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Original poster

to want to see my Dad without my (awful) stepmum sometimes?

214 replies

LoveIsAVerb · 27/12/2024 19:19

Hi all. I'm new here, go gentle!

Around this time of year, I have my annual argument with my stepmother. It was pretty low-key this year: at our annual pre-Christmas get together, she made a few snarky comments; I told her to pipe down after the final snarky comment; and she apologised. (More detail on that later!)

But it's raised a perennial issue: my stepmother and I fundamentally do not get on, and I would really like to see my Dad occasionally without her being there. But this never happens. Around this time every year, following my annual tiff with my stepmum, my sister (42, two kids) and I (40, no kids) have a word with my Dad - just "hey Dad, it would be really nice to hang out together without stepmum being there". After that, we usually have ONE walk together, he's a bit awkward about the whole thing, and then it just goes back to normal, i.e. her always being there.

It's not just that she's always there when we see him, either. Even when we call his mobile, he always puts us on speaker so that she can be involved in the conversation. We hardly ever even get to text privately; he routes all texts through the group family chat, which includes him, her, my sister and I, and my stepsisters.

Dad and stepmum have been married for 20-odd years. He left my mother for her (he was having an affair with her). I'm not particularly arsed about that tbh; mum also had affairs. I'd like to state upfront that I haven't put her into some "Evil Stepmother" trope; I'm happy that he's found someone. It's not the "stepmum" factor; it's specifically about HER, as an individual. We have wildly different values. She comes from Old Money and is, frankly, a massive snob. (My Dad came from nothing, for context, but made pretty good money by working his way up in a company, back when that was a possibility!)

This clash in values tends to be where our arguments stem from. This year, for example, at the annual Christmas get-together:

  • One of the dogs spilt my sister's drink over the table. It's this super-expensive, ornate, carved wooden table with a glass top. Stepmum FREAKED THE FUCK OUT, literally shrieking, talking about how they'd need to get it professionally cleaned etc etc. It was literally a bit of prosecco. My sister was mortified and left soon after.
  • My stepsister's fella (early 30s), an ordinary lower-middle-class bloke from Birmingham, mentioned that his mother isn't much of a wine drinker, she thinks Echo Falls is brilliant. To which, again, stepmother SHRIEKS with laughter. She's literally a millionnaire. Laughing at this ordinary working-class woman who doesn't know about wine. It made me feel physically sick. Bearing in mind, too, that my partner (50f) was also there, and she grew up in care, on the absolute bones of her arse; Echo Falls would've been a distant fucking DREAM.
  • My sister and I gave Dad and stepmum a hamper with loads of posh food in it for Xmas. I wrapped it in cellophane and ribbons and whatnot. I made a joke about how shit I am at wrapping things (context: I'm from South Wales, self-deprecation is endemic to our humour). She shrieks: "Oh I bet you relished the opportunity to skive off work for a bit to wrap it!" I work 60-hour weeks for a human rights organisation. She is an ex-doctor, and (endemic to the profession, in my experience!) therefore thinks she is better than everyone else. (This final comment was when I told her to pipe down, and she apologised, while shrieking.)

I just feel like whenever I'm at her (perfect show-home) house, I'm playing a bit-part in a fantasy M&S advert - with her at the centre. I never feel comfortable there, because if a drink gets spilled or you get too close to some expensive item of homeware, all hell breaks loose. Don't get me wrong: she cooks, she hosts, that's very generous of her. But it's The Stepmum Show, constantly. She takes over the conversation, she's not funny (unforgivably, imo!), she's just incredibly UP herself - and, as I said, a massive snob. The above is the tip of the iceberg, honestly. She literally thinks people who weren't born into inherited wealth are basically lazy and stupid.

She's always been a bit weird with me tbh. E.g. when I was about 20, we had a blazing row about something or other, and she apologised afterwards and told me straight-up that she is intimidated by my intelligence. I mean honestly, wtf?! Even if you FELT it, would you SAY it?! But she does seem majorly insecure, like she had a very good education but was essentially educated above her intelligence because her parents were rich; she seems very uncomfortably with the fact (which I LOVE) that intelligence is pretty equally distributed among the population, and you cannot fucking BUY it, however hard you try.

I'm ranting, sorry!

Everyone who's met her agrees that she's awful, a snob, and wtf is Dad doing with her - but Dad seems, or acts, oblivious. As I said, he's from a very working-class, South Wales background. He never sees his friends anymore, really; they obviously think she's a stuck-up bitch. He is also more or a less a functioning alcoholic at this point. Getting slowly sozzled on posh wine while she runs the Stepmum Show and offends everyone, seemingly obliviously.

One more example of what she's like: a few years back, she and my Dad went on a weekend away for his best mate's 60th. She took one of his childhood friends aside and said: "Do you mind not talking about your childhood memories this weekend? I don't really like hearing about times before [Dad] and I were together."

My sister is a peacekeeper, plus Dad and stepmum do a huge amount to help with their kids (she is not entirely evil - she is very generous in helping with the kids). So she is not one to rock the boat. She also lives very close to them, and he helps her out a lot, sees her a lot, etc. I only live about 20 miles away, mind, but he never comes up here (and when he does, it's always with stepmum).

I'm wondering wtf to do, tbh. I love my Dad and I know he loves me. More than that, we LIKE each other; we get along great. But she just takes over every single interaction and it's really getting on my tits and affecting my relationship with him.

I'm not stupid: I know I'm not gonna change her and he's not gonna leave her. So I'm trying to think what to do that wouldn't just be me ranting. I was thinking of maybe writing him an email (presuming she doesn't check his emails as well as answer his phone, but who knows, honestly). Just explaining how I feel. Especially, explaining that I'm not avoiding HIM (I'm really worried that he thinks I am), that the problem isn't HIM, it's HER (though the problem is also, let's face it, him being a bit fucking useless in a Man way). And just asking if we can spend time together without her. But I don't want to make his life more difficult for him, either. But an email could help because he wouldn't immediately FORGET it (which he has a tendency to do with phone calls, probably because of the whole high-functioning alcoholic thing), and he could read back over it, and tbh I'm better at communicating via writing than in person / on the phone anyway, and he could have some time to process it?

Is this just a losing battle, do I just need to get over it?!

Thanks so much in advance for any advice / shared stories / etc! <3

OP posts:
TotalDramarama24 · 28/12/2024 11:09

I'm surprised at all these posts suggesting that the step mum is somehow at fault for always tagging along or listening in on calls and not "letting" the dad spend time alone with his adult children.

It's entirely down to the Dad. If he wanted to he would, and I bet his wife does encourage him to be sociable or contact his kids but he just doesn't want to. When my in laws were alive I used to have to literally force my DH to contact any of them, call them, meet up, buy gifts etc. He would never have bothered if I hadn't told him too, and his family still believed that it was somehow my fault and I was keeping him to myself rather than me actively wanting him to gtf out of the house and see them all.

I reckon if the wife wasn't kind enough to host these meet ups you'd probably never see your dad at all.

Poppyseeds79 · 28/12/2024 11:04

BeaRightThere · 28/12/2024 10:53

OP your style of writing seems to be very Tumblr influenced and it's exhausting to read. The endless exclamations and quips and generic Americanised internet speak of it all. Perhaps you should consider that your stepmother finds you extremely difficult too. I'm assuming you don't communicate this way IRL but if there is a chance you do, she might find this as overbearing and tiring and insufferable as you find her.

Ultimately I suspect there are more similarities between you than you realise. Your stepmother sounds annoying but not an actively bad person. Focus on the opportunities you've identified where you could spend some one-on-one time with your dad and when you do seen your stepmother, realise she probably feels as awkward and irritated as you do and try to get along as best you can.

It is a difficult situation but ultimately you can't eject her from your life entirely if you still want a relationship with your father.

This! So much this!!!!....

I'm sure you're a lovely person OP, but if you waffle on in person even a 1/3 of how much you do when writing. Then I'd probably be the one telling you to "pipe down". You seem massively fond of using 30 words where 3 will suffice.

BeaRightThere · 28/12/2024 10:53

OP your style of writing seems to be very Tumblr influenced and it's exhausting to read. The endless exclamations and quips and generic Americanised internet speak of it all. Perhaps you should consider that your stepmother finds you extremely difficult too. I'm assuming you don't communicate this way IRL but if there is a chance you do, she might find this as overbearing and tiring and insufferable as you find her.

Ultimately I suspect there are more similarities between you than you realise. Your stepmother sounds annoying but not an actively bad person. Focus on the opportunities you've identified where you could spend some one-on-one time with your dad and when you do seen your stepmother, realise she probably feels as awkward and irritated as you do and try to get along as best you can.

It is a difficult situation but ultimately you can't eject her from your life entirely if you still want a relationship with your father.

Original poster
LoveIsAVerb · 28/12/2024 10:43

TheMamaYo · 28/12/2024 09:41

There seems to be a lot of opportunity for you to spend time alone with your dad if you really wanted to, and if it’s not all on your terms? (Favourite pub etc)
Football mornings, DIY projects, time she’s with her kids or friends etc.

Maybe just start there, meet him on that level and spend quality time with him. It might make him realize how important it is to you. But as much as you say you want to spend time with him, is how many excuses you are using for not doing it, unless it’s in the way you prefer? Just start somewhere.

Something to mull over, for sure - thank you.

OP posts:
Original poster
LoveIsAVerb · 28/12/2024 10:39

DarkandStormyNightie · 28/12/2024 10:27

Honestly I don't think my dad is genuinely puzzled. He knows what I think and it just doesn't fit into what he wants to hear, so he just ignores it until he thinks it will go away. What he's puzzled at is why this technique isn't working. Why am I not just acting like an obedient child and falling back into place?

So my advice is don't get too wrapped up in trying to make them understand your point of view. Some people deliberately use not understanding as a way of getting what they want because they know you'll tie yourself up in knots trying.

Just have a honest conversation with your dad and use it as a line in the sand. If after that nothing changes, then you know you tried.

Don't go round in circles and second guess yourself. It just makes you miserable.

Show quote history

Thank you so much for your advice, I truly appreciate it. I will do my best to follow it, too. Thank you, and I hope it gets a bit easier for you, too. ❤

(Is there a book called The Shit Dads Club yet? If not, shall we write it?!)

OP posts:
DarkandStormyNightie · 28/12/2024 10:27

LoveIsAVerb · 27/12/2024 23:27

@DarkandStormyNightie Omg that does sound similar... I'm so sorry you're going through this, too. The cult stuff sounds like an abject nightmare, wtf?!

"She presents as a lovely woman and then will drop in these awful statements out of nowhere." - YES, exactly! And they're so out of the blue that it's always a massive shock?! And everyone is so gobsmacked that by the time you'd even think to respond, she has moved the conversation on. Some other responses here have compared her to Fleabag, and omfg, YES, that is exactly it!!! How do you deal w/someone like that, honestly?!

The funny thing is that - despite some previous comments on here about me having a "chip on my shoulder" (?!) - I am known among my friends and colleagues for being virtually unoffendable. Things piss me off, sure, but she is the only person I know who says things that I find actually offensive, you know?! And that's not because of her being the "other woman", as some previous comments have suggested (who gives a shit about that, honestly?! Mum and dad divorced quarter of a century ago, mum also cheated on him, etc.!) - it's because of the things that she says. It is her, as an individual. I just... think she's kind of a despicable person. And idk where you go from there, really, if you want an honest relationship with someone?!

On that note: I'm glad it's not just me who values honest relationships. My sister is... I love her, but she can be quite... instrumental/transactional. Dad and stepmum do a lot of practical things for her, childcare etc. Whereas there is nothing riding on this relationship for me, in practical terms. That sounds horrific, it's horrific to me to think of relationships in this way. But it is what it is.

"I've come to the conclusion that nothing will change so I can only manage myself and my family. I know they're puzzled as to why I'm not playing thr game but tbh I've explained it enough over the years, so my dad is choosing not to understand." - I think this is what I need to do. But I don't want them to be puzzled. I'm wondering whether I might need to have one last conversation with Dad about wanting to spend time 1 on 1. And then if/when that doesn't happen, at least I know I gave it a good go, I guess - and sticking to my boundaries after that would be easier, as I would've very clearly stated those boundaries (I don't think I have, up until this point; I've just backed off for a bit and not seen them again until I've calmed down).

How do you deal with their puzzlement? Like are they still genuinely confused as to why you don't want to play happy families? Do they ask you about it / say anything about it now?

Thanks for your comment!

Show quote history

Honestly I don't think my dad is genuinely puzzled. He knows what I think and it just doesn't fit into what he wants to hear, so he just ignores it until he thinks it will go away. What he's puzzled at is why this technique isn't working. Why am I not just acting like an obedient child and falling back into place?

So my advice is don't get too wrapped up in trying to make them understand your point of view. Some people deliberately use not understanding as a way of getting what they want because they know you'll tie yourself up in knots trying.

Just have a honest conversation with your dad and use it as a line in the sand. If after that nothing changes, then you know you tried.

Don't go round in circles and second guess yourself. It just makes you miserable.

Original poster
LoveIsAVerb · 28/12/2024 10:12

Mookie81 · 28/12/2024 10:07

The exclamation button seems to be overcompensating...

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Buuuurn! 😂This is hilarious because a fair amount of my work involves editing, and I spend an UNTOLD AMOUNT of time deleting exclamation marks, even "having a sit down" with authors to explain why they need to NEVER, EVER use one (or VERY judicious use). So I think you're (unintentionally) spot on, in that I "overcompensate" for this in nonprofessional writing... Sorry!!

OP posts:
Original poster
LoveIsAVerb · 28/12/2024 10:09

Psychologymam · 28/12/2024 09:48

From what you say she doesn’t sound pleasant so I get that but it does sound like you also make sweeping generalisations that are going to provoke people and have a bit of a chip on your shoulder. I guess I just wonder do others perceive her like you do because if I was your sister no way would I leave me child with someone who I thought worked with kids because they can’t advocate for themselves - sounds sinister! But then I work in healthcare and with kids and know there are good people and assholes in all professionals and from all social backgrounds. I think the frustration comes from your dad involving her in everything and I get it - that would really annoy me, but unless she’s abusive doesn’t your dad have a responsibility to you to develop his own relationship? Interestingly I know we just get a snapshot but you sound like her a bit?! Very strong opinions, want to be in charge and manage the scenario and dislike those you are a bit different to you!

Show quote history

Sorry if I sound really thick, but you know when you say I sound like I've got a "chip on my shoulder" - what do you mean by that, exactly?! A couple of previous commenters have said the same thing, so obviously it's an issue I should look at! But I'm not quite sure what is meant by it, because I always thought "having a chip on your shoulder" meant you're really easily offended? And I'm literally the opposite of easily offendable - which is why this situation just knocks me for six: I am so rarely offended that I'm not quite sure how to deal with it when I am!

But perhaps that's not what you mean?!

I just looked it up and have seen other definitions saying e.g. quick to anger, always up for a fight - which, tbf, is actually pretty accurate! Ironically, people have told me since I was a literal child that I've got my Dad's temper... thanks, Dad! 😅(not to absolve myself of blame lol)

I'm actually quite nice in person, I'm just quite pissed off right now (less and less, though - talking about it is helping!)

ANYWAY, anyway...

"I guess I just wonder do others perceive her like you do because if I was your sister no way would I leave me child with someone who I thought worked with kids because they can’t advocate for themselves - sounds sinister"

  • On the first bit: Yes, everyone I know perceives her like I do, my Dad's lifelone friends, also his parents (before they passed away), his sister and brothers, my own sister, her friends, literally everyone I know perceives her like I do - this is not a "me" thing, unfortunately (that would be easier to deal with!)
  • On the second bit: Sorry if I was unclear before; what I meant was: she is very good with kids, and always willing to help out! The rest of my previous comment was more of an observation from me, about people who can be quite good with kids and animals - but shit with adults - and how, in my (limited) experience, I've observed that trait among people who have some control issues, i.e. they gravitate towards animals and kids because they don't answer back. That was a sweeping generalisation, though, of course - some people are just nice!! As you said: "there are good people and assholes in all professionals and from all social backgrounds" - TOTALLY. God, the stories I could tell you about the nonprofit world! The EGOS!!!

"unless she’s abusive doesn’t your dad have a responsibility to you to develop his own relationship?"

  • Yes, of course! And I'm glad he is with someone. I'm just trying to figure out - STILL!! - how to navigate this particular individual.
  • It's not the relationship that's the problem. It's her, as a person. (People here seem to not believe me about this, but I'm not sure how to prove it!!)

"Interestingly I know we just get a snapshot but you sound like her a bit?! Very strong opinions, want to be in charge and manage the scenario and dislike those you are a bit different to you!"

  • TAKE IT BACK!!! ;)
  • Hahaha ok I'll take that one, in that I do have strong opinions.
  • I don't like being in charge, weirdly! I know it would suit my personality but I'm not a huge fan of it (actively avoid management roles etc., I do not want to deal with other people's BS - perhaps that's its own issue lol).
  • I don't dislike those who are different from me - my friends are a very motley crew!! - but I do dislike people who think they are better than others by virtue of money, like that is one of my pet peeves, so there is a huge values clash here, which is what's making it so hard.
OP posts:
Mookie81 · 28/12/2024 10:07

LoveIsAVerb · 28/12/2024 08:07

Off topic, but I am really sick of half the keys not working on my keyboard; apologies, folks of MumsNet!

The exclamation button seems to be overcompensating...

Psychologymam · 28/12/2024 09:48

LoveIsAVerb · 28/12/2024 08:35

I'm not really cross with her about her clothes, I'm just venting and being a dick, sorry! 😅I earn silly money these days, so these strange comments about jealousy (I've never understood that: the assumption that any class-based criticisms are about individual jealousy, rather than a fury at structural injustice?! but that's another convo lol) are way off the mark tbh... It's less the ££ itself and more the snobbery, the entitlement, the looking down on others with less money, etc., that I find unbearable.

Anyway!

Yes, you are right: she is a very safe pair of hands for the kids, she is GREAT with kids (I suspect this might be a control thing: I've noticed in my line of work that people who gravitate towards working with children and animals tend to have a bit of a control thing going on, i.e. they like working with those who can't advocate for themselves or answer back)... But no, she is not an awful horrendous person, she is not abusive, she defo has some good bits!

AND I really, strongly dislike her.

Do you guys not have anyone like that in your lives: people who are basically good-hearted people - not EVIL - but that you just... cannot fucking stand?! They just irritate the everloving fuck out of you?! It's not that rare among the people I know, but obv that isn't a double-blind randomised control trial lol

Show quote history

From what you say she doesn’t sound pleasant so I get that but it does sound like you also make sweeping generalisations that are going to provoke people and have a bit of a chip on your shoulder. I guess I just wonder do others perceive her like you do because if I was your sister no way would I leave me child with someone who I thought worked with kids because they can’t advocate for themselves - sounds sinister! But then I work in healthcare and with kids and know there are good people and assholes in all professionals and from all social backgrounds. I think the frustration comes from your dad involving her in everything and I get it - that would really annoy me, but unless she’s abusive doesn’t your dad have a responsibility to you to develop his own relationship? Interestingly I know we just get a snapshot but you sound like her a bit?! Very strong opinions, want to be in charge and manage the scenario and dislike those you are a bit different to you!

TheMamaYo · 28/12/2024 09:41

There seems to be a lot of opportunity for you to spend time alone with your dad if you really wanted to, and if it’s not all on your terms? (Favourite pub etc)
Football mornings, DIY projects, time she’s with her kids or friends etc.

Maybe just start there, meet him on that level and spend quality time with him. It might make him realize how important it is to you. But as much as you say you want to spend time with him, is how many excuses you are using for not doing it, unless it’s in the way you prefer? Just start somewhere.

Theordinary · 28/12/2024 09:33

Well I think she sounds awful. It's true that she's not going away but I don't think it's unreasonable to limit your contact with her. Maybe just stick with an hour visit for a quick cuppa now and again rather than a whole day/dinner type occasion? Small doses might be easier to stomach.

Original poster
LoveIsAVerb · 28/12/2024 09:29

TutiFrutti · 28/12/2024 09:20

@LoveIsAVerb
Hi, friendly wave from me. I totally understand, I'm in a similar position. My dad hasn't remarried but she moved in at lightning speed after they met (she wasn't an ow).
All my dad's lifelong friends have drifted away, some specifically saying they don't feel welcome by her. She is, by my dad's own admission controlling and v anxious but she's a strong character and dominates him. He seems to have settled for a quiet life.
I totally get the phone situation, I have been chastised for being rude to her on the phone when she persists in butting in our conversations (also on speaker), she gets angry if I express an opinion she doesn't like and shouts over me.
I accept I can't change the situation so I simply continue speaking when she interrupts, politely point out it's rude to listen in/interrupt (to which my dad will agree) and will absolutely say what I like regardless of if she'll approve. She stops for a while but then it starts again.
It's not within my power to change it but I sympathise op, it's really shit.

Gahhh yeah that does sound very similar - the lifelong friends drifting away (they also say they don't feel welcome, that she looks down on them, etc), the Dad settling for a quiet life, the FUCKING SPEAKER PHONE THINGGGGG!!!!! 😅Go you for just carrying on talking and politely pointing out that she's being rude with that, at least!

And yeah - you say something about it, it stops for a while, then normal behaviour resumes... So frustrating.

But you're right: not within our power to change.

Thank you for your sympathy. Have some back! I appreciate it. ❤

OP posts:
Original poster
LoveIsAVerb · 28/12/2024 09:27

HadEnoughOfThisPish · 28/12/2024 09:14

'Why the fuck do you think, dad? I love you, you're my dad, I want to see you on your own sometimes without Sandra shrieking and being a pain in the arse'
OR
'Why not?'

Show quote history

YES to this, too! Thank you! Lol at your struck-through comment too, ha! But yeah I need to be as subtle as a sledgehammer, I think

OP posts:
Original poster
LoveIsAVerb · 28/12/2024 09:27

RandomMess · 28/12/2024 09:07

Ok so even when you got to the pub she tags along so you just need to be direct.

"Dad I need some daughter Dad time with you. Do you fancy doing x or y with me." If she tries to get in the car he lets it be known that she's invited herself you say "No, it's just daughter Dad time like stepmum has with her DC"

Hopefully then you again can talk it through that you miss him and you never get one on one time with him and you need it. Which includes phone calls and meeting up.

Yes! Thank you! I need to hear this kind of thing, I think... I need to woman up!!! For all my bluster, I think I'm scared lol

OP posts:
Original poster
LoveIsAVerb · 28/12/2024 09:25

MuggleMe · 28/12/2024 09:06

OP your story resonates so much. My mum died when I was 14, a year later my dad had remarried to an awful overbearing younger woman. She had a facade of being nice and could seem/be genuinely nice, but only as long as she was in control and you played by her rules.

She was permanently passive aggressive and I basically never communicated with dad alone again. I have sooo many stories but that's not relevant.

When I got engaged my DH tried to salvage the relationship, we wrote letters, then the next time we visited we were dragged along for family therapy where the therapist had met with SM before and transparently on their/her side, picking apart the letters. It was awful!

Long story short, 30 years later one sibling has gone virtually non-contact (drove 5 hours to visit for dad's 80th, stayed 3 hours), and I'm low-contact and mostly because I have children I wanted them to have a relationship with and have been overly patient.

Unfortunately dad has dementia now so the time for an independent relationship is over. I'm mourning his loss as I have been for years. Dad was an adult when he chose to get married and chose to allow SM to rule the roost so as much as I like to blame SM, it's on him too.

I'm so sorry for your loss... or losses... because it IS a loss, isn't it? You grieve them. And that's before even getting to the dementia part of the equation. I'm so sorry.

Your story massively resonates with me, too. I absolutely cannot deal with passive-aggression, like I just do not know what to do with it, I would literally rather someone was aggressive-aggressive, just punched me in the face or whatever, than this constant slow drip-feed of catty comments?! It's so anathema to me, I can't deal with it!

Jesus fucking Christ re: your group therapist! Someone regulate that profession, ffs!!! So many charlatans causing so much damage (I have had family therapy in the past, as a very young teenager; it... did not go well lol).

I guess I'm hoping that low/no contact isn't the only option, but it might be. Ugh. FWIW, I think you're very brave, but it must be heartbreaking.

But of course, yes, you're right - it's on the Dads, really, not the stepmums...

OP posts:
Original poster
LoveIsAVerb · 28/12/2024 09:21

Ukholidaysaregreat · 28/12/2024 09:04

I wouldn't write it down. There is every chance your step Mum will read it and that would be a total nightmare to sort out. I agree your Dad is being pathetic not to sort out seeing you separately but men often are like that.

God, yeah, you're probably/definitely right about that... Thank you!!!

So thankful I'm gay lol

OP posts:
TutiFrutti · 28/12/2024 09:20

@LoveIsAVerb
Hi, friendly wave from me. I totally understand, I'm in a similar position. My dad hasn't remarried but she moved in at lightning speed after they met (she wasn't an ow).
All my dad's lifelong friends have drifted away, some specifically saying they don't feel welcome by her. She is, by my dad's own admission controlling and v anxious but she's a strong character and dominates him. He seems to have settled for a quiet life.
I totally get the phone situation, I have been chastised for being rude to her on the phone when she persists in butting in our conversations (also on speaker), she gets angry if I express an opinion she doesn't like and shouts over me.
I accept I can't change the situation so I simply continue speaking when she interrupts, politely point out it's rude to listen in/interrupt (to which my dad will agree) and will absolutely say what I like regardless of if she'll approve. She stops for a while but then it starts again.
It's not within my power to change it but I sympathise op, it's really shit.

Original poster
LoveIsAVerb · 28/12/2024 09:20

BCBird · 28/12/2024 09:00

My ex partner had a grown up.son
He was keen for me to.go with him.when he visited his son. I pointed out that I would occasionally but his son did not really want yo spend time with me and that lad and dad time was important . Some people are not thst intuitive

This is definitely also a factor: my dad is NOT an intuitive man, not an emotionally intelligent man; I would literally need to SPELL IT OUT - and then he would probably forget it because he is entering that stage of life where all that lifelong boozing affects your memory...

OP posts:
curious79 · 28/12/2024 09:20

Hoglet70 · 27/12/2024 19:23

I think you need to get over it, she's not going away.

You don't need to know anything about wine to know that Echo Falls is shit buy the way lol

First response nailed it.

don’t create distance between you and your Dad because you’re forcing him to choose.

Stop getting so offended on behalf of everyone else - you need to chill too

your dad is part of the problem - like so many men he’s a total patsy to a dominant woman

Original poster
LoveIsAVerb · 28/12/2024 09:18

Mummadeze · 28/12/2024 08:58

I think she would be less annoying if you manage to forge a genuine relationship with her. Her performative behaviour sounds like a product of her insecurity which is surely fuelled by her sensing that you don’t like her. I get it because I can get quite shrieky and try-hard when I think people don’t like me. It’s a misguided attempt to impress them or make them laugh. Even when I can see it not working, I keep trying to try and crack them. She admitted to you that you intimidate her, which was quite a vulnerable and open thing to say and is a clue that the issue isn’t one-sided. I know it might be hard, but could you get to know the real her by doing something together on your own and make her feel accepted by you. Try harder to understand her and be her friend? Because if she relaxes in your company, I think she might back off a bit too and it will eventually lead to you having more alone time with your Dad. I might be completely wrong, but I bet if we read a post about this situation from her perspective it might read very differently.

Honestly? I think this is a really thoughtful and good idea, AND I don't think it's going to happen. I just do not have the time or inclination to forge this kind of relationship with her. I work so much, I barely have time to see the people I genuinely love, you know?! And I know myself well enough to know that this is not the kind of thing I could do - even while sort of wishing that I COULD do something like this, and knowing that I would deeply admire anyone else who did this.

So: thank you, but I think this is beyond my gift, sadly!

Thank you also for sharing your own experience of trying to make people laugh and crack them when you sense they don't like you. Tbh, I do that too! I always try to impress the most hard-to-impress person in the room, always try to make people laugh, etc. So I should understand that better, really.

Thanks again!

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LoveIsAVerb · 28/12/2024 09:14

Youhaveunderminedyrargument · 28/12/2024 08:50

@LoveIsAVerb
I agreed and nodded along with you until this:
"She is an ex-doctor, and (endemic to the profession, in my experience!) therefore thinks she is better than everyone else"
Now I just think you are bitter and rude.

Yeah I might have been a bit of a dick there. Obviously my own experience with doctors is a sample of 1, and there must be plenty of excellent ones! It is a pattern I've noticed, but that doesn't mean much, in the grand scheme of things, I realise! I'm just venting, sorry ("AND ANOTHER THINGGGGGG!!!!!" <shakes fist at sky>) 😅

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HadEnoughOfThisPish · 28/12/2024 09:14

LoveIsAVerb · 27/12/2024 19:47

@DrinkFeckArseBrick Yeah I think you are right, I need to ask him to spend some time with me without her, without mentioning how I feel about her. This is probably really lame but I'm not sure how to do that! I think if I suggest it, his first question will be "why?" There aren't any hobbies we share that I could suggest we do and that would "accidentally" exclude her. Hmm...

'Why the fuck do you think, dad? I love you, you're my dad, I want to see you on your own sometimes without Sandra shrieking and being a pain in the arse'
OR
'Why not?'

Original poster
LoveIsAVerb · 28/12/2024 09:12

Moveoverdarlin · 28/12/2024 08:39

I think you need to accept that they have been married 20 plus years and they come as a pair. I can understand why a teenage girl would need time one on one with her father but at 40 writing him a letter saying you want to see him alone seems a bit OTT.

You say she’s intimidated by your intelligence but you seem intimidated by her nice house and high standards.

Your Dad probably finds it easier with you when everyone is together. My Mum and Dad have been together 50 years but one on one I’d struggle with conversation with my Dad for too long.

Edited

Yeah perhaps it is a bit OTT, this is why I'm asking for people's opinions, tbh - I'm not sure whether it's a bit MUCH, you know?!

I only reported about her being intimidated by my intelligence (just writing that feels so gross and ridiculous, right?!) because she literally told me that, to my face, when I was about 19. I can assure you I am not intimidated by inanimate objects, bricks and mortar, etc. - however "nice"!

I think there's definitely something in your final para, though - about Dad finding it easier when everyone is together. I think I said this in an earlier comment, but I have noticed this becoming a bigger issue over the years. Maybe socialising is like a muscle: the less you use it, the weaker it gets. He seems very reliant on her now, socially; just kind of lets her take over while he gets slowly sozzled in the corner. But we can be on the phone for hours (occasionally) - when she's not around. But face-to-face, you might be right that he would struggle with holding a convo because their dynamic is such that she is the social leader, if that makes sense.

Hmm.

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LoveIsAVerb · 28/12/2024 09:08

TotemPolly · 28/12/2024 08:29

I don't think you have a step mum problem , you don't like her and I get that , but the problem lies with your Dad .
You've asked him many times to separately meet up without her , but he still turns up as a 2 with her .

That's weakness in his part , he should have set up boundaries with her that were none negotiable years ago and he chose not to for an easier life.

I'm a step Mum of an adult daughter of my dh , she was around 15 when we got together . If he / she wants contact without me , then fine , likewise with my children

With your situation , the timespan is tricky , it has been like it for many years , so hard for them ( him ) to change now . They've done what suits them , and not you .I

You could try to change it by telling him that for the next few months you only want to see him only , and when he wants to meet to contact you .I

That way you will push him into making that decision , and you will just have to wait and see if he commits to it . If not , you don't see your dad . Something you would just have to accept . He chooses her over you.

Thank you for this. I think these are all very astute observations. I agree that it is weakness on his part that's the ultimate problem, and also that the pattern is now very deeply set, over many years, so change is unlikely.

I like your idea of telling him I want to see him only for the next few months - but in all honesty, I'm scared to do that.

Not just because I'm scared he won't live up to it (though that, too), and I'm scared for what that would mean for our relationship (though that, too!) - but because I'm scared to put the cat among the pigeons, so to speak. I'm scared of the "why?" questions I will receive from Dad - and from her (because he will tell her / she will demand to know why she's not being invited to every single thing).

What can I possibly say to that - to the "why don't you want to see stepmum?" Can I just say: "I just want to see Dad alone sometimes" and leave it at that? But knowing them both as people, I don't think it WOULD get left at that, you know?! And then what - how do you say (or AVOID saying) "I just do not like her"?!

Urgh! Sorry to ask loads of Qs!

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