Putting our baby into nursery at 12 - 13 months. Attachment style outcomes??

Reading this thread I honestly think so much of this overthinking and fretting accounts for why so many young people now lack resilience and confidence. Just be the best mother you can be without worrying about all the tiny details and labelling everything. It’s really not necessary and will only hinder the child! Children need to learn to overcome small difficulties as children so they do not find small or large difficulties in adulthood insurmountable.

At 1 it's not possible to be 'overly attached' to your primary care giver. What absolute nonsense.

OP you know that the best place for your child to be is with you, or if not possible with someone they have a strong bond with. A really good childminder might be a better option - but you need to bear in mind it's going to be more difficult for them to build that bond if they're only with that person two intermittent days a week.

As for 'the past', children would have spent their time with their mum as women looked after the kids and men worked. Now women work because they want to or have to. You are working so you can't look after him so does it really matter what research shows or what the possible outcomes are? It just sounds like torturing yourself.

My daughter started at a Montessori at 13 months old, 3 days per week, and never gave me a back glance after goodbye. That bothered me as well, but I knew she'd be well looked after, ad the same staff had cared for my nephew 5 years prior.

Do you know anyone who has used the nursery? Does the baby have any time away from you now?

I don't think there has ever been an era before the last 50y, ever, in any part of the world, in any culture, any class, where a 3yo child could get so much 1-1 attention from their mum as they do now. Never, anywhere. There has always been either too much household work for the mum to do, too many siblings, or (in the case of wealthy families) governesses/tutors etc. In many cultures, the mum had to put the older generation first, too (eg serve the PILs before her children etc).

I'm not saying it's a bad thing that we entertain our kids so much. I love giving my kids 1-1 attention. I think they benefit, and I benefit.

But let's not pretend this was ever the norm. Let's not pretend there was some lovely The Past when kids had this as standard.

Other things that make "the past" irrelevant...family sizes were bigger (no reliable birth control). Older sisters were expected to be second mums. Total lack of household conveniences, meaning that many women were slaves to housework, or had actual slaves/servants. High infant mortality that was sadly accepted (eg in 19thC Britain, christenings happened within 3 days to try and get it done before the baby might die).

So much of the past is so irrelevant to modern parenting. It's madness to cherry pick bits of "the past" as a stick to beat modern mums with.

For example, I will never ever expect my dd1 to be a second mum to my ds2.

My mum was the oldest of 6 and basically raised her siblings. They also had no fridge growing up, let alone a washing machine. She was constantly beaten by her dad.

And yep, this was the era of the psychologists op evokes.

Don't give me "the past".

Unless you are with your child 100% of the time they will be scarred for life, despite the fact nearly all parents of young children work.

You need to both work full time to pay the bills, but also be at home full time with 100% attention on your child too.

Easy.

Surely in the past babies were constantly with mum.

Which past? Which culture, which class?

Stay at home mums, alone at home with washing machines and microwaves to do some of their housework, have been a tiny tiny portion of history. In much of history, a huge proportion of women (and mothers) were servants in other people's households. Also, if we're going to talk about "the past", what about wet nurses?

People bang on about "the past" without knowing much about it. Or only considering the richest proportion of society.

It's as silly as paleo diets.

Is that necessary at 12 months old though? Surely in the past babies were constantly with mum.

Taking a purist, attachment-theory-driven approach, it would be better to provide a single attachment figure, which nurseries can't do. You'd need to look for a nanny or childminder.

In terms of separation, it's important and healthy for children to learn to separate from their primary attachment figure in a supported way (naturally you know this, as a therapist) If your wee one hasn't yet had experience of spending time away from you, but with another loving adult, the transition to two days at nursery may come as a shock.

Thanks for that, but I was responding to a poster who claimed that she knew that poor childcare was linked to attachment issues from her own experience so I was asking her what her particular area of research was to make such a claim, I wasn't asking for research generally

ETA I skimmed that article and I don't think it refers to attachment anyway - which was the topic of this thread.

I'm not aware of any evidence that the mental health crisis in young people is caused by them having been to nursery/ childminder...

We can't do it all alone.

This is the heart of it.

There is very little support for families and two salaries are needed to function.

Therefore, even if it is not good for our children and babies (and I do not think it is), what choice do we have?

And don't come on saying you need to bloody save up and get a better a job, blah di blah. It is much bigger than that.

I wonder if all these mental health issues in kids is because of childcare?

it is a conversation that we cannot seem to have though.

This might help you.

Note in particular the data from the Quebec study.

criticalscience.medium.com/on-the-science-of-daycare-4d1ab4c2efb4

This such utter tosh. I've worked in early years for a very long time.

You can't be overly attached to a baby / toddler.
It's been proven that the thing that impacts children isn't too much love/ attachment but slightly neurotic anxious parenting - always stepping in when they don't need you/ helicopter parenting but even that is further down the line.

Please don't become less attatchment led with your child because of this it's the worst thing you could do.

At your LOs age it's totally normal to be mistrusting of new secondary caregivers.

The very worst scenario of this I've seen was only resolved by a change of key worker - I was new and the child bonded to me instantly. The manager tried to encourage the child to have a different key worker for their development but it always resulted in them being picked up.

What you can do ultimately depends on what you can do realistically with work etc.

Are you able to start off with shorter nursery sessions? And build them?

Can they take in a special item from home?

They're a bit young for visual timers but I'd definitely have one of those.

Set up leaving and arrival rituals.

Would nursery allow you to have a picture of their key worker at home so you can talk about them on non nursery days?

Also consider a childminder - a smaller home setting is easier for some children. They can have more attention and from their home to another home can feel very different to a nursery.

If I were you OP I'd look outside of mumsnet for up to date studies - check PubMed? While I'm sure there will be some helpful comments here, it's a personal, emotive topic and there are so many variables that I'm not sure how helpful others' experiences (and judgements) are in this instance.

As the original studies seem important to you, I'd suggest you perhaps pay close attention to how your child reacts when you arrive - at they consolable? As that was the original marker of secure attachment - not the absence of upset in the first place.

Also, Margot Sunderland talks about how when it was time to leave her children in childcare, she insisted on being present in the space until the child had made a connection with one of the caregivers, I'm not sure how many visits that took. If the nursery has a good understanding of attachment, you could ask if they have any suggestions on how you might all handle the transition. Good luck.

I know how nerve-wracking it can be to put our babies in nursery, especially when they become inconsolable when we leave.

It is totally possible, however, for them to develop strong, trusting bonds to nursery staff in our absence. The concept of "alloparenting" might be worth looking into. We can't do it all alone.

My son went to a childminder from nine months old. He never cried or seemed to miss me or his dad. He would go to various other childminders and baby sitters when his regular childminder was sick or on holiday and always coped well. He's now four and in a pre-school setting and has had no issues adapting to that change.

By contrast my nephew has been with his parents or grandparents his whole life and has only just started childcare beyond his family unit at 16 months. He is not a happy bunny when dropped off at nursery :(

Obviously this is anecdotal and all children are different but I do credit my son's confidence and trust in being separated from us with his early start at childcare.

It will be interesting to see if my daughter is the same when it's her turn to start childcare.

So despite your beliefs and knowledge basis, you’re still putting your needs above that of your child.
Two consecutive days will be far less unsettling than split days. All the theories in the world are pointless when real life gets in the way - work commitments, finances, AWOL mothers, stressed carers, PND. Most parents just have to get on with things as best they can and try not to dwell on what they cannot change.
Don’t overthink it.

@BefuddledCrumble
thanks and enjoy 😀

The thing is, research can be conflicting, studies can be carried out on social groups and in contexts which bear no relation to the lived experience of the individual... and as has been shown, research can be overturned by more recent research.

For example, I don't need research showing nursery enhances life chances for deprived children in poor areas of New York to convince me that nursery is 'better'. Nor do I need some developmental psychologist from the 1960s telling me it's best for mum to around 24/7 for the first 3 years of each of my children's lives.

We all know our own children best. There may be some children who because of their personality type, or neurological makeup won't settle in childcare without major trauma. Most children, with good quality care, will. The timing of when they start being left may influence how long it will take for them to settle, but the vast majority will.

Attachment is about how parents behave when they are with them so they are happy to see you when you comeback rather than afraid. Nursery is great for social skills which are more vital than education for career

I chose a child minder because I wanted strong attachment with one person in a home environment where popping to the post office, the bank, the shop, etc. were part of daily life. I was trying to replicate what would've happened if my DC were at home with me.

Nursery at 3 years old has a stronger research base.

I'm not likely to be taking the "education" of anyone who mixes attachment theory (a valid psychological theory but with some fair criticisms) and attachment parenting (something a pair of fundamentalist Christians made up to push their "traditional" agenda and sell a lot of books) together. They aren't related to each other and there is no evidence that attachment parenting creates securely attached children.

@Artistbythewater in your opinion. Which is only relevant for your own children.

FWIW I think my (now adult) children would have grown up equally as happy and well adjusted if I'd given up work and been a SAHM. It's not necessarily about one way being 'better.' As it was, they've grown up into happy well adjusted adults who spend some time in their early years at nursery.

I'll leave it now as it is tedious for others to read two people bickering back and forth on a thread, plus I'm not even sure what your rambling replies are trying to say at this point.

Did you miss that I was one of those mothers being 'patted on the back?'. Was I dismissing myself, or just sharing my own personal experience? Shocking that a teacher thinks a single anecdote is equal to a population wide dismissal.

Nevermind, I forgot the number one rule of the Internet.