Tired of the performative beggars and alcoholics this time of year

I took it to mean you are being unkind to get angry about having to see homeless people when you are not homeless yourself rather than a class thing tbh (that said remember the middle classes are not immune to abuse/dysfunction so you can’t assume their childhoods were “comfortable and loving” just because they had money)

I get very annoyed when people say 'check your privilege'- some of the people I have known in life who refused to sort themselves out or accept help 'but with conditions' actually came from very comfortable and loving family backgrounds- the idea it's only ever underprivileged people who get themselves into messes simply isn't true

I well remember a middle aged woman, employee in the supermarket where I was working at the time, saying to a fellow employee of about my age, ‘Be sure to put your name down for a house, love, in case you fall for a baby.’
This was in the early 70s. When I saw the girl in the town centre about a year later, she was pushing a pram.

I think you're probably right as there was a drive to get them off the streets and into hotels to safely socially distance.

@VegTrug Your anecdotes aren’t evidence. I’ve explained at length, as have many other posters, why addiction isn’t a ‘simple’ choice and I won’t be repeating again.

@PlastictreesOf course it’s a choice! I grew up with my late Dad who would now be called a functioning alcoholic, my brother is a full blown ‘cannot work because of it’ alcoholic, his son/my nephew is the same. As was his now deceased mother, both her parents, her sister & her brother. I’ve seen it and lived it. They ALL made progress at various points then said “fuck it” and started again. Right in front of us. Quite literally in my dad’s case and my brother. I’ve been there on numerous occasions when each of them has made the decision to drink again and it was very much a decision not a compulsion. Yet my nephew’s other auntie and myself have both made better decisions and what’d ya know? Not alcoholics! Funny that 🤨

Check your knowledge. Whilst yes, some are genuinely homeless, many of them are part of organised crime gangs. There’s 3 in my town who’ve been filmed parking up on a street outside the centre and then walking in with their sleeping bag, covering their face in dirt and sitting outside McDonald’s! Nothing could be done about it as they’re not committing a crime! So it continues. By all accounts, there’s some serious money to be made especially in December.

Have you not read any of my posts, you are so ignorant about addiction - I am a psychologist who has worked in addictions and homelessness for several years, why not educate yourself by reading my posts about the causes of addiction and how it isn’t a ‘choice’. Of course not though, you’ve no intent of shifting your perspective and just continue to spout judgemental nonsense. Your thinking is far too narrow minded and lacks nuance.

Don't some of you realise there are different forms of homelessness? I was homeless, but in a B&B hostel when I was 15. It was shit and horrible and I wouldn't wish it on my worst enemy. But I wasn't on the streets and, yes we had electricity and a kettle to make coffee with. But still technically homeless.

I'm very much of the stick and carrot system however those saying San Francisco is purely because of the liberal dream are wrong - it is partly because of the total lack of affordable housing and the fact the area is full of tech startups up money ( Silicon Valley) meaning an average 2 bed flat can easily be £4K a month. You are then in a viscious circle, people can't get homes so end up in a bad way , can't pay for health, lose jobs and drinking and drugs used to numb the crappiness of life in that situation- same in LA - people in these situations then gravitate to such places because support services are often better as it's not a 'hidden' problem - same to a much lesser extent applies in London etc

Giving to the charities and organisations not the individuals is the best way to help. We really do need to take the Portugal route where there is proper support but serious expectation that people will engage with that support. But we also need to lobby our MPs to prioritise funding for rehab it's far too patchy and inadequate.

Really homeless people I feel awful for.

We have a group of alcoholics near where I live and they take it turns to beg outside a local Sainsbury's. I was in my car and when one of then thought no one was looking, got his flash mobile phone out and then quickly hid it when someone passed.

Another one I fell for, several years ago, said he needed money for a place to stay for the night. He was telling us how he was ex forces and now was homeless. Me and my friend gave him all of the change I had. It wasn't a small amount either. I felt so awful for him...

Until my partner saw him in one of the local shops one day, doing his weekly shopping along with instant coffee.... don't you need electricity and a kettle for that. I was pretty upset.

And the reason I am upset is that these fraudsters are literally stealing from homeless people. Taking money from them by acting shameful.

I only ever give food and drinks now. I can usually tell who are the genuine homeless now in our city and I feel soon much for them.

This is very true, hostels understandably have rule about behaviour and people will be thrown out if they breach those rules and then it is back on the streets. The same applies to supported accommodation, if you breach the tenancy rules then you will be evicted. There is a supported house on my street which has been the source of a lot of problems, fighting, drug dealing, drunk tenants harassing people in the streets. We had to keep an "anti-social behaviour diary" and report back to the organisation who ran the house. They did act and evicct several groups of tenants who i guess went back to the streets or the night shelter. It is a very complex issue, on the one hand I understand that people have deep seated problems which are more than likely rooted in trauma but on the other it is horrible living alongside of such behaviours. There is school on my street and children were exposed to drug dealing and fighting, not acceptable in my view

I hope you made it clear that that is utterly reprehensible.

And just because one student is totally lacking in morality doesn't mean you should assume everyone is a con artist.

Begging should be criminalised

It is criminalised though. It’s illegal.

You're really so dumb to think anyone uses their real names to post here?

I have sympathy but the solution of just leave them on the street is all wrong.

Begging should be criminalised, rough sleepers should always have access to shelter, rehab facilities are needed for addicts and better mental health provision. But put that in place and it stops most of it. This soft on crime/ASB mentality is detrimental to addicts and everyone else.

It's not about hating on people, it's hating what's becoming of our town centres, rather than dealing with the problem.

But to become a drug addict don’t they chose to take the substance in the first instance? That usage spirals as a result of addiction, again all down to the user so this concept that they’re not to blame for their actions makes no logical sense

Taking a substance doesn’t automatically make you addicted to it though. You don’t see everyone who drinks end up an alcoholic or everyone who is given Morphine ending up on Methadone.

Are you really spending your Christmas Eve just aimlessly hating homeless people, drug users and alcoholics?

If someone ends up in a shop doorway taking spice, they’re probably not okay. Somethings gone wrong somewhere.

What a mad time of year to have absolutely no sympathy to that.

No, I used to work in homeless hostels. The vast majority are “wet” hostels.

Addiction isn't always related to trauma. I think addiction is also a cultural issue. If drugs and alcohol are commonplace in the community you live amongst then you are receiving the exposure and are far more likely to experiment and see taking those substances as the norm growing up. This is one of the reasons that addiction is more prevalent amongst the poorer sectors of society where it is more socially acceptable to drink and use drugs. Of course, there are addicts in all walks of life, and often it is hidden amongst the middle classes as they have more money and support around them so less likely to end up homeless as a result. What starts as 'liking a drink' or having a smoke can over time can turn into an addiction.

Someone I know ended up homeless as a result of alcohol abuse- someone from a loving family, married with a beautiful wife, children and a good job and beautiful house. Over the years his love of a 'a few beers' on an evening spiralled out of control, leading to a bottle of vodka a night, eventually losing his job, losing his wife and family who all tried to help and ending up with him sofa surfing. The support was there but the drink was more powerful- he checked himself out of rehab and couldn't stick at it

This is exactly how it should be dealt with. The more this is tolerated the more we get the tent cities of California and other Democrat ridden shitholes.

San Fran is just the natural evolution of the Liberal dream.

The problem is we're so soft. Portugal may have the right approach, you have to give the incentive, but get these people off the street one way or another.

Isn't this part of the thread though. People being sick of seeing it on the streets is also people being sick of lack of government response to provide services and spaces for homeless addicts/mentally ill. If everyone says, 'ah, it's okay, these people are desperate and have been let down so they can continue to do what they want, where they want' the local authorities and government will happily continue to spend money elsewhere.

Lines have to be drawn. Will it be okay for them to set up their tents and take drugs inside the shops, or on your house doorstep? If not, why not?