Or is this Santa post unreasonable?

One of my earliest memories is of how gutted I was to find out it wasn’t real… Found out because my older brother was irate at being lied too…

My older two must have loved the magic as they are the ones who want to do bits for their little brother. The elf has been retired tho!

It's just too earnest isn't it. Where's the fun and spontaneity?

I am not a gentle parent but my child was afraid of Santa so I didn’t bother pretending he was real from a very young age (4/5) as it wasn’t magical it was scary. My child actually understood that it was important to allow their younger sibling to believe in the magic - they enjoyed the magic of Santa, and they never ruined it for them which was very sweet. My young child worked it out about age 9 or 10 and it wasn’t a big deal.

my older child still had fun at Xmas she just never sat on santas knee and was terrified of a big strange man so it was fun unless it was Santa related 😂

I mean, he wasn't wrong was he?

If parents choose to do the whole "Santa" thing they can't expect the entire world to keep up the lie for them.

@BusySyllabub yes - but it can still be fun without telling your children to believe that a fat man really does deliver presents by climbing down your chimney. That's my point.

You don't need to believe to have the magic.

He wasn’t wrong though 🤷‍♀️ It’s not down to other children to maintain the belief of their classmates in someone who doesn’t exist.

@Sometimeswinning because it's part of the fun?

I knew my dad ate the mince pie and drank the sherry and that the carrot went back in the cupboard to be used for Christmas dinner - but that still didn't mean it wasn't a fun tradition on Christmas Eve.

It doesn't make my point moot at all - which was that you can still do all the fun stuff without telling your kids that Santa is real - it doesn't ruin Christmas!

Why were you leaving a plate out for Santa if you didn’t believe? It obviously helped put a bit of magic into your Christmas. So it kind of makes your last sentence on the matter a moot point.

I think if a child is old enough to ask a question they are old enough to deserve an honest answer. So, although, I would start with the Santa Father Christmas story I wouldn't continue once the child starts querying it themselves. The 'magic' can still continue knowing it's make believe.

I have a friend who talks along those lines. All well and good until her pursed lipped 5 year old at a christmas party for other 5 years old drew himself up and said disapprovingly; 'My mum says Santa isn't real and it is wrong for mummies and daddies to lie to children'.

I'll leave it to you to imagine how that went down with about 30 5 year olds and their parents in real time.

To this day my mother refuses to admit Father Christmas isn’t real, so that’s one way of solving the problem. She still stopped doing stockings when we were early teens “because I can’t be bothered”. OK, then, if you’re doing it does that mean there’s no Father Christmas? “Oh, no, of course he’s real” – in the most arch workyticket voice imaginable. Infuriating! But hilarious.

Anyway I think you’d have to be predisposed to being a bit barking to be traumatised by this. Equally I think it’s barking to go all-out with faking him, doing elf on the shelf, etc. Just sort a stocking and that’s that. Don’t pretend stuff under the tree is from him either, which I always think is a bit shit - you’ve done all the effort of choosing, buying, wrapping to give the credit to a made-up man? Why?

We also refuse to play the “naughty or nice” game, saying in our house, Father Christmas comes along regardless, he doesn’t really keep a list, that’s just something some grownups say to stop their goblins drawing on the furniture.

I fully subscribed to SOS’s gentle sleep bollocks with my firstborn and had horrendous sleep-deprivation PND. Second child I saw through her guff and we’re all a lot happier. I don’t think she likes women, really. If she did she’d help us sleep.

I never believed in Father Christmas but that didn't mean there was no magic. We still left a mince pie, sherry and a carrot. We still did stockings. I still couldn't wait to get up and open presents.

If you need a mythical fat man to make your day special then I think something's going a bit wrong, tbh.

It’s the difference between playing it as a game where everyone knows he’s not real vs wanting your children to have literal belief he’s real. My siblings and I are all in our thirties and still get a stocking, and we all shout down my dad when he says ‘ooh, where did you get XYZ Jane’ to my dad because clearly the stocking gifts are from Father Christmas! But no-one has had any kind of literal belief for about 25 years. The whole ‘if you don’t believe, you don’t get any presents’ just seems a way for parents to be able to get their children to play along for a few extra years for the parents’ benefits regardless of what the kids are thinking about it. I don’t think it’s harmful though, and lots of children are told similar.

I intend when they start questioning it to say that if you don’t believe he doesn’t bring presents - does that count as embracing the myth or saying he’s real?

It counts as bordering on emotional blackmail, in my book, especially if you have a child who's likely to take that sort of pronouncement seriously.

😆

Yes but also no wars have been started by believing in the big red guy.

My mum never told me Santa was real so I never believed but I had the most magical, fantastic Christmas’. I’m still a huge Xmas fan and would put decs up in August if I could. I don’t think I could’ve loved it more than I did. My 5 yo does believe however because DH thought it would be nice.

I’ve read her post and I don’t really get it (maybe I’m tired) as really what’s the difference between “embracing the myth” and telling them he’s real? How did she both embrace the myth and answer their questions? I’ve never used the words he’s real and I intend when they start questioning it to say that if you don’t believe he doesn’t bring presents - does that count as embracing the myth or saying he’s real?

Hoping the kid doesn't ruin all her little friends' parents' Christmases.

I find it interesting that you're talking about the parents' Christmases being ruined here. Because this is what the intense investment in 'the magic' seems to be about, to me - the parents. Children, by and large, can happily suspend disbelief at will. They can know Santa is make-believe but fully enter into the spirit of it.

I feel like she's gone off the rails a bit recently. Her work around sleep especially really spoke to me when I had tiny babies but her pre teen stuff is like living in another world.

I feel like a lot of it expects mothers to be doing 100 per cent of the parenting and also doesn't really factor in FT working mums.

It's basically unrealistic aspirational parenting now, rather than helping struggling parents feel heard and supporting them. I guess there's much more money in that. Aspiration sells.

I think Santa's lovely as a fun make-believe game. What I don't get is the dogma of 'the magic' and the insistence that this can only be created and preserved by actual, literal belief in Santa and that it dies when that belief isn't present. It makes something that's supposed to be beautiful and fun ridiculously high-stakes.

When my DC’s were teenagers someone at work was spouting these views, so I went home and asked teenagers what they thought about us ‘lying’ to them when they were younger.
They thought it was absolutely hilarious. Apparently they kept up the pretence that they believed in Santa for several years as the best way to get more presents.