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AIBU?

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To wonder how this is legal and what can be done to prevent it

153 replies

Fawnly · 30/12/2024 17:26

Over the last few weeks I’ve heard 3 separate stories of young British girls, moving to the Middle East, getting married, changing religion and having children with men who are older.
One was on here and it seems it ended in abuse.

One of the others has really disturbed me, this girl started a relationship with a doctor from Qatar who was late 20s when she was 17!! As soon as she turned 18 she started getting the documents needed to move. 6 weeks after turning 18 she has moved to Qatar, married just weeks after that (had to change religion first). Then almost immediately conceived a child. Her parents (who are my friends), haven’t been able to visit as she refuses to let them. She now has 2 children, totally distant from her family etc.

Another was similar but the UAE.

AIBU to wonder how this is legal? Why are these countries letting 30 year old men marry teenagers who they have just moved 4000 miles from home!

I have teenagers and I’m beside myself at the thought of this happening to them!

How and why does this happen? How can it be prevented?

OP posts:
godmum56 · 31/12/2024 09:23

OP I am not sure what you want here? Adults have the freedom to make terrible choices!

WednesburyUnreasonable · 31/12/2024 09:17

MissScarletInTheBallroom · 31/12/2024 09:04

I think the Qatar thing is a red herring.

It would be just as legal for a British man to groom a foreign 17 year old to come to the UK and then marry him as soon as she turned 18. It might be more difficult for her to get permission to live in the UK, depending on where she was from.

Yes, it's horrible and creepy, but if someone is a legal adult they can do what they like, even if they are still a teenager.

Agreed. Qatar isn’t even a particularly soft target for these types of marriages - you have to apply Ministry of Interior to marry a foreigner and convince them of various things before they’ll approve.

I am sure it’s more shocking to the British parents when their daughter runs off to the Gulf versus to another part of the UK, and it certainly adds a layer of legal and cultural complication, but I wouldn’t say there’s a huge epidemic of these marriages. Most khaleejis will also find this particular situation odd.

parietal · 31/12/2024 09:16

The law can't stop people making bad decisions.

NautilusLionfish · 31/12/2024 09:14

BlueSilverCats · 31/12/2024 07:49

It's not necessarily minimising, but more what can actually be done about it?

While grooming is a crime, it would be incredibly hard to prove in this context. Involving authorities is pointless.

So , if the parents even know about it, it's down to them. They don't have many options though(bar locking your kid up and never letting them out of your sight) and it would be a very slippery slope to give parents carte blanche to prevent their 17/18 yos from doing things because they disagree with their choices and in the name of protection. And do we stop at 17/18? If it's grooming and an abusive situation, it can also happen at 19,20, 21. How long should it be extended for?

So what can actually be done as a practical solution (other than education, raising strong/confident children, awareness etc)? Ban all 18 yos from travelling abroad without parental consent? Raise age of consent to 18?

As an aside, this is a tale as old as time when it comes to poor/working class girls. Married young to an older bloke with a job /some stability to escape whatever they're running from. The concern for them has been pretty much inexistent.

And not only that. The implication that it has to do with one religion or region is so so false.
Was it dark and swarthy Sheikh Charles the Emir of Wales who married the 20 year old Diana when he was 32? And even beyond aristocracy and celebrity I see so many powerful older men with young women. May be this girl was groomed and of course that is terrible. But to suggest that this is so uniquely outside the possibilities of a British man's frame of actions is patently false.

NautilusLionfish · 31/12/2024 09:06

Disturbia81 · 31/12/2024 08:45

Yep the older man younger woman thing is very disturbing but we can't change another culture. I doubt many young women here would want to do it

Try going to Thailand, Cambodia, Bali, and even in many of our counties and tell me you don't see Older British men with a young woman as a wife or partner. Try looking at the celebrity couples. Then come back and tell us implying it's a ME or Qatar or Dubai culture thing. Come on!

ShrugGood · 31/12/2024 09:05

As parents we have talked to the children about relationships with people from other countries because our friend married a lovely European woman who was living in the UK and intended to stay in the UK. That was always the plan. He spoke her language but wasn't fluent like a native. Then several things occurred that meant she wanted to return and live back in her European country. Our friend did not want to live there but his choice was to stay here alone or be with his wife and children. Our own children heard those conversations from him about the devastating affect it was having on him.

They also know about films like Not Without My Daughter and that some countries will not allow children to leave with a parent depending on the country.

I think social media is to blame for showing absolutely ridiculously wealthy lifestyles. I watch Shabaz who mocks it all with his I'm rich, you're poor view but it is scary to see the wealth on display and I suppose a lot of girls in the UK would realise it would be hard to amass that sort of wealth and lifestyle here. They may not realise the implications of having children out there and what that means for women's rights if they wanted to even visit the UK with the children.

MissScarletInTheBallroom · 31/12/2024 09:04

Fawnly · 30/12/2024 17:33

He started the relationship when she was 17, then convinced her to make the move immediately after turning 18. Doesn’t that scream of abuse and manipulation?

I think the Qatar thing is a red herring.

It would be just as legal for a British man to groom a foreign 17 year old to come to the UK and then marry him as soon as she turned 18. It might be more difficult for her to get permission to live in the UK, depending on where she was from.

Yes, it's horrible and creepy, but if someone is a legal adult they can do what they like, even if they are still a teenager.

NautilusLionfish · 31/12/2024 09:03

Dearg · 30/12/2024 17:52

In your example, a young woman marries an older man, and moves to live with him, accepting his culture, religion and lifestyle as part of the marriage.
The law basically says ‘ not our business’ The law is right, this is not our business.

I am trying to understand if it’s the age difference , or the culture difference that you find objectionable ?

I get that your friends are hurt that they don’t see her, but that is really down to their daughter.

Have to say , the daughter does not sound very bright, but presumably she fell in love?

Exactly. She was 18 when she married him. Op has no proof there is abuse. If we tried stopping 2 white Brits over 18 getting married there would be a firestorm. Unless we create legislation on age gaps in relationships between two consenting adults.

Disturbia81 · 31/12/2024 09:01

@BlueSilverCats Yeah sometimes, and that's fucking grim too. I can't stand it.
But I'm referring to the teenage marrying older man culture.

NautilusLionfish · 31/12/2024 09:00

AgnesX · 30/12/2024 17:30

You're looking at another culture through western eyes.

They allow it, so the effort to stop it has to come from their families at this end.

It's not about another culture. So many older British men marry young women. Surely you don't mean no late 20s Brits date then marry 17 year olds when they turn 18 year ( or just have kids with them). Surely you don't mean there are no older British men going to Asia, Africa, Latin America and marrying young girls and either bringing them here or moving elsewhere. It's no a one religion or country/region issue . It's a broader question of misogyny.
@Fawnly And then you don't know why your friend's daughter cut off contact. May be she is being abused by her dh. May be her family is toxic. May be family has said racists or nasty things about the father of her babies and she went low contact. Ultimately, she married him when she turned 18 and so legally of age. And I don't think there is a law in the uk against married someone 10 years older when you are an adult.
Also 3 out of millions of young adults us simply 3 out of a million. What can goat do to stop it? Not sure.

THisbackwithavengeance · 31/12/2024 08:51

Some of you will remember when Jemima Goldsmith who was about 18 at the time married the much older Imran Khan. People thought it was romantic.

I can imagine that if you are 17 and from a middle class straight laced family and you are an archetypal "good girl" then being swept of your feet by an older handsome Arab doctor proposing marriage will be intoxicating; practically Mills&Boon.

Maybe they will be happy?

HPandthelastwish · 31/12/2024 08:51

UK schools have training on PREVENT, Forced Marriages, FGM and what to spot but once someone leaves the school system it's down to their families.

If not through there families how do they meet these men.

She may have been a privileged, A star student but clearly one that wasn't happy, happy mentally well people don't look on the internet for random men to marriage in far off countries.

Whyherewego · 31/12/2024 08:50

I don't think this is specific to Qatar or is necessarily a cultural thing. There's lots of examples in the UK of young women being love bombed/groomed by men and having babies and isolating themselves from family support.
I'm not sure of the relevance of the question "how can we stop this". She's 18 and has capacity to make her own decisions. That's true whether she meets a Dr from Qatar or some deadbeat pimp on the streets in London. OK yes Qatar is another country and makes it complicated for visiting etc. But this isn't a muslim/middle Eastern issue IMHO

BlueSilverCats · 31/12/2024 08:50

Disturbia81 · 31/12/2024 08:45

Yep the older man younger woman thing is very disturbing but we can't change another culture. I doubt many young women here would want to do it

Older man , younger woman is very much part of the British culture too. 🙄

Purpleburst · 31/12/2024 08:48

Its not unreasonable to say that living away from Sunday to Friday for 30 weeks a year may well affect family closeness, security, supervision etc. It may have contributed to a certain vulnerability in this case. Predatory men will try anything to get what they want.

Disturbia81 · 31/12/2024 08:45

Yep the older man younger woman thing is very disturbing but we can't change another culture. I doubt many young women here would want to do it

GreenTeaLikesMe · 31/12/2024 08:39

I don't think you can stop an 18yo moving to another country or getting married, OP!

I agree the relationships sound grim and they may live to regret this.

TwirlyPineapple · 31/12/2024 08:30

All the parents can do is raise children who don't see this as an attractive option. Why would a 17 year old girl from a happy home with good opportunities and a full social life and hobbies want to marry a much older man and move half way around the world? They wouldn't.

You seem oddly blind to why this particular girl would choose this route. You say she’s from a very Christian family so clearly she’s been raised to value religion and marriage and having children. All of which she’s done, just not in the religion you or her parents would prefer. And you say she was a weekly boarder at school, so she’s been taught that the relationship between her and her parents and spending tike together isn’t that important and can be sidelined for other priorities, which she is also doing.

I've been the miserable 17 year old girl. My parents' friends would have thought them great parents and thought I was a brat to not appreciate them. Luckily I didn't choose this option to escape and did it by myself rather than tying myself to someone else, but I understand the desperation to do something drastic to escape and not come back.

SeaShellsSanctuary180 · 31/12/2024 08:27

Fawnly · 30/12/2024 17:52

Sure, we could say lacking street smart but nothing says she wasn’t aware of it or was manipulated/coerced into believing different.

Her family were practicing Christians, she went to a Christian School as a weekly boarder.

Maybe as a weekly boarder she never felt love from her parents and subsequently sought it elsewhere

unsync · 31/12/2024 08:19

If her faith school was like mine, they push the narrative about marriage and procreation being the goal in life. It's very patriarchal. All she's done is stick to that doctrine and swop one bs religion for another, and control from parents to control by husband. She's legal and good breeding stock, that's how the man will have viewed it. Good family, well educated, young and pure - tick, tick tick.

Religion has no place in education (or Government) and girls need to know that they can do whatever they want and there's a world of opportunity out there for them. We need to do better.

Londonrach1 · 31/12/2024 07:53

This is on the parents and their parenting. She over 18 now. Not sure what you want to happen.

BlueSilverCats · 31/12/2024 07:49

Willyoujustbequiet · 31/12/2024 02:02

I also think it's grooming. She was still at school and a minor when it started. He's older and a doctor so a power imbalance.

I'm quite shocked by some responses which seem keen to minimise this aspect.

It's not necessarily minimising, but more what can actually be done about it?

While grooming is a crime, it would be incredibly hard to prove in this context. Involving authorities is pointless.

So , if the parents even know about it, it's down to them. They don't have many options though(bar locking your kid up and never letting them out of your sight) and it would be a very slippery slope to give parents carte blanche to prevent their 17/18 yos from doing things because they disagree with their choices and in the name of protection. And do we stop at 17/18? If it's grooming and an abusive situation, it can also happen at 19,20, 21. How long should it be extended for?

So what can actually be done as a practical solution (other than education, raising strong/confident children, awareness etc)? Ban all 18 yos from travelling abroad without parental consent? Raise age of consent to 18?

As an aside, this is a tale as old as time when it comes to poor/working class girls. Married young to an older bloke with a job /some stability to escape whatever they're running from. The concern for them has been pretty much inexistent.

HollyKnight · 31/12/2024 02:51

Young women making daft decisions isn't anything new. Legally there isn't anything that can be done because nothing illegal has happened either in the UK or overseas. All you can do as a parent is hope that you have a strong honest relationship with your own children.

Tittat50 · 31/12/2024 02:32

Fawnly · 30/12/2024 17:56

I guess it’s a mix. If they were so in love couldn’t they stay in the UK? Why was he so desperate to get her out of the UK and have kids.

She was a bright child in terms of book smart, she had 4 As/A* at a-level, fluent in French, played sports to a high level … all the things you’d say make a successful teen.

This man then messages her on Instagram and has sneaky dates when she is still 17 at school and he is late 20s a doctor!

It just seems so off?

I find it a bit creepy but she might be ok with it. She might want the arrangement they have and this is ok for her. All marriages are arrangements really aren't they. It's hard because the GPs are really missing out and are very negatively impacted

If their daughter says I choose this, I'm ok with this, what can or should anyone do. There's no real way of knowing unless she comes begging for help to escape him.

Marchitectmummy · 31/12/2024 02:29

You've noticed a pattern, the only thing that can be done from thr UK is educate young women about this so they ate equipped to make their own decisions before they are preyed on.

That's it.