Doesn’t ever work out with the OW

The old "creates a vacancy' trope 😎

Always overlooks the various reasons that people have affairs.

Tell me you know nothing, without telling me you know nothing.

This has been gone over so many times that it's surprising anyone is still using it

Well no, because then there is a new vacancy for the OW.

One of the saddest things I heard/saw was at the funeral of the DF

Both first and second families were there - all the children. However, hearing the second family loudly and openly say in front of his first 4 DCs with whom he had been with their mother for 22 years when he left - that at least he had found true happiness and love in the end to make up for all the sadness from his first marriage.

one of the nastiest bitchiest and deliberately hurtful things he was said. To think that your DF wished you had never been born and regretted your existence is so damaging. All those happy memories you had with your DF get questioned and damage you.

There are no winners in the OW and OM saga - someone usually unsuspecting gets hurt and that hurt last a lifetime.

Well I don't entirely disagree with you. My husband already had a 6yo when I met him and we agreed on 2, however, both of us realised during pregnancy that 1 would be better and we are very happy with that choice.

When I felt unhappy because I was losing my identity a little bit to "Mum", I joined an amateur dramatics group and my husband makes sure that works for me by taking on more childcare and housework in the run up to a show. When he felt like he was finding it hard to make new friends when we moved house, he joined a local pool team and now goes out every Wednesday whilst I hold the fort.

We involved each other in discussions about how to fix it and have helped each other, but we didn't just sit and wait for the other to fix it, often without even voicing the problem, and then go off and find an affair partner when they didn't.

By plodding along I meant realising that married family life isn't going to be a rom com and there will be times when you look round and think "where did my life go". The difference is that mostly women accept this is a temporary state and embrace it and often some men, if offered the tiniest glimmer of their old life will jump at it..it's a viable option in the way it just isn't for many women. With communication and effort on both sides, the family and the marriage could be preserved in many circumstances. I think weathering storms together is a pretty good example actually. If however the adults can't get along, are sniping and snarling all the time then yes, break up, but how many times do we read on here that someone was left for ow and had no idea the husband was unhappy..and despite some posters' protestations that absolutely is possible. Anyway, not really the point of this thread but I just mean that whilst it may well be that affairs become long standing successful relationships, they should not come at the cost of breaking up a young child's family in the scenario described above.

But the kids are still there, needing to be raised. And it's almost always the man who leaves and the woman who keeps "plodding along", doing the daily slog of childrearing solo. That's not much of an example to set them: that men check out if life's not as exciting as it used to be, and it's down to women to pick up the pieces and shoulder the responsibility.

That thread is in general health and no most of us were not in agreement. We can only make choices for ourselves not for others in the guise of let him play with himself was the general concensus.

I personally think a lot of issues start with communication problems, not of course in all cases, as Alexandre Dumas said “All generalizations are dangerous, even this one. Even so trying to soldier on through unhappier times isn't helpful because it doesn't solve anything or alert the partner to an issue. This is on both sides, not just one.

In my case a feature of my early relationships were being physically not present because I worked away a lot for weeks and months. I know men show their affection through physical ways and had I been more thoughtful I could have offered solutions of meeting up etc. I didn't I just relied on him telling me he was unhappy but he didn't so it was on both of us not really having that conversation until it was too late.

More children need to be agreed by both partners, but if the couple has previously agreed on 3 and then one party is "unhappy" after one, because they were expecting a baby to be born and nothing to change for them, then I can understand the other party not feeling happy about that

Reality seldom lives up to fantasy. If your marriage is struggling after one child, having two more isn't likely to improve things.

How many threads do you see on Mumsnet that are some variation of this?:

"Am I crazy to try for a third at 47? I just don't feel like my family is complete at 2"

The partner/spouse is rarely mentioned nor is what they want even part of the discussion. So while cheating is never justified, you can hardly feign surprise that someone isn't willing to sleepwalk thru decades of their life hoping that someday, in the distant future, things might improve.

I didn't see that thread. Did other people think it was fine? It is definitely not fine! Obviously you need to make time for your partner. However, I know some women who get next to no support and intimacy from their husbands and are doing everything, including his laundry and working on top of that, and then he tries to initiate sex after acting like a helpless baby all day and allowing her to grind herself into the ground keeping everything afloat, and she's obviously not feeling sexy. That's not a "her" issue, that's a "him" issue.

Sometimes, life isn't always about someone else making you happy and you have to make your own happiness. Some people were never taught this and if the person they've delegated the work to can no longer do it, they find someone else to do it for them.

More children need to be agreed by both partners, but if the couple has previously agreed on 3 and then one party is "unhappy" after one, because they were expecting a baby to be born and nothing to change for them, then I can understand the other party not feeling happy about that.

Yes. Mine is still with his OW 20 years and 2 kids later.

I thought we were happy but clearly he wasn’t. I think I just had rose tinted glasses on.

Agreed. Like the OP on the thread today who stopped having sex 5 years ago in lockdown and expected her DH at the age of 37 to be fine with this, refused to have any conversation on it, and also stated he couldn’t masturbate as she wasn’t comfortable with it.

How can people think this is fine?

So many men seem to leave ALL the emotional labour to their partner and if she stops making the romance because she's also carrying most of the domestic labour, it just dies. Then they complain that their wife no longer cares about them because she's busy cooking and cleaning for all the kids you wanted and doesn't have time to do the cute little things she did when you got together

There's truth in this. However, I've known many women who go into marriage with a very fixed idea about wanting say 3 kids (whatever the number) and by God that's what they are going to have regardless of the fact that the marriage is strained and they suspect their husband isn't happy. They ignore all the obvious signs and just figure their partner can suck it up for the next decade or so and then they'll have time for each other (and the marriage).

As a society we tend to romanticize having babies/small children and downplay how it can impact a marriage. And sorry, but few people want to "suck it up" and trudge along for a decade or more in a relationship that is little more than roommates arguing about kids and housework and a sex life that's barely on life support.

So do something about it other than stick it in someone else.

If you're tired and stressed because parenting is exhausting then you just need to deal with it. Running off with a younger model and leaving the other parent to be twice as tired and stressed on their own isn't an acceptable reaction to finding parenting hard.

If you're bored and the spark is gone because all the focus is on the kids, then take responsibility for putting it back in. Take up a hobby together and book a babysitter, or organise alternating nights so you can both find different hobbies that make you feel good. Organise a romantic surprise for when the kids are in bed. Make the effort.

So many men seem to leave ALL the emotional labour to their partner and if she stops making the romance because she's also carrying most of the domestic labour, it just dies. Then they complain that their wife no longer cares about them because she's busy cooking and cleaning for all the kids you wanted and doesn't have time to do the cute little things she did when you got together.

Nobody, including the kids, are happy in a "stay together for the kids sake" scenario.

I'm not talking about being miserable...I'm talking about accepting that when you choose to make a family you commit to a situation and look for ways to improve things if you're bored. In so many of the scenarios as I outlined above the cheating spouse wasn't miserable, just preoccupied. In those scenarios the right thing to is to focus your energy on the marriage and improve it. If you're going to loaf about being miserable and angry then yes, absolutely leave but it's the wrong thing to prioritise your "soulmate" over your small children.

I'm NOT talking about genuinely miserable, angry, abusive situations, just plodding along that for many, often men, just isn't enough.

but that's not a life! And what a terrible example to set for the kids.
There's more to life than being miserable like that.

Yet growing up in a situation where one parent has checked out or is unhappy makes for a deeply unhappy childhood. Kids pick up on away more of what is going on in a household than many adults realise.

Totally agree.

I know of someone like that too! The OW couldn't even go to the funeral because none of his family and friends would have known who she was. Horrendous. But I guess she just accepted that as part of the deal. Apparently she was never that fussed about him leaving, their long term arrangement worked fine as it was and she was happy with that.

Friend's wife left him a note saying she was running off with affair partner, emptying their bank account and taking all the jewelry. She got to the rendezvous but he didn't show up. He decided to stay with his wife
Mad dash home but got there too late. However he forgave her on condition she resigned her job and agreed to move
They are still together . So I guess we'll never know if it could have worked with her affair partner

I totally agree with this. The shine wears off and the everyday life and no longer being the focus is a huge factor, IMO. I remember my ex saying about the r/ship he was in (two before me), "everything was fine until a kid came along". I BET it was! You were the sole focus, and I think some people just can't handle it when they're not any longer, p!ss off for someone else, and then when the drudgery begins in that life, they're either off again or think "well, I can't leave...what does that say about the person I am" and fear being judged by society.

Sadly my ex didn't make this disclosure at the start - if he had, I would have ended things then because it says a lot about him and the sort of people who behave this way.

I feel I must add to this thread that just because things appear to be working out and they're still together, it doesn't mean they're happy. You're not in their life and so one or both may still be cheating but the other partner either doesn't know about it or ignores it all. Doesn't make for a great relationship, obviously.

That's all very well but you know what else is short ..childhood. So many affairs due to the somewhat drudgery of everyday parenting, juggling work, not much time for couples to have time alone or away together and suddenly one party "has been unhappy for years" met their "soulmate" and can only now manage 4/30 nights parenting. In these cases the marriage is not dead, just not thrilling and at one of those "for worse" times mentioned in the vows. You suck it up and give your kids a lovely childhood without shuttling between two houses, split finances, reduced opportunities for hobbies etc cos RP can't be in two places at once and all the rest of the shite that comes with divorced parents, not to mention the step family dynamics. Let's say the kids are pre school age when it gets dull ...suck it up for ten / 12 years. Give them those family holidays, Christmas' etc and focus on what you committed too. I'm NOT talking about genuinely miserable, angry, abusive situations, just plodding along that for many, often men, just isn't enough.