Caused a scene in a cafe today. Now wondering if we were unreasonable

100% this. Address the issue and make the point. It eacalated and got uncomfortable because you asked to speak to the manager.

Or when she told you to get the sauces at the till you should have spoken to her in Welsh then.

I agree with this. I'm sorry those people were so rude op! I think you handled it quite well. If I could speak Welsh, I'd have been tempted to ask for the manager in Welsh and watched her face drop.

We visit North Wales quite frequently and have never experienced anything negative as English people. Can you name the cafe, I'd quite like to keep my positive experiences in Wales and avoid this awful place.

I’d leave a review on Trip Advisor. I’ve never heard of charging for sauces.

Here’s an interesting article about the myth that people speaking Welsh in pubs switch to Welsh when English people walk in.

https://nation.cymru/opinion/welsh-speakers-switch-english-walk-into-pub/

Lle ar Ynys Mon oedd yr caffi? Ag ydw, dwi yn meddwl fod yna parch i siarad yr iaith pan dyna be mae’r pobol lleol yn siarad. Yn enwedig pan allwch chi siarad yr iaith eich hun.

I think that you have shown more disrespect than the other way around to be honest. I would think if you’re a Welsh speaker born and bred they knew you could understand them. Unless you know how to put on a particular good English accent.

Whilst this woman was incredibly rude op and I’m sorry you experienced that, I do think it’s a shame this thread has turned into a north wales bashing thread. Like in every country, there will be some knob heads. But plenty of people in north wales are welcoming and friendly. Yes they will speak Welsh in their own country (they’re not usually ‘switching’ but actually carrying on speaking in their own language). But it’s not usually to be offensive, it’s just the native language for many especially towards the west. I’m Welsh but don’t sound it and have never had any issue on the many many times I have headed west with my English accent.

What context justifies prejudice exactly? How does that sort of free pass ever get us to cohesive, high trust societies?

It doesn't seem like there was any point in talking to the manager either.

ive always had really positive experiences in Wales, lovely place & lovely people. I always thought English people wanging on about had badly they're treated was a bit of an urban legend type thing.

but I forget my NZ accent is still very noticeable despite having been born in England, now living 3 miles from where I was born & lived away from NZ (although not here for all that time)20 years. It's a negative more than a positive, but looks like it's a benefit in Wales!

What's the name of the cafe @pennytoffees ?

Why would they if English comes more naturally? There are still way more people in Wales who speak English as a first language than the other way round.

I've known Americans who referred to themselves as 'colonials' when talking to me. They seemed to think that was how the British saw them. Very strange.

To get to the ferry!

If you live in NW England, why would you drive through Wales without stopping? Also, how do you know if someone switches languages as you walk into a place? You must have amazing hearing to hear through doors and walls, plus these bilingual people must be fantastic at identifying someone’s language / nationality as they enter a building.

We are not Welsh but have lived in North Wales for nearly 11 years... Have found the people incredibly welcoming and friendly(aside from the odd exceptions but you get those everywhere!)

This is just poor customer service pure and simple! Deserves to be called out on it!

Is this common in north wales? It's weird but I'm almost glad to hear it's not just us. Went to a pub in snowdonia and were told by the owner that they weren't serving lunch. We sat down anyway to have a drink at least. We then noticed that everyone around us was having lunch, being served lunch or having their lunch order taken. We thought we must have misunderstood the owner as the waitress said they were still doing lunch. While she was taking our lunch order the owner stomped over to our table yelling that he had already told us that they won't serve us lunch. I remember the poor waitress looking really confused and mortified.

The bnb owners were a bit strange as well. They had signs at reception that clearly said that they had a reception room for common use and we could dry our boots there but when we did just that they complained and told us not to.

I normally get very upset at racist behaviour but I guess the scenery in snowdonia kind of made up for it...

Forget to say that we are not white. My post probably doesn't make much sense without that.

What a horrible woman! I think you were right to do what you did. You should've made the complaint in Welsh!

I've always fancied going to Wales, it looks as if there are some lovely places, but I have heard accounts of this kind of unwelcoming behaviour towards tourists in Wales several times TBH.

A lovely woman I used to work with once told me her family had to relocate to Wales with her husband's job when her kids were small. She said the practically the whole village actively shunned them regardless of any attempts to integrate. Said it was the most miserable year of her life. She came from a village herself, so knew there is sometimes a bit of insularity about incomers but it was next level. It was 30 years ago so maybe it's better now.

Do you think it's to do with second homes being bought up and AirBnBs mopping up all the properties?

I would have started talking to her and the other table, in Welsh. I would have said (in Welsh) "oh yes, you can't trust any of these out of towners can you? Sometimes they even understand the lingo!"

and laughed it off

ODFOD

A sporting event and a long weekend hardly qualify you to write off a country! Would you agree with someone who said this about your country, on the basis of two visits?!

What was the member of staff saying about you?

You did the right thing OP you did nothing wrong in the first place to warrant being talked about and very unprofessional as you said if she had of explained it costs money you could have paid at the end of the meal but used them there and then so food didn't go cold. Very rude staff id be sure to leave a bad review aswell