"Trans people should not be allowed to use women’s showers and changing rooms, proposed NHS guidance says" - Darlington Nurses draft new guidance.

@NonPlayerCharacter agreed!

That’s hate. Not hare 🥴

If we look at available figures proportionally and obviously we don’t have all attack / hate crime figures for everyone However

There are 48,000 transwomen ( last census )
There are 68.35 million population so let’s assume 34million men

There were 4732 hare crimes against transpeople ( 2023 )
There were 46 sex crimes including rape committed by transwomen ( recent data UK Govn, there’s no data for hate crimes committed )

Calculating the proportion of crimes against transwomen by the number of males or half the pop
= 1crime committed for every 7340 men.

Calculate the proportion of crimes ( we only have figures for sex crimes though ) committed by transwomen by the number of transwomen in the population
= 1 crime committed for every 1043 transwomen

Both these stats are on the increase.
Shocking isn’t it!

Nope. Men who identify as women will continue to use the space for women because that is what they believe they are.

They can be called out for it. They would be under no illusion that most women were happy with them using it, if women felt free to speak up. At the moment, people tell these males they are welcome, even put up snidely little posters telling you to mind your own business.

Plus, if it is a workplace or they are a known regular in a location, they can be told not to use the women's facilities. Yes some men would still breach this, but as pp said, at least they would stand out as in the wrong.

It's not only about crimes and danger to women although that is hugely important. A large number of women don't want to share changing rooms with men, there is a reason they are separate. To me a man who feels he is a woman is still a man, a man who feels he is a woman to the extent that he wishes to remove his penis is still a man. I have compassion for him, but I still don't want to share the showers with a man no matter how he identifies. And I don't believe that his feeling that he is a woman outweighs my feeling (and biological reality) that he is a man.

I'm not humouring it at all, I'm just trying to phrase it in a way so that I don't get deleted. If that person has a DSD then I'm a banana.

@NonPlayerCharacter I wouldn't even bother humouring their claim. She allegedly has a child so the chances of her actually having a DSD are vanishingly rare. Not impossible, but unlikely.

Duebug

...the assault rate for cis men attacks on trans women are absolutely horrendous...

Would you care to quote some of these statistics? Or are you following Tatchel's lead with: "As we all know..." ?

Thanks for that list MrBungle
very telling

Thankyou
So perhaps campaign within your community for those third spaces as women are already doing this
Then
Job done

If you were a member of the DSD community, you'd have a good guess at who I follow and read, and you'd know what they say. You also wouldn't so blatantly try to conflate the DSD community with the trans community as you do with your "me and transgender folk don’t have to feel like we’re making you uncomfortable with our presence" nonsense. That's one way you give yourself away, by the way. Another one was when you shoehorned "spectrum" into discussing DSDs. That's a dog whistle for people who want to suggest that DSDs prove sex isn't binary. In fact, they prove that it is. Every DSD occurs in either a male or female body. That is literally how you know it's a DSD, and which DSD it is.

But I'm not asking for your personal information. It will be obvious to anyone who does even a small bit of research that you do not know what you're talking about.

But despite your plain and painful attempt to deflect by turning this into a discussion about how you don't have to give your credentials, it doesn't matter. Nobody actually cares what sex you are. The point is, people with DSDs, even if they just LOVED being dragged into this debate all the time and described as not fully male or female, even if they were prominently asking to be referred to as intersex, whatever... would still all be male or female and would not disprove the binary nature of sex in humans. As anyone who has a DSD knows, each DSD is unique to one sex or the other. They are variations off the standard male or female pathway. A person with the DSD 46 XY 5-ARD doesn't lack a uterus because of it; he lacks a uterus because he's male. His testes are internal and his penis smaller than usual because he is male and has a male line DSD

Go forth with your new knowledge, little grasshopper. Stop conflating DSDs with transgenderism, stop spreading misinformation about biology and stop trying to get men into showers with women and little girls.

Goodness, you can see from that list what frail, misunderstood, vulnerable folk those transwomen are. We should all be ashamed of denying them their rightful places in our toilets, changing rooms, refuges, hospital wards, prisons and all the other places we are trying to ban them from. Isn’t it obvious that they need exposure to the gentling effects of being with natal women to tame their violent natures, teach them better make up skills, how to queue in womens toilets,how to be humble and grateful, and probably teach them how to knit and crochet too because we is goddesses.

Damn these transphobes!

Humbug!

Trans men don't push for access to men's spaces because as women, they innately know they'd be at risk in those spaces.

They don't push for it because they don't need to. There doesn't seem to be any objections to them accessing male facilities. In fact, they are entirely removed from the trans debate. And it always grates on me because I don't think women who advocate for female spaces being used on the basis of the DNA actually honestly would accept someone who looks male accessing their spaces. So I can only conclude that anti-trans agenda is really largely anti-men agenda. So why not call it what it is...

These men don’t WANT third spaces and refuse to use them. They explicitly want to violate women’s spaces

Some people don’t like the word ‘women’ being used.
Sometimes people are referring to all transpeople

Am I the only person who finds the use of "transperson" frustrating? Why not say "transwomen"?

Because I've never once seen transmen pushing for access to male sex spaces.

Nor have I ever seen anyone say they have a problem with a biological female using a female space.

I’d like Father Christmas to climb down my chimney 🎁

Guess they’ll end up in court asap then

For Christmas I’d like all the silly transphobes to be quiet for just one day 🔔

Which is why any smaller new builds now have to provide unisex enclosed spaces with lockable doors.
and hopefully lots of cleaners