To stop looking after my SIL"s kids at family gatherings?

For the sake of the 4 yo, could you contact the school? Not sure about the rest of it.

I'm guessing bil n sil see this as their respite time. My sil n bil are similar,I sometimes help mil but not everytime I figure it's mils circus

I think your concerns are valid. Yes family can help out but if you aren't enjoying yourself and it's stressful for you and your family then something needs to change as it's clearly more than a bit of helping out. Perhaps you and your family should say actually we are trying to eat ourselves so could you come help your DC and distance yourselves a bit. Not saying miss family gathering entirely but perhaps leave early/come a bit later etc. There's helping and then there's parents not parenting at all which isn't ok for me. Sounds like the parents do have a lot of support which is wonderful so I don't think the case of giving them a break applies here, sounds CF behaviour on their part tbh.

I have two very little DC too and they are always on my radar. I never just assume someone else should be helping them. I check and if a family member is happy to have them/help them then it's fine but even then I keep a close eye in case a situation unfolds. No one knows your children like you. And if my child is choking/has an accident I wouldn't want to be sat far away from them! In our circle it is very much the norm for people to shuffle around the table to ensure parents are sat with their children unless someone offers to have them.

I'm torn - dh's sisters always got very involved with our kids - we didn't ask them to - there was no need Unlike their kids ours were not high-maintenance, were well-behaved, happy to entertain themselves, got along well with each other, Sils could never let their kids free range in any way, everything had to have adult involvement - it annoyed our kids but we said nothing, we thought they were coming from a good place. Even when we felt our kids were old enough to be dropped off at the cinema (13 years old) they insisted on going along (our kids weren't very happy with the intrusion either). Eventually, the whole thing blew up and we were accused of taking advantage of them - expecting them to look after our kids (at the cinema), it really pissed me off, our kids did not need their supervision. It destroyed any real relationship we had with them, we thought they had given their time willingly otherwise we'd have told them there was no need but it turns out there was a mass of resentment building up - I wish they'd have left our kids alone, they were absolutely fine without them.

Good advice to sit your teens between you and dh then turn your back on your nephew and speak to your teens.
I too would ignore your nephews. Just don’t engage if it gets in your nerves.
Im not talking about them asking for help etc but if they are fighting leave them too it.
Walk away, talk to other relatives.

Steer them back toward the parents at every opportunity. I'm not saying don't interact -play games, chat etc, but any "need" like disagreement solving or food management, say 'go and speak to mum/dad' or call the parents over and walk off immediately. Just stop. My two are now an adult and late teen. I've done my younger child parenting already, and while I'm more than happy to lend a hand occasionally, I'm not being a bloody free childminding service.

Husband and I used to find large family gatherings shattering as the houses weren't child proof and we couldn't take our eyes off them for a minute.
Our older nieces and nephews were kind to our children but absolutely no minding them went on.
Now ours are grown and our nieces and nephews have tots.
I sit down and really enjoy family gatherings.
I let them crack on with mixed results.
One niece allows her feral children run riot.
Her husband does his best.
She is Headmistress of a prominent school and believes in gently parenting....hence they are lovely but quite feral.

Why on earth should op have sole responsibility of keeping them alive? Choking burning etc it's awful what stress.
Op do it.

These three incidents are something which could have caused death. Two choking incidents and a potential 3m fall onto tiles. I think you or your DH need to say something.

I would split the boys up so one with each parent. Make place cards and comment about how they didn’t get a chance to sit together last time.

Just say "please supervise your children" repeat repeat

It sounds like you are over-anxious about them. 4 and 6 yos don't need anyone to cut up their food, taken to the toilet or be reminded to chew. Do you think someone cuts up their food at school? Brothers also sometimes fight. I would let them get on with it unless they are actually at serious risk of harm. If it's serious, tell SIL and BIL.

It does sounds like an awful situation. Completely agree that the school should be informed of concerns with the 4 year old, and the escalating behaviour of the older child. It sounds like the parents need more help, but help to parent effectively rather than someone else taking on the responsibility.
Me ex SIL was very much like this, her child is a tearaway and has been from day 1, with also very little in the way of parenting. Every time she visited exMIL she would almost 'forget' her child existed and then be furious withe everyone for not watching when he came in hurt or dirty. I did have it out with her in the end, but only when she asked why my children aren't getting hurt or covered in dirt - that's because I am watching them!! Don't know what she's like now because I don't get involved

OP - over the years, I have posted not dissimilar threads about SIL and (now ex) BIL and their DC. So I 100% get it. There's the intellectual "just don't do it" mindset, and the reality of how hard it is to just not do it.

You say that your BIL is a sexist, wanker - I wonder if he's also abusive? In our case, exBIL was emotionally abusive and highly controlling (ironically, he didn't even have the benefit of earning well to "justify" that abuse but the only positive is that I think that this sort of abuse is harder to spot when the abuser can claim "I just work really hard so...." and it meant that we all saw through him a bit sooner) and it absolutely made SIL a worse parent. Sadly, he's now an ex but SIL's parenting has not significantly improved, exacerbated by what we suspect is ND in at least one child and, of course, the trauma they are all living with as a result of the long-term abuse, a difficult and acrimonious split, and the ongoing trauma that exBIL brings to their lives.

I also considered contacting the school at various points. LIke you, I knew that if I did it would cause absolute chaos if it ever came out. I even considered trying to do it anonomously. There is a part of me that regrets that I did not.

The problem is that if the parenting is poor, they do not want to acknowledge that and probably can't. It will only get worse. One of our nephews is now really struggling and SIL is struggling too - but it's difficult because I am deeply sympathetic but also frustrated because at least some of these problems are the result of her own actions (or, more accurately, lack of action).

Honestly, I just ignore other people's kids. I obviously look after my own, make sure they are behaving themselves, being polite and enjoying whatever we're attending, but other people's kids I don't do anything with beyond hello and polite conversation.

You don't see the problem as you either aren't reading the OPs posts or for some reason you dont understand them

This clearly isn't a case of normal family pitching in, you should be thankful your family isn't dysfunctional like this one is.

I can only suggest speaking up every time OP and calling the SIL and BIL out when they absolve their parental responsibilities and don't step in

I think you should insist the two children be seated away from each other, for a start. If MIL insists they are “fine where they are” I’d just say no, you are beside them and would rather not have to play referee. Seat one elsewhere for a little peace for the little one.

I would do what Createausername1970 suggested on page 1.

Then ignore their response, as in - I’ve told you your child needs some help, ball is in your court- or excuse yourself and pop to the loo/check on something away from the table.

Also, try to sit at the table before everyone else, maybe you and 1 DC, the other DC sits next to DH.

Good plan. Making yourself useful is something to which no one can reasonably object! I find strategies like these very useful for de-escalating BS, or as straightforward avoidance tactics when someone's crossed a line but it's not something I'd sacrifice a relationship for. It's terrible manners to make a scene under someone else's roof.

But I would be taking the children by the hand and leading them firmly to the seat at the table directly adjacent to their parents.

I had friends who did this. I love them and their daughter dearly, but their DD adored me (albeit she was quite troublesome and a nightmare at the dinner table), stuck to me like a leech, and I think they came to see my presence as a welcome break from parenting.

I disavailed them of that particular belief by gestures such as the above. It avoided a confrontation I really didn't want with people I cared about and a friendship I valued. It wasn't worth dying on that particular hill.

You could try making a joke of it: 'Who's on child-care duty today, BIL?' (or call it Monster Duty if you dare!) And 'SIL! SIL! Is X allowed such a huge slice of bread before the main meal?'; 'SIL! BIL! Little Y is trying to eat a WHOLE slice of ham at once!! Do you want me to stop him before he chokes?' And 'SIL, BIL, Little X wants the toilet! Will one of you take him? No? Are you sure? He's worried...' Hopefully they will get tired of it before you do...

The parents were quite unphased by it. The rest of us were beside ourselves when we realised. This is one of many similar incidents. I could go on, but it would be very outing.

You should just do it as itf gives them a break. Bit mean a whole family of adults can't be bothered. The parents have them for the rest of the year.

I think you need to make sure they are not sitting with you, if needed go and move labels. It doesn’t matter if they sit with your MIL but not with you - I think your DH should do this as it’s his family then every time when children are asking for something take them to their parents and leave. That’s it and engage into something. When they come and ask your adult children to play you should say : Look Jack/ Jane are busy talking with cousin Edmond so can’t play at the moment.
Don’t tell that you looked after them at Christmas and it’s not your turn now. If you don’t want to and don’t feel up to it it’s never your turn so don’t go into this territory.
By the way children will be absolutely fine without your help, I suspect that parents treat them the same at home, they don’t change tactic deliberately just for family gatherings so ignore , they will survive.

I agree - if it's suggested say 'oh no, remember Christmas when you were at the other end of the table and kidx started choking? They need to be with mummy and daddy. For safety. Off you go, sweetie, mummy would love you to sit with her!'