Argument with EX wife over gift giving for the children.

Why would you tell them on Christmas Day, 4 days before they have to go back to their mums???
Sounds like you have made a much bigger deal out of this than you needed to and you are trying to manipulate them against their mum?
I don’t think either of you have the kids’ best interests at heart from the sound of it.

From your messages it sounds like you think you are the perfect parent and aren’t willing to see things from any other side other than your own?

Your ex has no right to tell you what to buy your kids for Christmas, equally you have no right to be making an issue out of what she buys.

Personally I think the children should be allowed to take what they want across homes, but since the two of you can’t seem to work together/ compromise on what is an appropriate gift , she has every right to set a boundary about what goes into her house or not.

There was no need for you to blow this up into a huge issue at all, especially on Christmas Day, 4 days ahead of the issue and putting a dark cloud over the kids’ enjoyment of their stuff before they have to leave.

You are both at fault here and the situation sounds toxic

Ridiculous. You cannot call social services because of a disagreement about Christmas gifts.

Sorry if it's already been answered but why can't you say to ex "I have followed the 4 gift rule, want-ipad, need- hygiene, wear- whatever they wanted and read - a copy of how to deal with your narcissistic mother".. On a serious note, poor kids will end up resenting her and remember her misrable "rules"

*to add to the above…

The way to frame this to her is that she clearly believes there is a good rationale for the four gifts and that it’s the right thing for them. You don’t follow it, so that makes her the best person to explain it to them in a way that doesn’t upset them. Just say if you explain it you’ll probably say something wrong…. So best that she does it.

She will probably tell them you are in the wrong and that you’re backing down on an agreement.

Keep your message to the kids is clear and simple:

There’s no right or wrong way to do Christmas, everyone is different and does what’s best for them. Repeat.

@As78 I am in complete agreement that you’re in the right and sound like a great dad. Please stop repeating the RR and slime comments though you’re getting stuck in a loop, we can all read thread so far and now you need to work out how to move forward and find the best damage limitation approach (because let’s face it you’re the grown up here).

However…

I don’t think you did the right thing telling the oldest two when you did as they’ll dwell on it for two days, and I don’t think that getting her to come over on Sunday is necessarily the right thing to do either.

Why? Because they’re clearly upset which means that:

1. She will now blame you for them being upset, and say that HOW you told them was unfair and you’re making her out to be a witch. She’ll retaliate to the kids that you’re undermining her and trying to make her look bad, which will upset and confuse the kids.

2. There will likely be a confrontation on Sunday either between kids and her, or you and her, which doesn’t help anyone.

I think you could have waited until Saturday to talk to kids when emotions had died down a little between the two of you and it’s less close to Christmas.

However that’s done now and I think your next steps need to be as follows:

1. You tell her you told the oldest two and they are really upset. You tell her SHE now needs to talk to them ahead of Sunday to work out a solution. This means that she gets “her say”, and that you don’t inadvertently become bad cop to everyone which WILL be what happens next.
2. You tell her that the older two were so upset that she needs to be the one to tell the younger two. Why… so she can explain it in the best way from her perspective, for them to understand. They’ll still think she’s a dick but if there’s a way for them not to get upset about it then that’s the kindest thing all around. For that to happen they need to hear it from her.
3. Tell her this needs to be resolved between her and them BEFORE Sunday, THEN you can decide if you’re dropping off or not. Otherwise the argument becomes you’re refusing yo take them home… which is not the case at all and confuses the issue entirely.

With so many emotions running high don’t complicate things.

-You’ve tried to tell them (you shouldn’t have done). You’ve done nothing wrong and she’s bullying you and kids into feeling like you have.
-It’s her rule, she now needs to explain and own it (or else she’ll blame you for delivering the message wrong).
-SHE needs to resolve it with them before Sunday, especially as oldest are saying they don’t want to go.

BUT … DO THIS ON SATURDAY, not Friday, otherwise it will ruin more of your time together which is probably what she wants tbf.

She treated herself to a new Range Rover.
What a hypocrite.

You can change the way you communicate. You don’t need to talk to her, any information you need to pass on to her do through text, email or on a co parenting app. Don’t answer the phone, and don’t get out the car when you drop the kids off. If she comes to the door when she drops the kids off it can be tricky, just say something like thanks then close the door. If she comes in and won’t leave you need to change the location of the drop off. When she says can I have a word just say no, please use text, email or parenting app. Don’t engage with her.

No it’s not, my child will get more gifts with his Father and have a vastly different and happier Christmas creating amazing memories. I can’t give my child that, my child understands and appreciates each home in different ways - therefore the OP’s ex wife shouldn’t have concerns about disparity and inequality,

Totally agree that your ex is being unreasonable, but is there a middle way, maybe send back 4 gifts per child to match her ideology?

BTW ‘Life with Beans’ have raised a very tight knit, loving, wholesome family!

@As78 I am actually shocked at some posters on here giving you hard time and excusing your ex's behaviour!

She sounds batshit crazy, controlling, incredibly selfish and massively spiteful telling your kids they can't bring their presents home because you didn't follow her presents rule 😱😱 If she can afford an 80k Range Rover she can damn well afford to buy her kids some decent presents fuck me a box slime, pens and a goggles smacks of can't be arsed.

OP there isn't alot you can do about your ex banning the kids from taking their presents home but you should have made your ex tell the children since she made the rule. Sadly in years to come your ex will be a lonely woman who's children won't bother with her because they won't forget her hurtful and spiteful behaviour and if she realises that it'll be too late.

Just continue being supportive of your children and parent your way ignore your ex trying to dictate how you parent, when she brings it up simply reply what the kids do on my time is up to me and don't engage further put the phone down or ignore the text's.

You are the dream ex! I wish mine would pay my mortgage for me and leave me with enough space cash to buy a Range Rover 🤣

I don't think he should be a carrier pigeon or stir things yo

I hope your kids are OK on Sunday and understand what good care you’ll take of their gifts from you. Luckily they with have you to behave well and trying to keep it calm. At least they’ll know they’ll get them back on days with you.
Unfortunately I wonder if for celebrations to come you will have to consider ‘leave-at-one-house’-ability of gifts ie something that is not so everyday usage.

Ps if she screams and shouts at you that's abusive you can tell her you'll only communicate with her via email that's what I told my ex and it's so much nicer than having arguments or nasty calls or WhatsApp's

🤣🤣

So she's a hypocrite as well as the rest, it's ok for kids to go without but not adults. I can't stand people that think kids should put with behaviour an adult wouldn't. My XH doesn't wholesale ban things, but does every now and then decide the kids have too much stuff at his house and return things without even asking the kids what they want to keep at his. It makes them feel unwelcome and like it's not really their home when they can't even decide what they keep in their room. I understand not wanting to be overrun with stuff, but their not, so it's just shitty.

It is very sad, and ultimately pointless and unnecessary. I hope things can be calmed down somehow. Wishing you all the very best. These are not the sort of memories kids should be left with. I hope she can see some sense before it escalates and she alienates them.

You've done all you can really. You can only control what you do not what other people do. She can't control you buying gifts and you can't control her complaining. You can do boundaries which you've tried to set but you also need to follow through ie not reply to texts or hang up the phone if she tried to talk about it again after you tell her to please stop it.
She's entitled to not want lots of extra 'stuff' in her house but shelll have to enforce that herself with the kids you don't need to get involved in policing what they pack if it's her rule not yours.
Just ignore her, basically.

Have to say I'm Team Dad here too. My late Aunt once fell out with my dear late Nana, who went to see her before Christmas to make peace and when she arrived wouldn't let her cross the threshold, snatched the offered presents for my cousins out of her hands and put them straight in the bin before slamming the door.

This was in the 70s and my Nana wasn't exactly well off. She was so very hurt. There was no huge relevant back story, said Aunt was just incredibly difficult with everyone.

Ever since then I couldn't make things like this a battleground, life's too damn short and even though I loathed my exDH, I couldn't let that get in the way of happy times for my DS.

As a complete aside, and not really relevant - Fuck me, how much is a Range Rover???????!!!!!!!

Other than the Christmas stuff do you otherwise get on with her ok? Is she a good mum? If so I'd not choose this as a hill to die on. Just tell your kids that mum says to leave your toys here and they can play with them again when they come back. You can't force her to accept those things in her house anymore than she can force you not to buy them.

@As78 just keep the gifts at yours, as if they go to her house the will some how get damaged or broke just to be hateful, keep being you, you sound like a great dad 4 kids are lucky to have you.

Not really your place though? Your whole thread is her sticking her nose in on your Christmas yet hers is fair game to tear apart? I like her gift giving rules. I also like your fun ideas. Just accept you’ll have to look after the monkeys half the week.

You decided to buy the tech. It stays at yours.