to fix any snagging matters that might occur before signing it off as complete. I don’t think that is quite the same as performing live.

And yes, I also agree that he should have figured out the gift giving thing, but clearly he hasn’t. How hard would it have been after the first missed occasion for the OP prompt the next time by asking what her son was getting for his Dad, or the Dad to ask what he was getting for the OP. Just dwelling on it getting more and more frustrated was unlikely to lead to the outcome she wanted.

Hopefully however it pans out the birthday is memorable for the right reasons and the OP has an amazing time :)