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DS upset at library removal of books

246 replies

Scallybatch · 13/12/2024 21:12

Went into my local library today with DS, only to be told they have removed all Tin Tin and Asterix books! He was really upset as these are his favourite books!. All the lady could tell me is that they had been told to as they upset some people. I'm baffled. Would I be unreasonable to complain?

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8
Alalalala · 16/12/2024 01:16

Shame. Asterix books are amazing. Educational too.

GoldsolesLugs · 16/12/2024 01:13

It's not censorship not to have something in a library. They have "The Times", they don't have nak mags for obvious reasons. It's so "first world problems" to get one's tit in a mangel over this - you don't know you're born. If you had been born in one of the soviet countries before 1989 then you'd know what censorship is.

JessaWoo · 16/12/2024 00:24

@Dappy777

I'm 100% against ANY censorship. If you believe people should be free, then they should be free...not free only to express the same opinions as you.

Isn't it more of a right-wing thing rather than 'woke' to ban books? (Eg: Florida for their list of over 700 books banned from school libraries.) If you're for the concept of freedom, shouldn't the children of Florida be able to access these texts?

https://www.fldoe.org/file/5574/2324-SDRPS-100628-2.pdf

ArtfulBee · 15/12/2024 23:57

NotVeryFunny · 15/12/2024 23:21

Wow. Not sure where you are getting that I’m a selfish cunt from. And not sure the personal attack really necessary. And if you are going to swear have some gumption and do it properly. The asterisks aren’t necessary, everyone knows what the word is.

I'm not the PP but I do think your position here is self-centred.

It's one thing for you, an adult, to be fine with the existence and availability of racist literature. It's another thing to think that material of that sort should be promoted to children (of all backgrounds) in the children's section of a public library. That basically makes the public library an unsafe space for certain children, based on their ethnicity.

steff13 · 15/12/2024 23:47

Mama2many73 · 15/12/2024 12:01

Mr men books banned in America?
Why?

They're not. The United States is made up of 50 individual states. There is no book that is banned in all 50 states. In the state I live in there are no books that are banned at all.

NotVeryFunny · 15/12/2024 23:21

MumWifeOther · 15/12/2024 12:55

You could have just said you’re a selfish c*nt and saved yourself the essay 🙄

Edited

Wow. Not sure where you are getting that I’m a selfish cunt from. And not sure the personal attack really necessary. And if you are going to swear have some gumption and do it properly. The asterisks aren’t necessary, everyone knows what the word is.

ArtfulBee · 15/12/2024 16:16

Mama2many73 · 15/12/2024 12:01

Mr men books banned in America?
Why?

They aren't. They are very popular there.

They weren't released there until the late 90s so that's probably why Americans could only get them in the UK.

dynamiccactus · 15/12/2024 14:52

Don't assume it was a council decision, when I worked in a library we did "weeding" of the collection ourselves. Sometimes it was just because they didn't get borrowed very often and were taking up the space on the shelves that more popular books could have.

But in this case it does sound like it was someone deciding on behalf of others what they should be offended by.

Needmorelego · 15/12/2024 14:32

@CurlewKate I had always heard of Little Black Sambo but never actually knew the story so I just googled it.
It seems it's the original title and illustrations that were (and clearly are) considered racist.
The actual plot seems fine.
Apparently there are modern versions where the title, illustrations and character names have been changed - but the plot remains.
I would find it highly unlikely that a library would have a copy "behind the counter" as the original versions are long out of print.

DS upset at library removal of books
CurlewKate · 15/12/2024 14:06

Love the idea of racist books being "behind the counter" in the library so that people like Richard Tice can get Little Black Sambo out in a plain wrapper to read to his children at bed time....

Needmorelego · 15/12/2024 13:02

Mr Men, TinTin and Asterix all available for sale on the Barnes and Noble website in the USA.
I assume individual schools/libraries can "ban" them they aren't banned banned in the USA.

Needmorelego · 15/12/2024 12:57

@Mama2many73 I don't think the Mr Men books are banned in America.
The TV from about 15 years ago was a US/UK production and shown on the Cartoon Network in the USA.
Out of curiosity I'm going to look on Barnes and Noble website.

MumWifeOther · 15/12/2024 12:55

NotVeryFunny · 15/12/2024 00:09

Oh you are one of those people, who try to shut people up by throwing the word “privilege” around and I can see you have a similar mindset to the book banners. Interesting. Maybe something for you to reflect on, especially as book banning is strongly associated with authoritarianism, for obvious reasons, and why it’s so problematic.

The point you have made is, in any case, irrelevant. I am ethically opposed to book banning regardless of whether I am personally depicted in a derogatory way or not. And banning books to avoiding hurting people’s feelings is a very dangerous slippery slope to go down. I’m not going to share my ethnic background with you as it’s none of your business and, as I said, irrelevant to the discussion.

You could have just said you’re a selfish c*nt and saved yourself the essay 🙄

Mama2many73 · 15/12/2024 12:01

user1494050295 · 13/12/2024 21:31

It’s bull shit. I used to work for Waterstones and the Americans had to buy their tin tins etc in the uk. Same as the mr men series. I would strongly complain.

Mr men books banned in America?
Why?

PinkFrogss · 15/12/2024 11:55

NotVeryFunny · 15/12/2024 00:09

Oh you are one of those people, who try to shut people up by throwing the word “privilege” around and I can see you have a similar mindset to the book banners. Interesting. Maybe something for you to reflect on, especially as book banning is strongly associated with authoritarianism, for obvious reasons, and why it’s so problematic.

The point you have made is, in any case, irrelevant. I am ethically opposed to book banning regardless of whether I am personally depicted in a derogatory way or not. And banning books to avoiding hurting people’s feelings is a very dangerous slippery slope to go down. I’m not going to share my ethnic background with you as it’s none of your business and, as I said, irrelevant to the discussion.

You just think any and every book should be available in the children’s section?

There are definitely some books that are inappropriate for children, and if our understand of that changes over time then of course libraries should update their collection accordingly.

Theres been some other threads on MN in the FWR section recently about some inappropriate children’s books that are available in libraries, with posters pointing out why they shouldn’t be, and many (including myself) have agreed with them.

ArtfulBee · 15/12/2024 03:42

NotVeryFunny · 15/12/2024 00:09

Oh you are one of those people, who try to shut people up by throwing the word “privilege” around and I can see you have a similar mindset to the book banners. Interesting. Maybe something for you to reflect on, especially as book banning is strongly associated with authoritarianism, for obvious reasons, and why it’s so problematic.

The point you have made is, in any case, irrelevant. I am ethically opposed to book banning regardless of whether I am personally depicted in a derogatory way or not. And banning books to avoiding hurting people’s feelings is a very dangerous slippery slope to go down. I’m not going to share my ethnic background with you as it’s none of your business and, as I said, irrelevant to the discussion.

Surely you draw a line at what is appropriate for children somewhere?

And do you genuinely consider not keeping something on display in the children's section "banning"?

NotVeryFunny · 15/12/2024 00:09

MumWifeOther · 14/12/2024 18:11

What race are you out of interest? If it’s not you depicted in a racist / stereotypical / derogatory way, then perhaps you should recognise that privilege and respect others’ feelings.

Oh you are one of those people, who try to shut people up by throwing the word “privilege” around and I can see you have a similar mindset to the book banners. Interesting. Maybe something for you to reflect on, especially as book banning is strongly associated with authoritarianism, for obvious reasons, and why it’s so problematic.

The point you have made is, in any case, irrelevant. I am ethically opposed to book banning regardless of whether I am personally depicted in a derogatory way or not. And banning books to avoiding hurting people’s feelings is a very dangerous slippery slope to go down. I’m not going to share my ethnic background with you as it’s none of your business and, as I said, irrelevant to the discussion.

TempestTost · 14/12/2024 23:19

ArtfulBee · 14/12/2024 23:16

To be fair, I'm inclined to agree a blanket removal is overboard; I suspect laziness.

Maybe.

Or they might have taken them all for review. I sent up one book we received a complaint about for review a few months ago and haven't seen it since - it's still sitting on someone's desk.

ArtfulBee · 14/12/2024 23:16

TempestTost · 14/12/2024 23:12

Yes, in some cases having books like that on reserve would make sense. But not the whole of Asterix or TinTin, it's not justified and I doubt their collection policy says they have to remove every part of the series because one is no longer in the open stacks.

To be fair, I'm inclined to agree a blanket removal is overboard; I suspect laziness.

Nikitaspearlearring · 14/12/2024 23:15

Fannyfiggs · 14/12/2024 07:52

What did they do?

I don't remember the Britons going into battle but I do remember they had prim ladies drinking hot water out of china teacups (with their little finger in the air) and saying how delicious and refreshing it was (before tea had been brought here).

YourTurnForTheTree · 14/12/2024 23:13

ArtfulBee · 14/12/2024 23:11

They are an frequent poster and it was definitely a joke.

Ah ok. I am afraid I don’t know the regular posters on here. Thanks.

TempestTost · 14/12/2024 23:12

ArtfulBee · 14/12/2024 22:49

You don't think that having them available for reserve, rather than leaving racially offensive material in the children's section, is reasonable?

Is there anything you believe would not be appropriate to stock, on shelves, in the children's section?

Edited

Yes, in some cases having books like that on reserve would make sense. But not the whole of Asterix or TinTin, it's not justified and I doubt their collection policy says they have to remove every part of the series because one is no longer in the open stacks.

ArtfulBee · 14/12/2024 23:11

YourTurnForTheTree · 14/12/2024 23:05

Maybe. I hope so.

They are an frequent poster and it was definitely a joke.

TempestTost · 14/12/2024 23:06

Abookperson · 13/12/2024 21:55

I would like to highlight this comment as it is an accurate description of library processes.

No need to jump to the assumption of 'censorship'. The library profession is strongly anti-censorship.

I'm not sure I agree about the library profession being anti-censorship. They think they are, certainly.They love to promote Banned Book Clubs and Freedom to Read week.

But the profession as whole,or at least the public side, is quite extreme in terms of its political imbalance. Even in some cases to the point that you see organizations like the American Library Association explicitly becoming involved in a partisan political way.

But there are some very weird blind spots when it comes to things that offend their own political sensibilities, which a lot weirdly assume are somehow neutral.

What I see though is they don't try and "censor" the books like this directly. Instead they refuse to purchase, or weed them, on the grounds that they are unscientific or contain incorrect information or - ironically - are politically biased.

The weirdest one I ever saw was a librarian on Reddit saying he would not accept a donation of Bibles from someone - not because they didn't need them (which tends to be the case unless they are unusual) but because the individual had not also offered to give other religious texts "for balance". In truth, he was bigoted toward Christians, was the real reason.

That kind of thing goes under the radar though and can't be challenged ascensorship.