To be fed up of having to work Christmas because I don't have children

not every company allows people to apply for Christmas leave so early, and because it's christmas also don't allow a "first come first served" especially if they provide 24/7 cover.

And i do have sympathy with the Tuesday thing - I'm conflicted on that. But i firmly believe that NOBODY should be working on all 3 days. Ideally one of the 3, potentially 2 of the 3, but not all 3.

In OPs place i would point out the utterly discriminatory nature of being told she is working all the 3 days because she doesn't have children. Then go onto how unfair it is for anyone to be doing all 3, and that it would be better and lead to a more harmonious workplace if the 3 days were divided fairly. (with OP knowing that if she insists on having Christmas Eve off as a Tuesday, she may end up with the other 2 anyway)

But the "you don't have kids and are therefore working" needs to be addressed.

I work in retail, luckily it's always closed on Christmas Day so it's never a worry, but I've worked Boxing Day and Christmas Eve loads of times since becoming a mum, if it lands on my scheduled day I just do it, when the Christmas over time sheets come out, I always just say none wanted and hand it back, as do a lot of other people child free or not, we all have our reasons, but there are plenty of others who for their own reasons want to snap up as much over time as possible so it works. That being said, I'll happily cover a young/ single person (or anybody's for that matters) shift at New Year's Eve or New Year's Day, because I have no desire to go out, so I'll happily work

Little children and babies wont know the difference whether it's celebrated on the 25th or the 27th.

And you have no idea about my life and experiences. But let’s be careful that’s in employment we don’t start making decisions based purely on individual situations and some kind of gauge of who deserves time off more. That’s way leads straight to discrimination.

They did know that, sure! But they also seem to have got their requests in before OP and had them granted, so that OPs own fault.

I would be raising it. You shouldn’t be working both days. You still have family just not children. I’m sorry they haven’t been understanding.

No, nobody has to cover the shift of someone who has a dying relative or who is struggling with their health. It's called compassion and empathy. We were all children once and understand how extra special this time of year is for little ones. I'm sure we would all have appreciated it if we were able to enjoy those early Christmases with our parents. It's not about giving the adults extra privileges because they're parents but it's about wanting to support children having a lovely Christmas.

Well thanks!! I will take that fabulousness badge! How kind! Though actually there is nothing fabulous about me. My post was not meant as some sort of self congratulations or boast. It's simply my opinion and it's ok for me to hold that opinion without others judging me as something I'm not (ie. Self important or virtue signalling as you seem to be implying).

You have no idea of my experiences and personal life story so I don't think you can comment on what my experiences are and are not and assume you know best. We are all entitled to our opinions. My opinion simply differs from yours! That's ok you know..

Why should she ask for leave for her day off?!!

It would not be HER fault. Surely the person knew the job requirements when they joined. She is not responsible for anyone else but her self and she has a right to go to HR and stick up for her rights.

I was once the holiday approver in a role.i.jad ages ago! but luckily in that particular job I was able to grant everyone's leave! which was lovely!

(I personally think though, OP could have avoided all this if she had simply applied for Christmas leave back in august. Maybe this is a learning curve for her? If you don't ask until its too late, you only have yourself to blame really. Next year she should apply in August and explain she worked Christmas this year so wants next year off. Her manager in such circumstances is likely to then grant the leave).

This is terrible you experienced this in the NHS!

They clearly know that Christmas was a possibility when they took the job, when they got pregnant and when they had kids, These are ADULTS who knew what they were doing, THEY are the reason that they might not see their kids, not me.

They are responsible, not me.

Thankfully we have robust employment legislation which protects all employees equally and doesn’t give a priority to those with children. No one has to provide a reason as to why they want to have time off work.

One of the main issues that stood out to me in the OP was the fact she was told she HAD to work Christmas because she didn’t have a child. Her specific circumstances weren’t looked at nor was her input sought. She was just told childless = working Christmas and that’s the way it is. And that’s wrong. That is the point many pp have made.

If I was in that kind of workplace where it was taken for granted that I’d pick up the slack at Christmas because I don’t have kids , and it was basically mandated I’d not be happy doing it either!

If people act entitled and demand you work Christmas off as a non-parent , it’s hardly going to generate goodwill and team spirit.

It’s also massively cruel in many circumstances such as with the OP who had miscarriages and so far has been able to conceive. How can you not see that?

Thankfully that’s not the case in my work, so as I said I’m always happy to step up where necessary as long as I don’t have travel plans because I work with decent people who don’t throw their parent status in others faces.

You keep saying “newborn” as I think you like to make it sound more emotive.. I would say a newborn is only up to 3 months old or so. So presumably they are not long back from maternity leave and therefore probably had last Christmas off.

We get it, you are a fabulous person talking about what you would do in a situation you clearly will never be in. Maybe listen to the many of us that ARE in these situation and our experiences.

Well I agree it should go both ways. And yes, the colleagues should reciprocate the kindness.

I'm so sorry, that is absolutely unacceptable. I have young kids but would never think I am more worthy of having Christmas off than people who don't have any.

I hope you aren’t the holiday approver in your workplace - you’d be sinking under grievances!

Any more guilt trips you want to lay on? We get it, you have a child and feel that's the most important thing. But that's you.

I do work in a 24/7 job and luckily my colleagues have a more benevolent attitude to Christmas duties, regardless of who has children and who doesn't.

How do you propose someone travel 300 miles on Christmas day also also be available for work?

'Not having children' is not a protected characteristic, so while it may not be morally fair (to some), it is not legally discrimination in and of itself.

If two employees worked at the same place in the same team for 10 years, one with kids and one without, you would obviously expect there to be some give and take it both wanted it off.

No - the employee books time off work in the same way as anyone in the organisation.

Like I said. If you are happy to let someone miss out on a first Christmas with their newborn, or for children to miss out on having Christmas with mum like they did last year because they were at dads, then fine! Crack on. It's your 'right'. I'm just saying I couldn't enjoy my day if this were me and I caused my colleagues to miss out.

This is one of the reasons I left the NHS. Also weekend cover, every Saturday night and Sunday morning there’d be me and my gay colleague bonding over the assumption that we had nothing in our lives outside of work.
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I didn’t have the painful history you have either OP, but any time anyone said anything along the lines of it being fine because I had no children, I felt angry on behalf of those for whom that is a great sadness. I’m sorry your manager is such an insensitive arse. It does sound like an HR issue.