Exhausted with current situation - money issue

@Artistbythewater Thing is the OP has got options - the problem is I think they've backed themselves into a bit of a corner and probably are reluctant to admit it's not the dream they envisaged - a house is just a house - if it's the house I think it is it was pretty nice anyway , but probably not minty fresh - I would either be letting it out for a couple of years ( I think they would get enough to cover mortgage- just) and renting somewhere a bit more compact and a bit cheaper - maybe around £1000 a month cheaper or selling it and buying somewhere for £300.000 less to bring the mortgage down- in good nick and warm and cosy!! They don't have to move anywhere they see as crappy, just downgrade the house a bit.

What a joke of a thread. A six bedroom house in London is absolutely astronomical. I can’t believe she has the auacity to come on here and complain it is cold. Of course it is - unless you are a multi millionaire you won’t be able to afford to run a house of that size in central London on drs salaries! Or similar.

Yep. Op just needs to look at what they have and use it .g rent a floor out or realise equity. Op does not need to live in 6 beds house! She wants to. She knew it needed eg insulation and good heating. She has space for a nanny. Etcetc

@Dreambow
thanks to the snoopers on here - I have seen the floor plans for your house 😅

lucky you!! That is not a “slightly nicer than3 bed semi house” 😅😅😅 it’s bloody massive !!!! and you have options for self contained units (our house is 5 bed 2000sq ft but does not have this flexibility at all!! )
our mortgage is prob about 300k less though

At 1000sqft per floor and 4 floors I would 💯 make a 2 bed self contained unit in the bottom and rent it out.
it already has kitchen and bathroom even if you need to throw a few o at it you’d make it back.

You’d get 1.5k pm or thereabouts in zone 3 with zero impact on family life.
ie you wouldn’t have to actually share any part of your home with a stranger

this seems like a no brainer even with tax it would pay all the bills and prob fund a small holiday annually

as a second cost reduction id look at a live in nanny.
you can offer acccomodation which would radically reduce childcare bill.

you need to leverage your assets.

have a think...
you could do it for 5 years or so then review

A doctor can afford to live in London. Just not necessarily in a 4 storey 6 bedroom house.

I don’t think that’s what they are saying. The OP’s or husband’s salary is well over £120k, plus the spousal salary. If the OP is on mat leave then it must be the husband as otherwise they would use the tax free childcare. The OP must be earning near that amount too, so you’re looking at £200k household income at least. It’s totally affordable to live in London on that salary. I have friends living in Z3, in 3/4 bed houses with 2-3 children on much less than that.

I think people are saying that they overstretched themselves and didn’t have any contingency for mortgage rate rises (something your mortgage company quizzes you about when you take out the mortgage!), and they can still live in London, but they just need to adjust their expectations and live to their means. For example a 4-bed townhouse in Highgate is lovely, but if you’ve no funds for holidays, treats, etc., you can move to a 3-bed in Wood Green with a similar commute and have some contingency and a bit more fun in your life than scrimping.

I’m finding all the people saying that the OP should move out of London and either work elsewhere or commute in.

If a doctor cannot afford to live and work in London then God help us. London needs doctors

@nationalsausagefund I think that's exactly the case- as I said below I think there is a realisation that the master plan has turned out to be somewhat of a money pit that doesn't work with young kids. I blame all those 'look what we did' homes in the design and home mags whilst often failing to say that Jasmine inherited a million and they still have a moderate sized mortgage plus the money on top to 'do up'

Following others’ nosiness I went and peeked at the house and old threads. I can see it’s a shock to go from “Devol kitchen or not?” and “six en-suites or a big bathroom?” to suddenly needing to absorb £2,000 a month in costs with nothing to show for it.

We’re also in a (more modest!) fixer-upper, with small children, and it is hell not being able to make a house a home while also working round the clock and it all going on mortgage and bills that didn’t exist a few years ago.

I don't agree with calls to move out of London – that brings its own set of lifestyle changes and problems. We’ve got a nice house and neighbourhood but the local swimming pool is closing and so are all the public toilets because of funding cuts! DP still commutes to London which comes at a financial cost and impacts on my ability to work. You’d swap one difficult situation for another. Whereas staying put, you just need to weather the nursery years.

I think it’s a choice between: weather the nursery years and when you emerge from them, make more budget-conscious choices with the house – a glammed-up Ikea kitchen instead of a keeping-up-with-the-Joneses Devol, so you’ve got money to stick in the rainy day fund for the next cost of living rise (because this shit is only going to bite harder as climate change impacts the world). Or, you sell up the mega reno double-fronted dream house and even with small equity and stamp duty, you’d easily find a suitable semi in London. You just have to let go of the idea that you’re Devol people. You could get a 4-bed Edwardian semi in Sydenham near the excellent park for £800k. If you choose to stay and weather the storm, stop trying to tackle the whole house – close off the top floor, use the hairdryer plastic stuff on the windows to improve insulation, blast the heating with impunity and get a lodger in to cope with the costs, accept that you’ll be working extra hours until nursery years are over – with the payoff of an amazing investment house that will only appreciate. Or sell up and get a still wonderful house that most people could only dream of.

I think a large part of this is grief and hormones and winter: you’ve got a small baby and it’s November, everything sucks, and you’re paying out £2k without anything to show for it. It might be a “rich person problem” which is why you’re getting some stick, but you’re allowed to be gutted that last year’s Devol dreams are now “fuck, I can’t turn the heating on, let alone think about Farrow & Balling the door”. But do consider whether you want to hunker down and be miserable in this big house that’s no longer a dream, or jump ship and enjoy your babies while they’re small by finding another dream house that’s still out of a lot of people’s leagues.

I would sit down with your DH and have a go over your finances to see if moving or one or both of you going down to PT would actually make you better off

Find a childminder - much cheaper than nursery and often more flexible.

@TwigletsAndRadishes yep I think you have nailed the situation-personally my view is it's just a house - and I wouldn't be having a shitty life just to fulfill some 'master plan'

It isn't totally the col in OPs case, it's partly poor decision making - why have 2 kids that close too if nursery costs are a huge issue -

I think the OP ( who I'm sure is a really nice person) bought into the you too can have it all- huge London house, great career, several kids without realising this is incredibly hard to do without a large wodge of spare cash in the background that isn't for a doer upper

I get the impression the OP bought at the peak of the market in the COVID and post-COVID delirium, has maxed out on mortgage and maxed out on ambitious renovation plans at a time when builders could basically name their price and you'd have no choice but pay it. She's now feeling the pinch with mortgage rate increases she didn't anticipate or leave a contingency for. She's reluctant to sell at the moment as she won't see the huge profit that was all part of the master plan to allow them to move out of London with a massive wad of cash to put down on their forever home somewhere they can have chickens, an Aga, a Land Rover and a very small mortgage by the time they are in their early 40s.

But that's the property market for you. A giant game of snakes and ladders where timing and luck is everything. Those who don't need to sell at a bad time won't. They will bide their time and ride out any downturns. Those who have no choice but sell because they can't stay afloat will often end up losing money or just breaking even if they are lucky, but at least they are out of the doom loop and can sleep at night.

The OP and her husband are in a far, far better position than most. I get that she's feeling burnt out and frustrated and worried, but there is no magic solution that gives her everything she wants. An easier day to day life, more disposable income, being able to put the heating on and not worry, and hanging in there for the big fat profit on their doer-upper, which by the sounds of things they can't afford to finish, or it's finished but they can barely afford to live in it or heat it.

OP it's time to get real I'm afraid. If your current situation is not sustainable financially or mentally, you need to do something drastic to change it. Sell up and downsize (financially at least) for a better work/life balance and some peace of mind. Or, if you can grit your teeth and get through a few more years of hardship then it will hopefully all pay off. But it has to be one or the other. You can't have both.

OP I’m curious to know what changed between buying your home almost 5 years ago with the plan of it being a 5 year house before moving out of London to now not being able to move out?

Honestly I think all childcare that is used for the sole purpose of having to work should be deductable from gross earnings. Otherwise its a massive disincentive to work (and therefore pay tax).

Years ago (when in a better paid job than now) I calculated that once I took into account the tax and childcare costs for several children I would be no better off working five days than four.

The subsidised childcare comment was in relation to me saying that some of the big nhs hospitals in London have associated nurseries.

Some offer a discount to staff and as the childcare is offered by your employer you are allowed to pay from your gross wages meaning a huge saving if you are in a higher tax band.

@Dreambow one of the targets of being educated and earning well is to be able yo afford choice. It sounds as though you feel you are stuck in your situation with no joy in life.
Life with young kids IS hard anf temporary. You have to decide if you can tough it out in your situation.

I don't understand why living outside London needs to mean a 1.5 hr commute. My DH can get to work quicker when we lived in Kent than West London and he finds the overground less draining than the underground.
I also don't understand why your commute is easier from London than from outside.

Have you thought if renting your place out and renting somewhere cheaper for a while? It doesn't necessarily need to mean an increase in commuting costs.

Move to a surburban part of London. We are in zone 4. Close to the tube-Kings X in 25 mins

Get a substantive post and work this part time. Being a doctor in the NHS is hard. Find a role that works for you and affords you some protection. Pension/salary sacrifice schemes/maternity pay.

You may need to start with more PAs then drop these in time. DH is now doing NHS work 3 days/week. He started off doing 4.5 days As a consultant 8+ yrs ago.

Do private practice. If you are a consultant this is the best way to increase income. Your current situation is clearly not working and something has to change. GL

Yup - neither above £100k. And it’s applied badly, so two earners each on £99999 - fine; one earner on £100,001 one SAHM - nothing for you, soz. If you’re near the threshold you can fiddle with pensions etc to get under it but it sounds like that’s not where OP is.

I think I just read that you hadn't heard of subsidised childcare? Sorry don't have time to read the whole thread, but if it hasn't been said, get yourself a government childcare account (I think you'd be eligible) which gives tax free childcare (up to £2000 gov contribution per year). Also in England (assuming your nursery does funded places) you should be able to claim 15 hours from age 2.

@NettieHead the latter has an income cap of c,£100k, above which you only receive 15 hours at age 3, and I think the former is disapplied altogether at that earning level.

I think I just read that you hadn't heard of subsidised childcare? Sorry don't have time to read the whole thread, but if it hasn't been said, get yourself a government childcare account (I think you'd be eligible) which gives tax free childcare (up to £2000 gov contribution per year). Also in England (assuming your nursery does funded places) you should be able to claim 15 hours from age 2.

Good luck! We're not in London, so the numbers are all round lower, but feel the same. There is nothing left at the end of each month. Counting down the days to when our youngest turns 3 and gets their 30 hours funded.

If you pay extra into pensions, could you get the government help with anything?

Or could you use an aupair instead of nursery?

Or condense husbands hours into 4 days, so you can save a day at nursery?

Perhaps air BnB a spare room in warmer months?

Sorry I posted before I saw that your husband cannot work outside of London. I also think you should move to Scotland 😂

So yeh down size or live on one floor rent out the other floors.
There are ways around if you have a massive house to make more money

I get it OP. I am not in your position exactly as our finances have got better this year as both our kids are now over 3 meaning our childcare bill has dropped significantly (from £800 per month for three days to £100 for the same, we are in Scotland). Our mortgage will rise next year though once our fixed term is up. 😭

It sounds like you have two choices. 1. Keep on swimming, try not to burn out and see the light at the end of the tunnel (the childcare costs will eventually come down even if nothing else eases). 2. Do something drastic like move to a cheaper part of the country and also move jobs, overhaul the whole situation.

We deliberately live a bit below our means e.g could have stretched ourselves to a house but purchased a flat instead with no intention of moving. We also moved to live closer to work (appreciate this not always possible for people). We are still two professionals who are wondering where the money goes though. It's crap.