Men who quit their jobs to avoid CM payments...

I agree that enabling this pathetic behaviour is deeply problematic. I believe many of these men are seasoned manipulators, gaslighters and liars.

ExH gets handouts from his parent and lives off gf. Has been on benefits much of the time or worked for low wage as doesn’t need income. You can get as many gifts as you like without affecting CM or UC as long as spend them quickly. I can only assume his gf doesn’t know the truth or is really desperate not to be single as she could do a lot better. It’s cost him respect of dc - it’s a running joke how he never pays for anything when they see him.

Naturally. Women are blamed for everything.

The problem in the UK isn’t the powers that CMS have - they have all they need - it’s the lack of political will to use them.

When you consider how the current system is set up for RPs on benefits it’s very very very telling.

Previously if the RP was on benefits then they were only allowed to have £20 a week in maintenance and the rest of the calculation was owed to the Sec of State to go toward the welfare bill.

The debt owed to the SoS got bigger and bigger and bigger and there were so many non-paying NRP’s that it was decided that something must simply be done…

…so they decided RPs on benefits could keep all the maintenance. All that maintenance that they know isn’t being paid…

That this was the ‘solution’ and that is has never changed since tells you everything about political attitudes to CMS in the Uk.

This. Yet the men refuse to believe they are the problem (often boast about it in the pub) and would rather blame immigrants and mothers themselves.

I completely agree with this. I couldn’t respect a man who behaved in such a pathetic manner, unbelievable that other women go on to have more children with these specimens. Then again I’m sure men like this create a narrative whereby they are the victim somehow, and leave out the part where they are failing their child by not even providing the bare minimum for them financially.

It's the "Black Economy" which includes undeclared cash in hand work (also evading tax and NIC), self employment not declaring all income (evading tax, nic and VAT), and probably benefit fraud too, i.e. claiming benefits based on low declared earnings (if any). It's an epidemic and costing the Taxpayer billions.

I am surprised there's not a Netflix drama, about a hit squad going around dealing with non-paying partners! Could be a Lock, Stock / Black Angels / Surburban Shootout type black comedy, with a social commentary.

I know this is a serious issue, I can see that raising the issue as a drama might inspire someone, somewhere, to look seriously at this problem and deal with it!

My daughter is nearly 40 so I was dealing with the CSA in 1990s and from what I have read nothing has changed in that time.
It took me nine years to get any maintenance (£6 a week), when my daughter turned 18 the CSA had the bloody cheek to ring and ask if I still wanted them to collect the money owed ( yes I did).
It’s the same old story, feckless useless fathers doing what the hell they like, walking away from their children and their responsibility.
Society blaming the mothers, who are taking the responsibility, and then vilifying them if they dare to wear nail polish or have a phone.
Its bollocks, absolute bollocks.

Sounds like we could learn fron US and Oz systems

I am a kinship carer. The lengths my gs's dad went to to avoid child support was unreal.

Firstly he went self employed. The company he worked for were advertising jobs at £50,000 yet his books showed earnings of £12,000 doing the same job. The CMS were actually satisfied with this stating he now had a nil contribution.

After CMS took out liability orders for longstanding arrears he even transferred his house into his parents names and hid his car at another address.

It was only after the financial investigation team asked for financial evidence going back years that he panicked and paid a lump sum. I then closed the case as it was too stressful. It took me years to get to the fraud team.

Such a sad, pathetic loser.

He had plenty of money, he could afford to support his child. they set his payments at £0.

This is why removing passports and driving license is so effective because it does affect the whole 2nd family.

I have seen this happen with a close family member. She divorced him, he tried everything not to pay CM. He was a high earner so when it went to court she got a lot but he kept dwindling it down. He eventually 'lost' his high paying job, now has 2 other children with his new wife and claims he cant afford to pay CM.

He is a scumbag but his new wife has enabled his behaviour. His children are his responsibility 100% but i will never understand why some women enable men to do this. Some of the things i have seen and heard make some women as bad as men when it comes to avoiding CM. As long as it doesnt affect them!

I’ll try and find a document later, there is a really good one out there.

The two I queried were that no mention was made that they can take payments from their bank account without a court order. Either a one off or a regular payment.
And the other was having a charge put on their house so that if they came to sell they’d have to deal with the debt - that’s what happened to my ex and he was livid. The trainer had never heard of it, and was adamant a court order was necessary for bank account “raids” (I always found that word very telling”.

The other thing that infuriates me about them is that people have the right not to have the debt wiped (unless it’s under £10 or something small). Legally you can insist it stays there. I dealt with two cases where historic debt was being paid (by very angry men) from inheritances they’d received (technically from selling houses they’d inherited). And one case where the man who owed thousands had died and made a will leaving everything to his new-ish girlfriend (nothing for his children) and the debt meant his ex got a substantial sum from his estate before it was paid out to the GF. Meaning her children at least got something.

This is what I am hoping comes out of the banks updating the personal information at the moment on income. It should be used to catch the guys making women and children reliant on the state in so many cases. It will be interesting to see if they do anything with their information that can actually help society.

Bit late for us - he has since split with ex (sorry love but you should have seen that coming) and is off abroad with the savings he got tax free from fiddling the books to avoid childcare here. HMRC should start by looking at all the SE fathers IMO.

I’ve read a few on here eg changing jobs every time CMS catch up with them. It takes a few months each time so employer can say that he doesn’t work there any more.

The shocking ones are the ones who use the system to claim that they earn like £150pw but somehow raised a mortgage for hundreds of thousands 🤔 , car finance for tens of thousands 🤔 or go on holidays costing thousands 🤔 Why on earth doesn’t CMS use the same data as private companies like banks ?

Think this is brilliant. It is outrageous that families face such jeopardy when absent fathers do not pay.

I know it’s rough but surely if we advocate for men having to pay the right amount, then returning a wrongly paid amount is also fair?

My oldest DC is now 25 so I dealt with the CSA. When I opened a case with them to try to get maintenance from my x they set a regular payment of £250 a month while they investigated. It took them a year to investigate and find that he didn’t, in fact, have enough income to pay maintenance (self employed, cash in hand, same story). The CSA then demand that I pay him back all the maintenance that he had paid that year that they investigated. I refused point blank. They hounded me for three years demanding the return of the money.
years later they wrote and apologised for their error and confirmed that I did not have to return the money. I still have that letter, just in case!

My ex stole thousands of pounds off his mates then moved abroad. He'd told everyone that money was for me, that I was demanding I pay child support; so they all came after me for repayment. It was a very bad time in my life.

He Would be getting a baseball bat through his windscreen every week until he paid.

Initially he would change jobs every few months to dodge the collect from pay order so racked up thousands in owed cms. Then quit working to stay at home with his new girlfriends kids, not even ones he fathered. When she caught on and left him, he did cash in hand at bars. Now he sporadically claims UC, i get £29 a few months a year, the thousands owed doesnt ever get touched. Its been 10 years, ive received less than £200 in total for our 3 children.