To think that men just actually don’t want to do that much after their OH gives birth?

Agreed @Dutchhouse14

I think if we are honest, adjusting to parenting IS hard - definitely found it so.

But hey you're the Mum they hand it back to you at the end of the day when it starts crying as I found at the hospital (and if there is any issue ever since...)

The 5% uptake statistic says it all really. 5%...

Really hope all the wonderful men who do help out manage to increase the percentage at some point.

My DH took 2 weeks annual leave , DC were born before paid paternity leave was a thing.
He was keen to get back to work and have some normality - if I'm honest and he found adjusting to parenthood hard.
I hope if DS becomes a father he does better and is more supportive, I think he will be.
Society is changing but tbh none of the new fathers in my largish workplace seem to take more than 2 weeks paternity leave.
However most threads like these are overwhelming filled with posters saying how brilliant and hands on supportive their partners are, this wasn't generally the case when my DC were born, 17-25 years ago when me and my friends overwhelmingly did the majority of the childcare and household tasks and our careers took a massive hit so it's really encouraging things are changing.
I do still think however most mothers do put their DC first and make sacrifices that fathers just aren't willing to.

My DH couldn’t take paternity leave because of the gender pay gap. We both work in the same industry and because he earns so much more than me, we couldn’t survive on my salary + his reduced paternity pay. It wasn’t a case of him not wanting to, it was a case of unequal pay forcing the decision for us.

This "having a newborn isn't hard" schtick drives me nuts.

You are totally responsible for keeping alive and nurturing a tiny new human who can't talk, is utterly helpless and needs to feed every 3 hours if lucky or every 1.5 if not. This new human doesn't care if you are exhausted or in pain or can't have a proper bowel movement without screaming. Oh and you need to love them and bond with them and talk to them and be close to them. Of course it is hard. It is the hardest most valuable thing most people (women) will do. Saying "having a newborn isn't hard" is just another way of completely devaluing and disrespecting the contribution women make.

I agree really thoughtless and unhelpful comment.

Having a newborn isn't that hard
This is a ridiculous thing to say. Maybe it wasn’t hard FOR YOU, but it’s an incredibly hard time for many, especially the first time and/or if there are problems with feeding, reflux, etc.

My BIL has been off for 3 months for pat leave and is hands on with the baby and very involved/nurturing.

I think actually having to be involved due to pat leave encourages the effort and helps to reinforce the father child relationship. So they are not just the part time person who pops in of an evening.

if you spend the early years as a visitor to family life that informs who you are as a parent

This ^. My husband absolutely did a lot to share the load when I (we) had babies. And still does now they’re teens. He also happily spent one day a week at home with our eldest between my first two maternity leaves. SPL wasn’t a thing back then but I don’t know whether we’d have taken it because I wanted maximum time at home with the baby (and he would have been ok with that, for my sake). So I don’t think the low uptake is necessarily because dads are shying away from doing their bit.

My DH had 8 weeks full pay which he took at the start. He was amazing - did pretty much everything except breastfeed, which was pretty much all I did. He then had 3 months of SPL plus annual leave at the end. It was a financial sacrifice for us and a sacrifice for me to go back at 10 months but a real investment in their relationship and in ours. We are very equal in terms of how much we do now - playing to our strengths but overall balanced.

So it really depends on the man! I think things might be different if everyone had had that time off at the beginning that he had.

Most people can't afford for the father take a long time off!
I have a close relative who DID take several months parental leave, sharing it with his wife. It had a negative effect on his career once he went back.

My dh took a month off and was an absolute godsend. He was also fantastic once he was back at work' helping with nights etc too. But his main job was supporting us all financially.

DH has always done all his fair share and when he was on paternity leave I didn't lift a finger to do anything other than feed and take care of the baby and myself.

He would have been an excellent candidate for SPL and financially we would have been fine. We didn't do it because I didn't want to go back to work any earlier than I had to and he saw maternity leave as entirely right to choose to share or not, not for him to demand a share of.

DH takes about four weeks off for each birth here.

The issue for us with SPL is that I get enhanced maternity pay, but he wouldn't be entitled to an enhanced paternity package with his company. Meaning, financially, SPL is not beneficial for us.

In his role as a Dad and a husband following birth, he is absolutely hands on. Even if I'm already awake doing the night feeds (breastfeeding), he'll wake up and make sure I have enough water or keep me and the baby company to make sure I'm not falling asleep. It's a partnership and he wants to be present. I'm grateful.

This is an excellent summary - especially point 4. Even when men are keen to help (my husband took 3 months) the raised eyebrows, snide remarks and shock was quite interesting. From female colleagues as well by the way!

My DH took 6 months SPL and had our twins from 6 months to one year. He was amazing and still is. They have the best bond with him.

The problem is that the bar for a good dad is much lower than the bar for a good mum.

My Dh isn't useless. But I found having a baby, was the first indication I had that he kind of expected that I would be the "project manager" and this came as a surprise to me. I think it was the first time I realised that we are not near to equality yet.

Before kids everything was 50/50 around the house.
After, He asked me about every aspect of baby care even though I don't think I had ever held a baby in my life before. Also now I seem to manage every boring detail pf the kids.

When he took DS for his vaccinations, the nurse said aren't you a great man for taking him to his vaccinations.

Can you even imagine the same being said towards me.

As a dad here, who was always there for the family - it's a measure of the man how he steps up ... and it really isn't JUST about that time after the birth - it's about being a good person, a good partner, a good man. My kids are all adults now, and I like to think they'll know what to look for in a partner. I had an excellent example in my own father, and I learned from him, and (largely) modelled my own parenting on him. That's how it goes.
I suppose to relate this to the thread more closely, a man who 'steps up' will always have been ready to step up. I always wanted to be a father.
Some men will find it frightening and overwhelming - and there is precious little support for those that do, tbh. Some men will shirk responsibility, or run a mile - they're not gonna be good fathers.
[Me and my ex are no longer together though - I left (kids were already adults) - but that's a different story altogether.]

My DH only had 2 weeks paternity. In my experience having a newborn was not easy and also a lot of the difficulty for me came from the sleep deprivation and postpartum recovery. I wish my DH had helped more in the first few months as I ended up trying to do everything etc but I think also partly my fault for not asking for help or communicating properly. We have came a long way since then and now things are a lot more balanced. I do see what you mean though, but I think it just depends on the person really from what I have seen with friends etc. Some men are definitely quite lazy but others run around doing everything. I saw a comment saying that men can't help or something along those lines if the woman is breastfeeding. I do not agree with this as they can do everything else in terms of caring for baby eg bathing, nappy changed etc plus general housework and things. To be honest we did look into shared parental leave but financially wouldnt have been a good move and I wanted full maternity. My DH really helped me after I started really struggling and was able to be clear in what I wished for from him in terms of helping. I would have really really struggled to manage if he hadnt stepped up and helped with cleaning and things more so I am grateful for him really.

Not from the UK so a bit differnet system. But all men I know have utilised the shared parental leave. I think the problem in the UK system is that it means women have shorter maternity leave. Where I'm from it is in addition to maternity leave so the child can stay home longer before going to daycare and can also be used later.

My DH did/does loads but we wouldn't have done SPL as I breastfed both kids and wouldn't have been able to go back to work much before I did (9/10 months).

Funnily enough, I was just thinking with regards to men I've dated over the years... including the ones that were nice enough chaps, I'd say maybe only 2 out of 10 (of those I had enough data on to theorise on) would have made good husbands AND fathers. And that's not even including the fact that many men SEEM like they would be...but then, aren't.

I just don't see why women bother tbh.
Obviously it's not like kids are just for him but, if we have kids with just anyone, what's the incentive for men to have any kind of evolution regarding how they view their role within families?

I think we should start saying no.
Certainly without marriage and having known them many years, lived with them and seen them always do their share both financially and in the home. Even then it's still an unnecessary risk tbh.

The worst one I read on here was a woman who split with the father during pregnancy and he got three months full paid and used it to go gallivanting round Dubai and Australia while she was postpartum doing it all alone

You are being unreasonable. My husband was a first class dad from the start. He also took the last month of my maternity leave so I was off for 11 months instead of 12. He would have liked more but I said no because I wanted to stay at home with my baby / children for as long as possible.

Actually more often than not I’ve heard women being more against shared leave than men. It’s very common on her for women to say they don’t want to share their leave.

In real life amount my peers I don’t know anyone who only took 2 weeks and used it to go out with their mates.

In my profession I see younger (middle class professional) men increasingly taking shared parental leave. I imagine it helps to establish more equal parenting roles early on. And starts to chip away at the idea that men can't ask for the leave or for flexible working. My dh is only 60 but he had a belief that flexible working wasn't an option for him (despite working on the same terms as female colleagues who requested it, in an organisation that would have said yes).

Haha I am most definetly the messy one of our house. My DH absolutely does the cleaning/ tiding. I also know male friends who are far more neat freaks then their wives.

Your partner's/ husbands may be shit but you don't get to generalise all men.