To baby my teenage sons?

I've been thinking that when they are ready to leave I can at least help them prepare at that time?
Like a week-long crash course in Adulting? No, that won’t work. I don’t even see it happening.

A huge part of living independently is seeing what needs doing and doing it. Whether that’s paying a bill or putting the bins out at the right time (and get them in again), or remembering that the laundry isn’t done until the clothes are dry and put at least approximately away. The skills themselves are easy enough to learn, but it’s the mental load of building the jobs into your daily life that’s the hard bit and it’s that which so many men don’t seem to see as their job, and which drives so many women to despair. All teens need to start practising this planning process early on or it will be a huge shock when they leave home, or will become their partner’s problem which I imagine is the last thing you want. They need to be managers of their lives, not just wait to be told what to do or assume it will be done even if not by them.

english.emmaclit.com/2017/05/20/you-shouldve-asked/

So they have asked you to do something, you refuse so all you care about is your needs not theirs?

It is not all about you, future MiL or not you don't really care about them anyway.

You need to separate showing love and care from doing chores. You can still plan a special day out for them, cook a favourite meal, listen to their stresses, without doing all their donkey work.

I do think kids can grow up entitled if they have someone in the background constantly smoothing their way. I think kids need to experience frustrating and annoying little things, to be able to build up a tolerance for that and an ability to cope.

I don’t have teens yet but I’m guessing you can love and nurture them and be their safe base without doing everything for them.

Be their shoulder to cry on, the person they trust the most, spoil them now and again and embarrass them with hugs and some of the little things they liked as kids and pretend they don’t now.

But you’d be doing them a disservice if you didn’t allow them to do basic life skills on their own like managing their money/budget, cooking, housework, travel, navigating relationships, and problem solving their own lives. You may also be causing problems for their future partner. Yes adults are responsible for their own decisions, but we are very much influenced by the blueprint our parents gave us whether we are aware of it or not. Do you really want to raise men who expect their partners to do everything including carrying the emotional load? Cos that’s what will happen.

Op, actions speak louder than words. You can tell them that it's going to be their responsibility to do all the things you do for them but you'll then set them out into a world where they have no idea how to do these things. It sounds like you're acting based on your own childhood trauma, and have gone too far the other way.
But you need to stop. It sounds like you're raising lovely boys who I have no doubt might try to pull their weight in a relationship / marriage but they'd have to work massively hard to do it as they just won't "see" the pile of laundry, plates on the side etc etc

@IamFineIamFINE
This isn’t how to love your children. This isn’t love. It’s a form of codependency.

I think it’s time for you to stop, OP.

You might be verbally telling your sons that when they have a house partner, they’ll need to share house chores equally, and they might even follow through. But telling is not the same as showing. Actions speak louder than words.

By doing chores for them, you’re also teaching them (unintentionally) that a "good mom" takes care of her sons responsibilities indefinitely. This could set the expectation that when they become parents, their partners should do the same because that’s what "good moms" do, right?

You say you enjoy looking after teenage sons (=doing chores) , but do you really? Wouldn’t you enjoy to spend this time in something else more, like reading, taking a walk, pole dancing, whatever?

Show them that women have their own needs, interests, and lives beyond serving others. Taking care of yourself isn’t selfish. It’s necessary and an important example to set for your children.

I literally had this conversation with my almost 13 year old yesterday who, as well as being the only boy, is also the youngest sibling.
He had said to his sister "if you get xx Christmas present, I'll give you some money. You know them better."
I jumped very hard on that saying he will not grow up to expect the women in his life to do the heavy lifting at Christmas.
Part of our job in loving our children is to prepare them to be adults.
Doing things is nice. I changed everyone's beds the other day because I wanted to do something for them. BUT can they do it themselves? And is it expected normally? Damned right it is.

I manage too many men children who expect me to be their replacement mummy and I will NOT raise one.
You owe it to your sons to let them be adults - and look after you too!
(Off to message said 12 year old to bring me a cuppa in bed....)

Habits established in childhood are really hard for people to break in adulthood and that’s why responsible parents don’t just cave to their children’s preferences for a quite life or to be “nice”, they recognise they have a huge responsibility in helping their child establish good health and habits for a successful and happy life.

Would you think parents who weaned their children onto unlimited access to UPFs including sweets and fizzy drinks and who had a generously stocked “treat” cupboard their obese children could access at will were “kind”? Do you think when those children leave home they can switch off a habit like a switch because it’s their responsibility? What about screen time? Do you think that children who have eaten in front of tablets for 16 years and only fall asleep in front of screens can just decide to have good sleep hygiene the day they hit 18?

Your sons haven’t been allowed to develop the habits of cleaning up after themselves and maintaining a home. They don’t know the work involved and haven’t exercised that ability to make and maintain a mental list that means they (future children of theirs too) don’t miss football because they’ve no clean kit, run out of clean clothes, go hungry etc. etc. I wouldn’t expect teenagers to to an equal amount of this as their parents but they should be doing some and they should definitely be putting their own plate away, washing cups and glasses and not leaving them around the house.

Thank heavens their father takes a different view and they don’t seem ruined yet, but you need to listen to them and let them fully develop, not baby them for your own psychological reasons.

I have had 3 long term relationships and all 3 have been brilliant at doing their share of housework etc without being asked. All 3 have the same in common, mums who believed in teaching their son to be as independent as possible and men who could iron, wash, cook, clean. I was grateful to all their mothers. I am still married to one one of the men.

Tbh you sound like you’re going to be one of those MILs from hell in years to come. Your future DILs will be writing on mumsnet about their overbearing MIL.

Omg. Feel like you're my mother in law. My husband still struggles to remember to clear his own plate or notice that the laundry basket is overflowing because his Mum did everything for him.

You're 100% babying them, even the way you call them boys, if they're late teens like you said then that makes them ADULT MEN.

Please stop this

This. My mum was like this with me. It didn’t make me feel loved and protected, it made me feel incompetent, pathetic, and guilty.

My eldest also said he doesn't want to be a man child when I took his plate through for him.

Well, take the hint!

Loving and supporting your teenage sons, being involved, available and caring is all fabulous.
Being their support human and teaching them that life comes with a permanent set of clean, folded clothes, cooked meals, and the washing up does itself - terrible idea.

Stop infantalising your boys because it makes you feel nice. They're even asking you not to.

Part of being a mother is teaching them life skills so they don't go out there a liability to themselves and future partners.

Watch a lioness feed her cubs, then teach them to hunt successfully - then let them go off with their survival skills to repeat the cycle.

Their father seems to understand this and is getting on with it. I agree they probably prefer being treated as and feeling like young men over being babied.

And their poor future wives. (Assumptions, I know). So many threads here from women exasperated by men helplessly saying they 'don't know how' to do this or that, or don't know where anything goes, or appear utterly oblivious of a loo that needs cleaning or dishes that need washing because the domestic appliance has always swooped in.

And will you be also swooping in when you think their partners aren't doing it as you would?

Cue the MIL issue posts here ...

Come on, OP. This is all about you, not about what they actually need.

It's very hard to let go but you really need to. Your sons need to be able to function on their own without Mum or a partner. If they move out and share a house with others, their housemates aren't going to baby them. Do it gradually but do it, before you turn into a martyr mum.

You sound like a lovely, caring Mum- but this can be a slippery slope. An ex I was with (when we were both mid 20s) was completely incompetent in all household tasks and it was so off putting. And in some of the examples you use like putting a wash on or being able to cook a simple meal for himself. Please teach them these basic life skills

From what you clearly felt abandoned and did not feel loved by your parents (and thats absoloutly nothing to do with being expected to act like an adult at adult age, I assume if you dig deeper theres probably some other cause you are misappropriating onto 'flying the nest') and as such you have filled the void with your love for your children.

Loving your children is great but part of it is letting them develop freedom and relationships away from you, babying them is a toxic way to block that.

This childhood issues seemingly has led you to become quite severely co-dependant on your children. That is not healthy especially as the children want to grow normally so it isn't reciprocated but rather burdensome.

I worry you will not cope once they fly the nest and I would serious suggest a bit of therapy to get down to the route cause of you abandonment issue and I would strongly recommend you either work on your ability to be alone or start looking for another relationship to pour your love into (romantic or even a pet) so that when you boys do fly you already have something else in place to distract that void you will feel.

Your children will always love you even as they move on to relationships and families of their own but the tighter you hold the MORE they will pull away and distance and it could negatively affect their happiness. Just because they grow does not mean they will abandon you just that your relationship is changing, they will always still be your children just not your 'babies'.

I know you say you would take your son's in for being a useless partner. But why would you set them up for that to happen?
Why would you want them to never fly the nest or be kicked out from the family they created all because they are incapable of being a functioning adult.

My DHs mum refused to allow her kids to do anything. She was devastated when DH moved out. Her older child 40s lives like a teenager still at home. My DH and I had a very rocky start and I mothered him pretty much the whole way. It was a much harder and rockier start than it needed to be.

I want my kid to flourish in life so I am helping teach them all I know, so when it is time for them to fly they will succeed.

God I hate cryptic examples is it so unique he's the only man who does it? .....he wouldn't be renovating the house "for you" unless he didn't live in it .....and most skills can be learned.
Im imagining him coming home and going out to harvest the garden as your self sufficient and him doing farming all night whilst you luxuriate on the sofa as he does so much more than you.

But if you're not around things will go full circle. If by then they've come to expect it to be done for them they won't listen. Why do you feel love can only be shown by encouraging children to be helpless and lazy? Love is teaching and preparing for a full life and independence.

Some of my favourite people are teenage boys. They can be incredibly sweet and kind.

I think it’s fine to do lots of things for them. But let them do some things for you too. It will make them feel good about themselves, and it’s good for you too. It’s great that they’re aware of the dynamics: that’s really promising.

(From the mother of a 19 year old who is in my phone contacts as ‘precious baby boy’ and also makes my tea every Saturday.)

Just to add- he was travelling all over the country to watch his beloved football team at away games from the age of 16, sometimes on his own ( on a club coach ) and has been on more holidays with his friends than I can remember, it’s just at home there is a problem as I’ve always done everything for him.

Op don’t make the same mistakes as me. I have a 21 year old ds and a 13 year old dd. He was an only child for 8 years and was spoilt rotten and I’ve mollycoddled him ( mostly without realising ) because he’s autistic and struggles with executive functioning etc and has anxiety and ocd. It has been the worst thing I could have done to help him because when he went away to university he couldn’t do a thing and massively struggled. I ended up there more times than I could count cleaning his en-suite and sorting his stuff out and then I took a step back and it all fell apart. He lasted 6 months.

I feel terrible guilt over how I’ve handled his independence, his best friend is totally different and has been cooking for himself for years and can use a washing machine and can lay wooden floors/paint/you get the picture. His mum made him learn these things and they’re like chalk and cheese.

my dd has been taught to cook from as soon as she showed interest and loves to help out around the house. I’ve seen what happens when you do too much and it backfires. I’m trying so hard with him now to make so much more independent, for him more than anyone.