To be Concerned about husband's reaction to Xmas planning making it about race

He doesn’t give you the same grace though—does he? So this “its all about intent” is just bullshit. You really are under the thumb of a very manipulative, nit nice, man. He basically holds you at a distance. He can say ir do any selfish thing and he excuses himself and shuts down discussion with “you are so sensitive! I didn’t mean to hurt you” but woe betide you if you express a reasoned/equitable plan like how you are going to handle post partum fairly or how you would like Christmas to be organized. Then you are a racist bitch with no sense of values.

Talk seriously with your own therapist about this. It is not going to get better. Maybe he flattered you and love bombed you when you were dating and for the first few years of marriage but the real him is come to stay now. The real him is selfish, misogynistic, lazy, proud, mean, and (yes) racist. He wants an easy life and he doesn’t care if yours is hard, or lonely, or frightening, or sad. His attitude is that if it didn’t happen to him it doesn’t matter.

I would never talk to family about this - they would just start to dislike him it's not worth it. They are very sensitive when it comes to race more so than me, and it would make my marriage difficult I believe.

They aren’t ‘very sensitive’, though, are they? They just don’t tolerate it, like most self respecting people. And they would encourage you to stop tolerating it. It would make your marriage more difficult because everyone would know your husband was a racist who treats you like shit. If you’re so embarrassed by your relationship that you can’t talk to anyone about it, surely that indicates you shouldn’t be in it?

I'm having counselling as I went through a low period partly our relationship as I have no one friends or family to discuss it with.

As above.

Yes I believe we will be together in four years but I am begging him to understand me better. I am not convinced he ever will

So, your relationship is awful. You’re literally begging him to understand you and you don’t think he will. He doesn’t respect or listen to you. He is racist. But you’re still going to be with him in four years. WHY?!

You can keep ignoring my comments, and others that say things you don’t want to engage with, but I know you’re reading them. I very much hope at least some of this is making you think.

Surely that's just the equivalent of saying I have black friends so I can't be racist.

Your H probably doesn't think he is racist and he may not have intended his comments to sound that way, but the fact is, he chose to make an issue about race when it wasn't really a factor. So subconsciously, he definitely holds some racist perspectives.

If he was open to actually listening, reflecting and learning, then it would probably be possible to get past this. Most of us have unconscious biases that we need to work through, and that's just part of being human. But instead of trying to become more aware of how his behaviour is affecting you - his pregnant wife! - he is just shutting the conversation down and refusing to engage.

As far as I'm concerned, white privilege is really about the luxury of never really having to think about race. When you choose to marry and have children with someone from a different race, you don't get to keep that privilege in quite the same way. Your H really needs to educate himself, but sadly, I'm not sure that he will.

You sound very unhappy, OP, and I fear that things are going to get much harder for you when your baby comes along. If you can get your H to go to couples counselling with you, that would be good. If not, I think you need to use your own counselling sessions to work through whether you really want to stay in a relationship with a man who doesn't appear to treat you with any respect or consideration.

I think you will be together and miserable as you continue to put up with being put down and treated like crap. Please don’t give up your job. Please don’t hide everything from your family so you have no support.

You say communication is about what the other person understands you to have said, otherwise you are talking to yourself. You don’t seem to care one bit about how what you say makes me feel, if that’s true why are you even here? Why don’t we just fuck off our separate ways? I tell you that phrase both upsets me and really pisses me off and your only focus is on telling me I’m wrong and too emotional. Fine, I’m too emotional- again why are you here??? If you don’t care how I feel we should not be here. My baby deserves better than a dad who says racist hurtful dismissive things to her/his mum.

We mix my partner’s family with our friends but mainly see my family just them. My family is bigger and my siblings have kids, there’s also a few badly behaved dogs in the mix - it’s chaos! I sometimes find them too much so adding in more people and different vibes seems unnecessary.

'I feel really sad, really sad, alone and quite depressed.'

what does your mother or sister say when you talk to them about this ?

why are you seeing a counsellor ?

do you think you will still be married to him in 4 years time ?

I bet he doesn’t. And if this was pointed out to him, he’d be furious and claim it was a racist question.

And OP would accept that response.

I don’t know how else to ask this…but why are you being so wet? You keep going on about how he said X, so that’s that. Or he thinks X, so there’s nothing to be done. Why are you so submissive? You are aware that you are an equal partner in this relationship, right? Or do you think that he’s your boss, somehow?

This man is saying and doing racist things, as are his family and friends. And you’re just taking it, and wringing your hands. Where is your agency, ffs?

He’s been having his way with pretty much everything, telling you he’s ‘logical’ and you’ve just sat there and taken it.

Now, you’ve been given advice. Books suggested for you to read. Books suggested for him to read. Resources. Numbers to call. You’re engaging with none of it. You just want to continue running around after this man, begging him to respect you.

He doesn't have any Asian or Black friends does he.
which is why he asked his white friend.

Well if what was said was not intentional then I can forgive. I wouldn't try to over analyze and interpret something else.

To make a relationship work;
Respect each other
Learn to forgive and forget if things are done without intention.
Don't sweat about small stuff
Be kind

When the child is born life will be more challenging.

If you are really unable to let things go and not understand your partner intentions after all this time is this relationship right for you?

Slightly off topic, but is White Christmas a racist song?

@anonymousxmasposter

You need to sit down and clear the air.
This is anxiety will just eat away at you.
Some people can over analyze everything .
It does them no good.

He should be talking to you not friends.

Are you happy?
Or is everything about the relationship a worry?

Can it be resolved.

Do it together.

He is not happy as he is reaching out to friends for their opinions on your relationship.

You are a couple who should be supporting and caring for each other.
Have your feelings for each other changed?

Obviously you have loyalties to your own familes but compromise is the answer. Compromise must be genuine and not bitter.

For what it is worth I never insisted on spending Xmas with my family nor my partner we just went and go with the flow.

It is usually my partner insisiting we visit my family. Im just like meh because i love them both.

And i can tell you as a family we were and are happier for it.
Some of the best parties or gatherings we had were when we had both.

The problems will.come up again and again
Birthdays, anniversary, Christmas , Easter.

Either suck it up or nip in the bud.
Counseling may help.

Rather than discussing this with you maturely and trying to understand your pov, he's asked his mate who agrees with him and used the opinion of said mate to shut you down. Looks like your DH hasn't matured beyond the age of 9.

I understand that you feel you've done what you can with your DH regarding this Christmas - but these problems will come up again and again as this is about the beliefs and behaviours of your intractable DH.

As the white parent of a mixed race child, I find it outrageous that he thinks he can just pass over any "race issues" for you to deal with as if it isn't his problem. The child will have two parents. He is being a total arse.

I also don't think he can just decide to shut down the discussion about his Christmas comments because he has decided that the matter is closed. Your feelings also matter!

I get that you won't want to walk away with a new baby due, but I would be insisting on some sort of couples counselling to try and work these issues through. His attitudes are unacceptable.